Vape Responsibly : Campaign

[BuGlen]

In the Colorado thread someone mentioned creating an APV batt sticky.
I have been heavily involved in 4 or 5 threads in the past 3 days. So, I'm not sure where I said what. Yesterday was my 90th day smoke free. When I started, I bought a KR808 starter kit. It got me thru the first week or 2, but I knew if I was going to stick this out I was going to have to ramp it up. I got an eGo-T kit and was off to the races. Basically a couple of weeks into the eGo rush I got the "vape Bug". At this point I knew nothing about batts except you stick them in and go, when they stop working you thread them into the charger and wait for green. I went to a reputable ECF vendor and bought a steel tube APV kit. The site said it took 3 diff batt combinations for 3 diff voltages. I purchased the other 2 batt combos and a second charger from the same site. I asked a rep if the second charger, being of much better quality, would charge all the batts I got. He said yes. Well it wasn't true. The batts that came w the kit were diff than the other 2 sets and needed the charger that came w the kit. Just by coincidence I asked another member a question about the multimeter I had just purchased, and he noticed that in the specs I listed that I was headed for trouble. He posted right away to never put said batts on the second charger as they will not play well or at all.
At this point, all the press about the Fl incident, and the fact that I was getting bad info from the vendor, made me step back and look at what I was really doing. I put the APV away, and spent days reading all the info I could find here and on Battery University. I was shocked at what was really in the making, once I got an education. I was stacking batts in a steel tube APV, with very insufficient venting, basically using a pipe bomb (Roly's term), without even a clue.
I have 4 kids under 12. So, to say the least I was peaved. I let the vendor have it!

I think there are a combination of things that need to happen here to keep this sort of thing from repeating itself. I think, as others mentioned, there has to be an insert in the APV itself. It needs to contain the do's and donts, and a link to a sticky here that starts off with the catastrophic no no's, and then links from there to everything I had to read to bring myself up to speed.
The problem is that half, if not most, wont take the time required to do all that. So it must be simplified somehow.
Other people said making APVs a certain shape, at least the batt slot, so they only take a specific shape. The prob there is batts aren't going to change shape.
Another said a circuit that can tell weather something is amiss. If we can create devices that can practically vape for us, we can make a chip that can do the aforementioned.

I felt it important that you get where I'm coming from with this. If someone such as myself with the time and presence of mind to recognize a dangerous situation, and then spend the time and money to get it right, can be put in a precarious position, we have a long way to go.

So, I'm guessing you can sincerely relate to the Colorado situation and the poor guy who suffered injury. It isn't hard to understand how the average technology consumer (the iPhone usesr for example) could easily get lost in all the tech speak and cross talk in these forums and the other online resources.

I completely agree with the insert idea, and I think that's a place where we can start to campaign manufacturers and vendors so that their customers have the information they need. The insert should contain information about which batteries should only be used in the device (not just a gentle recommendation) and the resistance range of carts / atties / clearos that can be used as well. If it's a VV device (like the Provari), it should also probably contain a grid for resistance value ranges at different settings for safe use. A single sheet of paper printed on both sides should give the user sufficient information to use most devices within the safety guidelines.

 

[bnrkwest]

I agree that pictures illustrate better than words in many cases, and you're example gets that message through. Is this something you're thinking of posting in the forum in different threads, or maybe something that you could offer to vendors?

Yes, anyone could use it or the idea to make another pic to get the point across. I just wanted to offer something that does make it clear to understand, wrong batts could mean disaster in wrong devise. I think it would be great to have vendors use something like this to get the message to new users. bnrk

 

[bnrkwest]

Here is another excellent post by Roly, everyone should read it. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...s/76078-exploding-mods-current-situation.html bnrk

 

[kwalka]

Here is another excellent post by Roly, everyone should read it. http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...s/76078-exploding-mods-current-situation.html bnrk

Make sure you follow the link inside that first link to get the updated version.

 

[kwalka]

I found these last night...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...07-510-battery-fail-did-i-react-properly.html

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...cal-issues/290070-lava-tube-went-red-hot.html

 

[bnrkwest]

I also had an experience with a Diamond Series failure E-HealthCigarettes.com - Online Store I believe these are KR808-2's these actually worked really well for a time, but one batt I had, made a popped sound and started smoking, it got hot as well. It did not not explode tho. Now I see this same company is making Lava tube type VV mod. They are using IMR batteries, but I see little info about dangers of using wrong batteries. Scarey. bnrk

 

[BuGlen]

I also had an experience with a Diamond Series failure E-HealthCigarettes.com - Online Store I believe these are KR808-2's these actually worked really well for a time, but one batt I had, made a popped sound and started smoking, it got hot as well. It did not not explode tho. Now I see this same company is making Lava tube type VV mod. They are using IMR batteries, but I see little info about dangers of using wrong batteries. Scarey. bnrk

I've been fortunate to not have a battery actually melt down (yet), but I did have one of my eGo-C 650mAh batteries get warm on the charger. I put it on the charger and checked it after 3 hours as I usually do, but the charger light was still red. When I touched the battery it was warm, which seems to never happens with these batteries. Then I tried to turn it on with the 5 clicks, without an atty attached, and nothing. Since it got warm, I didn't even bother messing with it any further, and I contacted the vendor who instructed me to send it back and they shipped me a new battery.

