Vape Responsibly : Campaign

[BuGlen]

Introduction:

With the recent incidents involving advanced personal vaporizers (APVs, aka MODS) which have resulted in injury, I started to think about what I could do as a relatively new vaper to help. What I came up with was a basic outline of a campaign to help get the word out about device and battery safety. This concept is not what “they” can do (they being the manufactures / vendors / government) to make a difference, but what “we” can do as the vaping community.

Why is this important? With recent media coverage of APV / battery malfunction in both Florida and Colorado and the pending litigation, the method we’ve chosen to quit smoking and improve our lives is at greater risk of being eliminated as an industry. Many in the community understand that the vaping industry takes customers from BT (big tobacco companies) and BP (big pharmaceutical companies), and it’s likely just a matter of time before they come after it with all of their resources. These companies and their lobbies provide big funds to campaigns and get legislation in their favor in return. If these events that cause injury continue to occur, and grow in number, it will give those that seek to destroy the industry more power to do so.

Basic Campaign Goals:

• Be responsible when providing advice to potentially unknowledgeable people with regard to advanced devices and battery choices.
• Be diligent in insisting that vendors / manufactures provide the necessary safety information for their products.
• Get others involved in the campaign to help spread the word and educate as many as possible.

Initial Action Items:

Community: When you see someone on ECF giving advice to a newbie to just get "the latest and greatest" APV, without regard to the available safety information related to the product, step in. Constantly remind people that all battery operated devices require some care and a small amount of research will help to ensure they do not have one of these types of incidents. Most people giving advice here on ECF are very well meaning and are just trying to be helpful, but not everyone thinks carefully before they make recommendations.

Vendors: When you see a vendor that sells unprotected batteries, contact them and question why they choose to carry these inferior products as opposed to the protected variety and how they are provide safety literature. It is possible that the vendor is unaware of the issues that can happen with both unprotected and protected batteries, and what their liability might be. Also, if you see an eBay person / vendor selling what is advertised to be the best brands of batteries en mass at deep discounted prices, alert eBay and have them investigate.

Manufacturers: When you receive a new device from a vendor, read through all the available literature that comes with it. If you believe it to be insufficient with regard to safety, contact the manufacturer and ask them to consider updating it. Many devices come from countries where regulation may not be as strong, and therefore they may be unaware of the potential loss of sales in your country should your government decide their product is unsafe.

Conclusion:

As I’ve said, this is just the initial outline of the campaign and it desperately needs the contribution of others in the community who are concerned with safety and the survival of the industry. Please help by adding your thoughts on what we can do to make it work.

 

[kwalka]

BuGlen,
In a way I asked Roly about a similar type of thing. Except it was more along the lines of a study group type of thing. I think you will find it interesting.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...546-bma-e-cigarette-briefing.html#post5703985

 

[BuGlen]

BuGlen,
In a way I asked Roly about a similar type of thing. Except it was more along the lines of a study group type of thing. I think you will find it interesting.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...546-bma-e-cigarette-briefing.html#post5703985

Hi kwalka,

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that topic appears to concentrate on the health benefits, or harm reduction, if you prefer. That is a very good topic and I try to read all I can on the subject so I can educate others (so thank you for the link), but that topic/study is not really directly related to this campaign.

This campaign is about device / battery safety and the related issues, and what we as a community / consumer group can do to address those issues. It's a kind of proactive approach to a new issue that may cause great harm to the industry, which is different to the health related campaigns, even if they are somewhat politically aligned.

 

[kwalka]

Hi kwalka,

Correct me if I'm wrong, but that topic appears to concentrate on the health benefits, or harm reduction, if you prefer. That is a very good topic and I try to read all I can on the subject so I can educate others (so thank you for the link), but that topic/study is not really directly related to this campaign.

This campaign is about device / battery safety and the related issues, and what we as a community / consumer group can do to address those issues. It's a kind of proactive approach to a new issue that may cause great harm to the industry, which is different to the health related campaigns, even if they are somewhat politically aligned.

No, you are correct. My point in directing you there was I feel very strongly about the fact that we have the #s to have a voice that can be heard. When I presented that thought to him, and several others, that was the response I got.
I am prepared to dedicate some serious time to either of these issues. I just would like to know my time is not being wasted. However, if we/you help save 1 person from a catastrophic failure, then IMO, mission accompolished.

 

[BuGlen]

No, you are correct. My point in directing you there was I feel very strongly about the fact that we have the #s to have a voice that can be heard. When I presented that thought to him, and several others, that was the response I got.
I am prepared to dedicate some serious time to either of these issues. I just would like to know my time is not being wasted. However, if we/you help save 1 person from a catastrophic failure, then IMO, mission accompolished.

Outstanding, and thank you!

I think the biggest difference between the two topics is the support group(s) we need for each. For the health topic(s), we need the support of the medical community to back up any claims and the support of the non-vaping public to squelch the ideological voices. On the other hand, for the device / battery safety issues, we are the consumer group and we have the power to make some changes in the industry.

