Vapelicious?

[Faylool]

Rustica is often mentioned when talking both about high nic and hi WTAs. I'm going to grow some for a project but then I don't know what I'll do. If I can dry it successfully, naturally, I'll hope I can make snus that has less saltiness and not very bitter. dream on. But it's for fun. I would try the do it yourself at home WTA method but I lost that posting somehow. I don't know where to buy the seeds. They were gifted to me. Probably just google Rustica. I doubt the flavor of a tobacco plays a big part in WTA juice since it can be flavored anyway you want later.

 

[Mr.Mann]

Rustica is often mentioned when talking both about high nic and hi WTAs. I'm going to grow some for a project but then I don't know what I'll do. If I can dry it successfully, naturally, I'll hope I can make snus that has less saltiness and not very bitter. dream on. But it's for fun. I would try the do it yourself at home WTA method but I lost that posting somehow.

Good luck and godspeed, LOL. I have a recent fascination with Rustica. I just gave a forum friend a pic of a Rustica leaf to use as an avi. Actually, I thought that might be a leaf of it in that video, but that doesn't matter much to me really. It's just a fascinating leaf in the context of other tobaccos.

 

[redrose]

People old enough to remember the Toxic Avenger movies and TMNT react differently to the word "mutant" than do people who grew up with X-Men.

What about those of us who have no idea who any of them are?

 

[redrose]

It looks solid to me.

Taking you at your word that Ethan's prices are variable solidifies my assumptions about how one vendor mixes WTA as opposed to the other..

I can testify to the accuracy of this.

 

[Mr.Mann]

What about those of us who have no idea who any of them are?

I feel some links coming on...

 

[VaporMizer]

Maybe this has already been discussed....but are there alternate sources for the minor alkaloids that are found in WTA? If there were a way to extract the constituents of a WTA substitute that could be made with widely available nicotine liquid without the dangers associated with handling pure nicotine then it would probably be a lot cheaper.

EDIT: for example, anatabine (the minor alkaloid with MAO inhibitor properties) can be extracted from the tomato plant and I think it is available as a food supplement.

 

[DVap]

What I am not clear(est) on:

1) The actual strength of WTA-exclusive liquid that goes in any one juice (what is the strength it is diluted down to before its inclusion into the recipe?)
2) What types of tobacco are used per vendor and if/how much of a difference that makes to the product?
3) What is the underlying issue behind Vapelicious' order fulfillment?
5) How this thread managed to stay as calm and pleasant as it did? (incredible!)
6) Did the OP's question ever get answered?

1) I don't know. I can't reason my way to this answer.

2) I don't know. Again, can't reason my way to this answer. Different tobaccos will have variations in their alkaloid spread.

3) I think the underlying issue behind Vapelicious order fulfillment is the offering of much higher actual WTA levels. This is reflected in the pricing variations we see. If you put more WTA into a liquid, it takes more WTA to make the liquid. I presume that this strains manufacturing capacity.

4) Why isn't there a number 4? Didn't you learn how to count?

5) Beats me.

6) The OP question was, "Has anyone tried any of the Vapelicious WTA juices? I'm particularly interested in hearing what people thought of the Tobacco/Apricot/Rose/Violet, even without WTA." The answer the first part is obviously, "Yes". Dunno about the second part.

 

[Mr.Mann]

1) I don't know. I can't reason my way to this answer.

2) I don't know. Again, can't reason my way to this answer. Different tobaccos will have variations in their alkaloid spread.

3) I think the underlying issue behind Vapelicious order fulfillment is the offering of much higher actual WTA levels. This is reflected in the pricing variations we see. If you put more WTA into a liquid, it takes more WTA to make the liquid. I presume that this strains manufacturing capacity.

4) Why isn't there a number 4? Didn't you learn how to count?

5) Beats me.

6) The OP question was, "Has anyone tried any of the Vapelicious WTA juices? I'm particularly interested in hearing what people thought of the Tobacco/Apricot/Rose/Violet, even without WTA." The answer the first part is obviously, "Yes". Dunno about the second part.

Well, damn!

You weren't supposed to notice my tetraphobia. You damn scientist with your keen eye!

 

[Mr.Mann]

D, actually #4 was directed at you but I deleted it without renumbering.

 

[DVap]

D'uh! I didn't even think about what type of question it was to pose to a vendor about what type of tobacco he uses for his WTA extraction. That is not to be divulged as far as I can tell. However, maybe Dvap can say what type of tobacco he...ah, never mind. It matters not.

I am trying to keep the conversation going and it's not even natural at this point.

Actually, I became quite partial to the dark blue and light blue cans of Natural American Spirit... nothing extra added to it. Quite expensive stuff, but easy to work with and decent and predictable yields. I've probably spent a few hundred dollars on this stuff. Too expensive to use in a production environment. Starting with whole leaf like Jerry does is the way to go for cost-effectiveness.

 

[DVap]

I don't remember for sure what he said in the "are we getting it" thread but I'm pretty sure that Dvap did say what kind he used and also made a batch using snus.

The batch made with snus was really interesting stuff. One thing I really liked about it is that snus is manufactured to be low in TSNA's, so by extension, the resulting WTA's were also low in TSNA's.