This could have been an incident of another exploding eGo on the charger, but fortunately I had already read about the battery issues and knew what to look for and to never leave a charging battery unattended. I'm still leery of the eGo batteries since they're sealed, which is good for preventing juice / moisture in the battery, but bad for venting incidents.

 

[kwalka]

I've been fortunate to not have a battery actually melt down (yet), but I did have one of my eGo-C 650mAh batteries get warm on the charger. I put it on the charger and checked it after 3 hours as I usually do, but the charger light was still red. When I touched the battery it was warm, which seems to never happens with these batteries. Then I tried to turn it on with the 5 clicks, without an atty attached, and nothing. Since it got warm, I didn't even bother messing with it any further, and I contacted the vendor who instructed me to send it back and they shipped me a new battery.

This could have been an incident of another exploding eGo on the charger, but fortunately I had already read about the battery issues and knew what to look for and to never leave a charging battery unattended. I'm still leery of the eGo batteries since they're sealed, which is good for preventing juice / moisture in the battery, but bad for venting incidents.

Very good that you had the presence of mind to watch the clock. I put all batts including all eGo's in the lipo bag and set my alarm for 3 hrs. The eGo bottom cap is designed to pop off in an outgassing event. It is "supposed" to require a lot less force to blow out, than the top.

 

[BuGlen]

Here's another incident, and this one involving the "king" of APVs and the best of the single cell batteries:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/provape/275857-my-provari-went-up-smoke.html

In light of this, another good topic of discussion would be what to do when all the protection fails. I'm not sure how I would have reacted in their place, but I don't know that opening the tube while the battery was actively out-gassing was the best move. I hope my first thought would be to get the device away from myself and anyone else as quickly as possible. But then, it didn't happen to me so I don't know how I would have handled that same situation in the heat of the moment.

 

[kwalka]

Here's another incident, and this one involving the "king" of APVs and the best of the single cell batteries:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/provape/275857-my-provari-went-up-smoke.html

In light of this, another good topic of discussion would be what to do when all the protection fails. I'm not sure how I would have reacted in their place, but I don't know that opening the tube while the battery was actively out-gassing was the best move. I hope my first thought would be to get the device away from myself and anyone else as quickly as possible. But then, it didn't happen to me so I don't know how I would have handled that same situation in the heat of the moment.

I am a home builder, so I have been using dangerous and deadly tools on a daily basis for 17 yrs. I actually am concious all the time of putting things in my pockets, wearing lanyards, and just basic awareness. I consider all pv's to be dangerous tools that need to be respected. I look at it like a matter of when not if.

 

[bnrkwest]

Here's another incident, and this one involving the "king" of APVs and the best of the single cell batteries:
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/provape/275857-my-provari-went-up-smoke.html

In light of this, another good topic of discussion would be what to do when all the protection fails. I'm not sure how I would have reacted in their place, but I don't know that opening the tube while the battery was actively out-gassing was the best move. I hope my first thought would be to get the device away from myself and anyone else as quickly as possible. But then, it didn't happen to me so I don't know how I would have handled that same situation in the heat of the moment.

I have been thinking alot about this myself. What would I do? If it's hot do you have time to unscrew it or do you drop it and run??? Not sure what I would do. bnrk

 

[kwalka]

I literally sit here at this desk, in my carpeted bedroom, with the door to the bathroom right next to my desk on my right. The door stays open and the shower curtain stays open. If the need ever arises, while I'm sitting here, its going in the tub, the whole thing. I suspect that would make a much better option than just dropping it. When I'm riding in the car w the kids, my window is open enough so I could chuck it if necessary. It kinda sucks but I still have to keep the window open as if I'm...you know what. If I am alone I would just throw it in the back of the van.
I'm not fanatical about it, I dont walk around all day waiting for it top go off or I wouldn't be using them. I'm just always aware of the possibility.

 

[IronAP]

I am a home builder, so I have been using dangerous and deadly tools on a daily basis for 17 yrs. I actually am conscious all the time of putting things in my pockets, wearing lanyards, and just basic awareness.