If you can think of anything to add to the campaign mission statement, I would very much appreciate your perspective.

 

[kwalka]

Outstanding, and thank you!

I think the biggest difference between the two topics is the support group(s) we need for each. For the health topic(s), we need the support of the medical community to back up any claims and the support of the non-vaping public to squelch the ideological voices. On the other hand, for the device / battery safety issues, we are the consumer group and we have the power to make some changes in the industry.

If you can think of anything to add to the campaign mission statement, I would very much appreciate your perspective.

I certainly have been, and will give this some thought. I will get back to you. I have some previous threads in mind that I will have to look up, and some members I will also contact that will have great contributions.
As far as I'm concerned were sort of wasting our power/voice by not getting it out there.

 

[bnrkwest]

So glad you started this BuGlen, I think we all as members of ECF have a responsibility to do our best for new vapers and educate even seasoned ones that have not covered all their bases on safety. Reaching the vendors is of huge importance so everyone that buys products receives full printed instructions for use, safety on using required batts/chargers that their unit requires and what to do incase of battery failure. This includes all models ego's, 808's, because I have seen 808's fail when juice gets in an unsealed batt (me) and people using ego's use the wrong charger. Really nothing should be charged off a computer in my opinion, they should all use usb chargers designed for that unit and use a wall usb charger. I think we can really make a difference. "Never underestimate the power of one" especially "one" united voice bnrk

 

[BuGlen]

So glad you started this BuGlen, I think we all as members of ECF have a responsibility to do our best for new vapers and educate even seasoned ones that have not covered all their bases on safety. Reaching the vendors is of huge importance so everyone that buys products receives full printed instructions for use, safety on using required batts/chargers that their unit requires and what to do incase of battery failure. This includes all models ego's, 808's, because I have seen 808's fail when juice gets in an unsealed batt (me) and people using ego's use the wrong charger. Really nothing should be charged off a computer in my opinion, they should all use usb chargers designed for that unit and use a wall usb charger. I think we can really make a difference. "Never underestimate the power of one" especially "one" united voice bnrk

Thanks brnk! It was inspiration by the reasonable posts by you, kwalka, and many others in the thread about the Colorado incident that got me thinking about this. Also, my first post in that thread was reactionary and when I had a chance to think about it, I realized that I should have been asking more questions rather than posting an uneducated opinion. Looking in a mirror can be a real b*tch sometimes.

As for charging from the computer, it depends, and again it comes down to adequate documentation and education. The USB 2.0 specification provides 5V regulated power at 500mA load, and has short circuit protection build into the circuit. It generally gets it power from the computer PSU, which needs to be very stable for the computer to operate. In short, I would say that if the charger requires less than or equal to 5V at 500mA, the computer is probably the most reliable and stable source. I tend to use my USB hub, but it's essentially the same concept.

 

[bnrkwest]

Thanks brnk! It was inspiration by the reasonable posts by you, kwalka, and many others in the thread about the Colorado incident that got me thinking about this. Also, my first post in that thread was reactionary and when I had a chance to think about it, I realized that I should have been asking more questions rather than posting an uneducated opinion. Looking in a mirror can be a real b*tch sometimes.

As for charging from the computer, it depends, and again it comes down to adequate documentation and education. The USB 2.0 specification provides 5V regulated power at 500mA load, and has short circuit protection build into the circuit. It generally gets it power from the computer PSU, which needs to be very stable for the computer to operate. In short, I would say that if the charger requires less than or equal to 5V at 500mA, the computer is probably the most reliable and stable source. I tend to use my USB hub, but it's essentially the same concept.

The problem I have with using the computer usb is it has melted motherboards, it happens and is a huge expense plus ruins both ecig and computer. Some of usb chargers are not correct for the ecig it is charging and cause problems, so just better safe than sorry I always say Let me find that link

I agree tho basically we have to support each other, we are all vaping for a reason, to get of analogs and get healthier. In the process we don't want peoples faces injured as that defeats the whole purpose of using ecigs. bnrk

 

[bnrkwest]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...63-ego-battery-explosion-video-aftermath.html

Ok here is one, ego explodes when charging on laptop. Need to find the other one. bnrk

 

[bnrkwest]

Here is another http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-issues/273146-ego-t-battery-exploded.html

There is still another about burning up a laptop. bnrk

 

[bnrkwest]

Another- http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ego-type-models/217880-exploding-ego-t-battery.html still searching for the mother board one! But you get the idea, these things do happen. I have an ego passthru but stopped using it on my laptop. Things get dangerous while charging. bnrk

 

[BuGlen]

The problem I have with using the computer usb is it has melted motherboards, it happens and is a huge expense plus ruins both ecig and computer. Some of usb chargers are not correct for the ecig it is charging and cause problems, so just better safe than sorry I always say Let me find that link

I agree tho basically we have to support each other, we are all vaping for a reason, to get of analogs and get healthier. In the process we don't want peoples faces injured as that defeats the whole purpose of using ecigs. bnrk

I'll concede to your point on the topic of using the computer USB port, because I've yet to see battery / charger documentation that states it's USB 2.0 (or 3.0) compatible. This is certainly another good point where product documentation could be improved. I do know that the USB 1.0 specification is almost certainly inadequate for battery charging. The USB hub I use has it's own power supply and is relatively cheap to replace (rather than a motherboard), so I'm fine with plugging in my pass-through while I'm at the computer if needed.