 

[Mr.Mann]

Actually, I became quite partial to the dark blue and light blue cans of Natural American Spirit... nothing extra added to it. Quite expensive stuff, but easy to work with and decent and predictable yields. I've probably spent a few hundred dollars on this stuff. Too expensive to use in a production environment. Starting with whole leaf like Jerry does is the way to go for cost-effectiveness.

Wow! I used to have a bunch of those empty cans lying around my apartment. Boy, that smell was splendid! Thanks.

 

[DVap]

Dvap, I have a few questions about the testing.
1) Are there valid test to determine the various levels of WTA in it's various forms?
2) Are there labs that you know of that perform these tests and will publicly disclose the results?
3) Can someone like myself have these tests conducted?
4) How far in the future will the results of a test be valid for?
5) What is the frequency that random samples be obtained to consider the testing current?
6) Are the results of self-testing due any weight?

(I've edited your quote by adding numbers to the questions)

1. This question is a bit vague. There are testing procedures which rank from quite simple to quite complex. The amount of information to be gained is generally proportional to the complexity of the test. The more telling testing can easily go for $1000 per sample.

2. There are certainly labs that can perform the range of testing possibilities. In general, commercial labs aren't all that interested in doing this type of testing. They are generally set up to do specific protocols and tend to focus on their commercial, industrial, and governmental clients. Not to say one can't find a lab that will dabble in this sort of thing.

3. Anyone can have testing performed. The challenge, I think, is largely in engaging the interest of a lab to do it. Many, especially the larger operations, will find this sort of request to be a distraction from the sorts of things they focus on doing.

4. The result of any test is a snapshot. It applies to the material tested. This is why many lab clients send samples to labs on a regular basis... to obtain results over time. With some materials, the results are quite consistent over time, with others, there can be large variations.

5. I would say that with consistent manufacturing procedures and consistent starting materials, the results should maintain consistency over time.

6. The results of self-testing (such as nicotine or total alkaloid titration) are quite good if the procedure is performed correctly. I spent a good bit of time years back spelling out how anybody can figure out the actual levels in the e-liquid they buy. Generally, folks found it challenging to follow along.

 

[Mr.Mann]

6. The results of self-testing (such as nicotine or total alkaloid titration) are quite good if the procedure is performed correctly. I spent a good bit of time years back spelling out how anybody can figure out the actual levels in the e-liquid they buy. Generally, folks found it challenging to follow along.

Challenging or not, that's would be a great post to see.

 

[DVap]

Rustica is often mentioned when talking both about high nic and hi WTAs. I'm going to grow some for a project but then I don't know what I'll do. If I can dry it successfully, naturally, I'll hope I can make snus that has less saltiness and not very bitter. dream on. But it's for fun. I would try the do it yourself at home WTA method but I lost that posting somehow. I don't know where to buy the seeds. They were gifted to me. Probably just google Rustica. I doubt the flavor of a tobacco plays a big part in WTA juice since it can be flavored anyway you want later.

I've used rustica as well for WTA. The literature goes on and on about how the alkaloid content can be a staggering 8 percent or so instead of the 1 - 1.5% you might expect with regular tobacco. Wasn't quite that staggering in the end, the rustica gave up about 2.5 - 3% alkaloids. Probably a very different minor alkaloid spread, but I found the effects quite similar to regular tobacco.

 

[Mr.Mann]

6. The results of self-testing (such as nicotine or total alkaloid titration) are quite good if the procedure is performed correctly. I spent a good bit of time years back spelling out how anybody can figure out the actual levels in the e-liquid they buy. Generally, folks found it challenging to follow along.

........maybe..........


http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...est-determining-nicotine-dvap.html#post549126

Is this the thread you were referring to?

 

[DVap]

Maybe this has already been discussed....but are there alternate sources for the minor alkaloids that are found in WTA? If there were a way to extract the constituents of a WTA substitute that could be made with widely available nicotine liquid without the dangers associated with handling pure nicotine then it would probably be a lot cheaper.

EDIT: for example, anatabine (the minor alkaloid with MAO inhibitor properties) can be extracted from the tomato plant and I think it is available as a food supplement.

There are other types of tobacco, for example tree tobacco (nicotiana glauca), that has an alkaloid profile drastically different from regular tobacco with the primary alkaloid being anabasine. I suppose one could try to obtain minor alkaloids for inclusion in e-liquid, but I would not support such activity for a number of reasons:

1. The idea of producing a "natural" product is out the window. Questions like, "how much if this to add, how much of that to add" give me the willies. It becomes a bit of a Frankenstein vape in my opinion.

2. There are many minor alkaloids, but only a few of them appear at more than trace levels. Assuming that simply adding 3 or 4 minor alkaloids will achieve an effective WTA is as questionable as the wide-spread (and wrong) assumption by the medical community that "it's all about the nicotine.".

3. The cost would go through the roof.

 

[DVap]

Challenging or not, that's would be a great post to see.

It's here... if you want to look as far back as 2009. The thread kinda exploded.

 

[Mr.Mann]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/35922-any-interest-determining-nicotine-dvap.html#post550005

This is the detailed post found further down on the page.

Man, my computer is so slow. Sometimes I wonder what I could do with a fast computer.

 

[Faylool]

Is the thread where I found the make your WTA at home using baking soda, citric acid, oil and distilled water here still? I lost it. Save DIT wronging guess