I couldn't agree more. I have worked in an industrial workplace for 15+ years. I'm talking about 4160 volt motors, 1600 horsepower machines, chemicals, steam, you name it. But the bottom line is YOU are responsible for your own safety. And that translates to your personal life as well. It is your responsibility to know what you are dealing with. Be it driving a vehicle, operating your lawn mower, or using high energy batteries. To fail to understand that is well, ignorant, and that's when Darwin gets involved.

 

[kwalka]

I couldn't agree more. I have worked in an industrial workplace for 15+ years. I'm talking about 4160 volt motors, 1600 horsepower machines, chemicals, steam, you name it. But the bottom line is YOU are responsible for your own safety. And that translates to your personal life as well. It is your responsibility to know what you are dealing with. Be it driving a vehicle, operating your lawn mower, or using high energy batteries. To fail to understand that is well, ignorant, and that's when Darwin gets involved.

Right. But as were discussing in the "Colorado" thread, a vaper purchased an APV for a friend who does not have internet, so he was completly in the dark, allegedly, and Darwin stepped in. That is where one of the problems lie. I do not recognize you from that thread you should check it out.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...288409-colorado-man-sues-after-explosion.html

 

[bnrkwest]

I couldn't agree more, we have to be sure APV users are armed with information so they can use it safely. If they have no info and they think these batts are like AA batteries, then Houston we have a problem. We just want everyone to know from the start that these batteries have a responsibility and everyone needs to know how to use them and which ones are safer in their own APV. I use 3 tube mods, so I have to use different batteries for each. I now know why from doing alot of searching and reading, we want everyone to know because it sounds like many are not making the right choice when buying these batteries. bnrk

 

[kwalka]

I couldn't agree more, we have to be sure APV users are armed with information so they can use it safely. If they have no info and they think these batts are like AA batteries, then Houston we have a problem. We just want everyone to know from the start that these batteries have a responsibility and everyone needs to know how to use them and which ones are safer in their own APV. I use 3 tube mods, so I have to use different batteries for each. I now know why from doing alot of searching and reading, we want everyone to know because it sounds like many are not making the right choice when buying these batteries. bnrk

So, IMO, this is where we are hitting a wall. If the above mentioned scenario plays out, the only way the "friend" is going to get any warning at all, assuming the purchaser just clicks ok w/o reading, is if there is a note in the device where the batts go.

 

[bnrkwest]

So, IMO, this is where we are hitting a wall. If the above mentioned scenario plays out, the only way the "friend" is going to get any warning at all, assuming the purchaser just clicks ok w/o reading, is if there is a note in the device where the batts go.

Exactly if the vendor doesn't give the info and warning about batts, the gift giver must. So we have to reach newbies to APV's. I was thinking about when Xmas comes around and people will be buying their friends & family APV's, we need an info sheet that needs included, one page, & maybe the graphic I came up with for inside the tube. We have to do a better job reaching new vapers and new APV users about how to use these devices by knowing batteries. We should probably include a list of where to buy safe AW batts too. Vendors that buy form the source not counterfeits. We have time to work on that before Xmas bnrk

 

[kwalka]

Exactly if the vendor doesn't give the info and warning about batts, the gift giver must. So we have to reach newbies to APV's. I was thinking about when Xmas comes around and people will be buying their friends & family APV's, we need an info sheet that needs included, one page, & maybe the graphic I came up with for inside the tube. We have to do a better job reaching new vapers and new APV users about how to use these devices by knowing batteries. We should probably include a list of where to buy safe AW batts too. Vendors that buy form the source not counterfeits. We have time to work on that before Xmas bnrk

IMO, we would need someone from ECF w some clout to get the vendors to even listen, nevermind actually comply.

 

[mwa102464]

I still think ECF should Templet a safety letter that every single vendor should use, and then they just fill in the Batt there using in there Mod. This way it would set a standard for the industry and every single vendor would be using the same templeted safety letter. Just my 2c on this one,,, but if ECF is setting a standard for APV safety in Mods then why not set a standard for safety in the industry too with a Battery safety spec sheet. The same templet letter for every vendor would sure be a nice place to start, then every vendor is using the same.

 

[kwalka]

I still think ECF should Templet a safety letter that every single vendor should use, and then they just fill in the Batt there using in there Mod. This way it would set a standard for the industry and every single vendor would be using the same templeted safety letter. Just my 2c on this one,,, but if ECF is setting a standard for APV safety in Mods then why not set a standard for safety in the industry too with a Battery safety spec sheet. The same templet letter for every vendor would sure be a nice place to start, then every vendor is using the same.

I can already see that reply. We cant take that much liability were not that kind of entity. Technically ECF would be taking on some amount of liability if that happened. Dont you think?