 

[bnrkwest]

I'll concede to your point on the topic of using the computer USB port, because I've yet to see battery / charger documentation that states it's USB 2.0 (or 3.0) compatible. This is certainly another good point where product documentation could be improved. I do know that the USB 1.0 specification is almost certainly inadequate for battery charging. The USB hub I use has it's own power supply and is relatively cheap to replace (rather than a motherboard), so I'm fine with plugging in my pass-through while I'm at the computer if needed.

That makes sense. bnrk

 

[bnrkwest]

Oh I am happy to report that vendor High Desert Ecigs has now posted the warning for rechargeable batteries on their webpage! bnrk

 

[kwalka]

In the Colorado thread someone mentioned creating an APV batt sticky.
I have been heavily involved in 4 or 5 threads in the past 3 days. So, I'm not sure where I said what. Yesterday was my 90th day smoke free. When I started, I bought a KR808 starter kit. It got me thru the first week or 2, but I knew if I was going to stick this out I was going to have to ramp it up. I got an eGo-T kit and was off to the races. Basically a couple of weeks into the eGo rush I got the "Vape Bug". At this point I knew nothing about batts except you stick them in and go, when they stop working you thread them into the charger and wait for green. I went to a reputable ECF vendor and bought a steel tube APV kit. The site said it took 3 diff batt combinations for 3 diff voltages. I purchased the other 2 batt combos and a second charger from the same site. I asked a rep if the second charger, being of much better quality, would charge all the batts I got. He said yes. Well it wasn't true. The batts that came w the kit were diff than the other 2 sets and needed the charger that came w the kit. Just by coincidence I asked another member a question about the multimeter I had just purchased, and he noticed that in the specs I listed that I was headed for trouble. He posted right away to never put said batts on the second charger as they will not play well or at all.
At this point, all the press about the Fl incident, and the fact that I was getting bad info from the vendor, made me step back and look at what I was really doing. I put the APV away, and spent days reading all the info I could find here and on Battery University. I was shocked at what was really in the making, once I got an education. I was stacking batts in a steel tube APV, with very insufficient venting, basically using a pipe bomb (Roly's term), without even a clue.
I have 4 kids under 12. So, to say the least I was peaved. I let the vendor have it!

I think there are a combination of things that need to happen here to keep this sort of thing from repeating itself. I think, as others mentioned, there has to be an insert in the APV itself. It needs to contain the do's and donts, and a link to a sticky here that starts off with the catastrophic no no's, and then links from there to everything I had to read to bring myself up to speed.
The problem is that half, if not most, wont take the time required to do all that. So it must be simplified somehow.
Other people said making APVs a certain shape, at least the batt slot, so they only take a specific shape. The prob there is batts aren't going to change shape.
Another said a circuit that can tell weather something is amiss. If we can create devices that can practically vape for us, we can make a chip that can do the aforementioned.

I felt it important that you get where I'm coming from with this. If someone such as myself with the time and presence of mind to recognize a dangerous situation, and then spend the time and money to get it right, can be put in a precarious position, we have a long way to go.

 

[bnrkwest]

Thank goodness Kwalka you did your homework! I basically had to do the same searching and searching for my Battery 101 self education course. It takes too much searching to find it all, so maybe we can post here all the necessary links so people can find things easier. I also found one post that I need to find again that is more technical about wrapping batteries so they don't short out inside the tube mod. This may also be something we need to investigate. I was also thinking of some drawings that might help people who do not like to research things, a picture can tell it all bnrk

 

[kwalka]

Thank goodness Kwalka you did your homework! I basically had to do the same searching and searching for my Battery 101 self education course. It takes too much searching to find it all, so maybe we can post here all the necessary links so people can find things easier. I also found one post that I need to find again that is more technical about wrapping batteries so they don't short out inside the tube mod. This may also be something we need to investigate. I was also thinking of some drawings that might help people who do not like to research things, a picture can tell it all bnrk

After days of reading I've never heard of wrapping batts, so I would have to agree w that.

 

[bnrkwest]

I came up with this warning pic using clip art, I think most people will get the message just from this simple pic and few warning words. Feel free to use it if anyone wants too. bnrk


edit- hmm that pic came out unclear for resolution, I may have to reduce it before posting.

 

[BuGlen]

View attachment 94315 I came up with this warning pic using clip art, I think most people will get the message just from this simple pic and few warning words. Feel free to use it if anyone wants too. bnrk


edit- hmm that pic came out unclear for resolution, I may have to reduce it before posting.

I agree that pictures illustrate better than words in many cases, and you're example gets that message through. Is this something you're thinking of posting in the forum in different threads, or maybe something that you could offer to vendors?