Heh... nice!ANTZ? I'm assuming not the movie
Anti-Nicotine-Tobacco Zealots.
It's our "pet-name" for them.
Vaping for nicotine advantages?
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Anti-Nicotine-Tobacco Zealots.
It's our "pet-name" for them.
I could totally see that someone might like some nicotine in their body, helps with some medical conditions, etc.
However, vaping is harm reduction. There is still stuff going down your windpipe and into your lungs and we don't know all the effects yet, we know it is safer than smoking, but for a non-smoker........I dunno.
The other factor is that somebody who just wanted some nicotine, and did not want to fiddle, learn about technology a little, or have a new hobby, would really be better off just using a patch. IMHO.
Ex smokers NEED the "fiddle factor" of ecigs, as well as the blowing out of clouds, etc. cuz it approximates the ritual of smoking.
but if somebody never smoked, not sure why they would need that?
Again, I'm open to ALL forms of harm reduction, not just vaping.... so I would still recommend somebody who didn't smoke, and didn't need to do something with their hands like most smokers have gotten into habit of doing.....to just use a patch or gum or SNUS........I think it really depends on the individual!
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I totally get the physical behavior thing.....however, if you read enough about how the brain forms "habits" and how those pathways get worn in, and then how to establish new habits which form new pathways........there's really little chance for me, anyway, to relapse 10 years from now.
That would of course, mean that I started cutting back on certain "behaviors" .... which is why I say Harm Reduction depends on the individual.
I believe that if I used SNUS or patch or gum in between vaping, perhaps I would be able to kick the *ritual* part better. I noticed since I stopped holding my PV/ecig all teh time, and placed on a countertop which involves me getting up and walking over to it, I vaped less.
Every psychology and brain is diffferent....I started hiking every single day a few months ago, and now it is sort of a "habit". Beofre that every winter i would just want to hibernate....THAT had become a habit/pattern.
Some people have a dependence on nic.......some say it's an addiction......I will stick w/dependence. But I'm not talking about them. I am talking about people with no dependence on nic..... REPETITION of behaviors is what makes behaviors stronger and which makes them HABITS. ........what you do the most......I've read a lot of books on habit that have nothing to do with nicotine so it's not "antz" research.
And it itches worse than poison ivy! Also gave me EXTREME heart palpitations. No thanks!
Andria
Cool experiment. I do low carb, the Flavor and appetite supressant effects of vape are epic.
They forgot to tell you that putting the patch ojn you testicles is not optimal placement mudramAs someone who tried the patch when Strongly encouraged to do so by a company physician, based on their at the time focus of smoke cessation in employees. While I have previously shown no proclivity towards sensitivity to anything, the patches caused a pretty uncomfortable reaction regardless of where placed. I was not successful needless to say. I don't know if the reaction was from the nicotine transfer or the adhesive of the patch. Each application site would develop visibly reddened area just slightly large than the area of the patch. Also there would be a mild tenderness and sometimes itching. Over time I have tried everything except Chantix (had even got a prescription filled for it but wife after a quick research on the web and based on possible side-effects said I COULD not take that) and had in the past never been able to abstain for any period of time. Vaping so far is promising to be a possibility to at least remove 9.6k combusted chemical vapors/smoke. I have at minimum replaced a horrible habit with a bad one, and at best made a great difference health wise.
You just liked the swelling
I'm willing to let the longer term epidemiology take care of that. I've seen enough to suggest that my only worry "stuff going down your windpipe and into your lungs" isn't a real concern.
I think I have elaborated enough on why someone who wanted therapeutic nicotine wouldn't want to use the patch, and to why vaping is much more preferable..
Controlled delivery!
Gum or any other form of mouth absorption is just too inaccurate, and uncontrollable. The patch is worthless, and the jury is still out on SNUS, IMO. Also, vaping isn't just for 'harm reduction' any more. in my opinion. It is a therapy for the ageing brain!
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One word, scissors! Seriously, despite the warning not to cut them into smaller sizes I did so all three of the times I quit via the patch. Square 'name brand' patches did break me out in a rash in full strength and the cheap generic round patches do not stick well cut into smaller sizes. But medium strength 'name brand' patches can be cut into any size you desire.
Experiment folks, it is your own body!
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I think it goes a little beyond that sofar. Let me tell you what work for me as far as the "cravings" go, and I've seen similar things stated from others. I initially told myself that if I wanted a some I would have one! On top of that I promised myself that before I had one I would vape for maybe 5 minutes and if I still wanted it I would have it. Within 3 days I was 0 cigs. That was despite the fact that I lowered my nic to 6% (.6) thinking I was doing a good thing.
What I have found is that the right set up and the right juice (or combination of juices) makes as much difference as anything else. I switch juices based on mood, time of day, activity, or just for variation. My wife still smokes and it doesn't bother me a bit, although I may vape a bit more when she is smoking (probably mental support).
I hope that helps
Dog
This whole 'harm reduction' argument is driving me bonkers. Yes, I suppose that more than 99% of the folks here are vaping for that reason, and I agree that it is incredibly valuable for that purpose. However, if you truly believe that there is potential 'harm' in vaping, then why vape at all? Personally, I think that 'harm amelioration' would be a better term for the long-term smokers. As for those of us in the minority (God, it feels great to, at last, be a member of the 1%) 'brain improvement' would be a better term!
when i quit 10 yrs ago i went cold turkey but used a drug called welbuton that really helped me cut the cravings.
Vaping caused my asthma to go completely out of control; I had to add maintenance medications just to re-establish control. Many would say that's a great deal of harm -- but going back to smoking, just to "ameliorate" my asthma would be stupid as hell. That's why I vape. Because my choices are a) vape, or b) smoke -- those are my only options. I cannot abstain from smoking UNLESS I vape. Vaping is the first method of quitting I've ever tried that ACTUALLY WORKS. When I had been smoke-free for 3 1/2 months and had my appendix out, then couldn't vape for 4 days due to extreme nausea/vomiting, as soon as the nausea abated, I was dying -- I tried to vape, but after 4 days without it (or anything else!), it tasted HORRIBLE. So I smoked, and it took me another month to switch back over to vape only.
Nobody in their right mind could ever think smoking preferable to vaping -- yet as a smoker, I needed only a rescue inhaler. As a vaper, I also need Advair. I have no guarantee that even if I completely stopped vaping and went back to smoking, that I'd be able to go back to only using a rescue inhaler. I've never been a non-smoking asthmatic, till now -- I developed asthma when I had already been smoking for 10 yrs. It's my belief that quitting smoking and starting vaping destroyed my body's homeostasis -- smoking was bad, but I was well-accustomed to it. Changing that, changed everything.
THAT is why even those who perceive or experience actual harm from vaping will stick with it -- because ANYTHING is better than smoking.
Andria
HAHA...mosspa the 1%er...I picture you lecturing in a Sons of Anarchy vest sporting full sleeve tattoos!!
Mosspa, you were a non smoker for most of your adult life. As I said I was 1 1-2 PAD smoker for 35 years. Vaping gets rid of the 9500+ chems I was putting into my system by smoking analogs. This IS harm reduction AT LEAST. At best it is way more than that. Vaping is not only a substitution though. I think I will continue to vape for flavor, enjoyment, and the experience whether I "need to" or not.
Hey it is a much better side effect than I have heard at the end of a commercial in long looonng time.
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