Vapor Flask V3 DNA40 Clone thread

[TheBloke]

Hopefully the 50W/60W doesn't have the fire delay the board the Waidea uses has.

Right, regarding this question of whether the new Flasks (and the Geeco) require the "double tap" to start firing from sleep - we seem to have confirmation that this problem is NOT present in the new flask!

This is verbatim what VapnFagan said in the Geeco review I linked above.

"Even though this is in standby mode, it doesn't have that flaw that the Infinite chips have. If you guys remember some of the Infinite dna clones when it went it into standby you had to double-click the fire button to get it to start firing. All you have to do is press the fire button right when you're in standby and it'll start vaping. It was kind of annoying with the Infinite chips, when you came out of standby you'd press the fire to vape and it wouldn't vape, you'd have to wait for the screen to load to vape."

So we've got confirmation that the Geeco 60W fires straight from standby. And that should mean for sure that the SXK Flasks - 40, 50 and 60W - are exactly the same.

Great news!

And @Unior , for me this makes the decision easy - you want to either order the 60W flask now, if you can't wait, or else wait for next week for 100% confirmation it's completely fine. In your shoes I would not order the Waidea now, knowing this is fixed in the new Flasks as well as all its other benefits.

 

[Unior]

So basically your telling me watching the review is pointless. I am new really to a lot of this & basically teaching myself as I guess we all do.
I have a question. Does the firing delay of the Waidea have to do with the grounding issue or are those 2 separate things?

 

[ThunderDan]

So basically your telling me watching the review is pointless. I am new really to a lot of this & basically teaching myself as I guess we all do.
I have a question. Does the firing delay of the Waidea have to do with the grounding issue or are those 2 separate things?

Two separate things.

 

[TheBloke]

So basically your telling me watching the review is pointless. I am new really to a lot of this & basically teaching myself as I guess we all do.

No? Watching the review will give you a good idea of how the new Flask will operate, as they use the same chip. There are some differences in chassis, which I mentioned - basically that you can discount the stated negative of adjustable 510, as the Flask has spring loaded. And we can't assume that he tested it in gruelling detail, so you can't take the lack of major problems as 100% confidence that there are none. For that you'll likely need to wait until next week, unless any of the people who already received theirs from FT get up a detailed review before I do.

With those caveats, watching the review will give you the first look at how the new Infinite Flask operates from a chip/UI perspective.

 

[KenD]

You can probably see why I think this amusing. He says that this mod doesn't have the issue, unlike those Infinite chips! Where in fact this mod (the Geeco) has the Infinite chip, and the mods he's comparing against did not

He's probably talking about earlier non-TC DNA clone chips. Pretty much all of them had a delay when firing from sleep mode. Only clone I've come across that doesn't have it is the Cloupor ZNA50. Makes me automatically expect clone DNA boards to have a delay :-/

 

[TheBloke]

He's probably talking about earlier non-TC DNA clone chips. Pretty much all of them had a delay when firing from sleep mode. Only clone I've come across that doesn't have it is the Cloupor ZNA50. Makes me automatically expect clone DNA boards to have a delay :-/

Ahh OK, so all clones prior to the new Geeco/Infinite mods had it, including earlier Infinite chips? OK, I'll let him off!

 

[Hammy75]

Here's a link to the discussion on FT about the 60W flask:

It's SXK and it's arrived- Couple of Pics, ask any questions you like.: FastTech Forums

Here's Mike Vapes take on the Geeko Zero 60W (he likes it) that we assume is the same board as the Flasks:



hopefully you guys find some of this useful

 

[Hammy75]

Man you guys have had really good shipping times from China... my good shipping times with ePacket have been about 2 weeks to the USA. I've had 1 sooner than that, and some longer than that... but g/t 2 weeks is a base average.

Not sure if I mentioned it here, I've got a 510 brass screw for another mod coming from the manufacturer, JUST A BRASS SCREW, that's been stuck in custom's since APRIL 4th! so close to 6 weeks. And I'm helpless until it clears. The post offer says all I can do is wait. It may clear tomorrow, it may take 6 months? I have no clue

I think time depends a lot on how close you are to the major sorting centres. I am now kind of in the sticks so to speak so I am thinking I will be in the 2 week zone with you. I lived in NB for a long time and we always get stuff last so I doubt it's any different with the mail

Of course you can always get screwed by customs...unfortunately you are experiencing that now.

 

[KenD]

Ahh OK, so all clones prior to the new Geeco/Infinite mods had it, including earlier Infinite chips? OK, I'll let him off!

Not sure if all had it, but a huge number did. At least of the ones I've come across, and plenty of people have been complaining about that "feature". I really can't understand why that's the one aspect that the cloners can't seem to get right. The reviewer might have been talking about earlier TC-chip clones though.

 

[dwcraig1]

Hopefully the 50W/60W doesn't have the fire delay the board the Waidea uses has.

From what I understand it has a 0.25 second delay

 

[ThunderDan]

From what I understand it has a 0.25 second delay

That's an improvement at least.

 

[dwcraig1]

And I imagine the "nickel purity" setting will be good for "adjusting" the Ti builds.

 

[TheBloke]

And I imagine the "nickel purity" setting will be good for "adjusting" the Ti builds.

Yeah it's going to be really interesting to see how this setting works and what benefits it has for Ti, maybe twisted Nickel/Kanthal, etc.

What are your thoughts on its mode of operation? I guess it must modify the expected resistance gain / the coefficient of resistance?

So at 100%, it would expect the full coefficient of resistance, and at 50%, it would act as if the coefficient is half that value?

As for the coefficient value - I've seen 0.0059 / 0.006 several places for Nickel, though one site I just looked at has it at 0.00641. But I'm not 100% sure what it is for Ni200. I saw one place saying 0.004 but I don't think that can be right, because a) I have seen 0.004 referenced twice as the value for Nichrome which is only 80% nickel, where Ni200 is 99.6%; b) when I play with coefficient calculators the resistance gain predicted from 0.0059 is in the ballpark of what I see when I Set Resistance on a cold and hot coil on my IPV4. I've been assuming therefore that the coefficient is perhaps 0.0055 or something similarly close to the pure Nickel value.

So if all that is right, then Titanium (0.0035) would warrant a setting of 58%, assuming we compare it against 0.006 for Nickel and assuming their 100 is also Nickel @ 0.006.

Imagine if we just turned that setting to 58 or a similar number, and Titanium operated perfectly without a manual temperature adjustment! Could we dare to dream it would be so simple?

Damn I need to order some Titanium wire now EDIT: ordered

 

[Croak]

One nice thing about the new chip, it actually displays real-time resistance when firing, which can be all kinds of useful for troubleshooting (video below starts at 7:10 when he's doing a dry cotton test, just click it).




And if you watch the end of that Mike Vapes video, he confirms that Geeco also selling Vaporflask and Vaporshark rDNA clones with the same chip on-board.

And it'd dead simple to get some answers on specific details, just email the guy at Geeco that's sending those Zero clones out to reviewers and ask him:

Given Lees, Sales002@geeco.com.cn

 

[Unior]

If ordering from FT & some things say in stock and others say 5-7 days will they ship 'in stock' first or wait til whole order is complete. Wondering if I need to do 2 separate orders.

 

[TheBloke]

One nice thing about the new chip, it actually displays real-time resistance when firing, which can be all kinds of useful for troubleshooting (video below starts at 7:10 when he's doing a dry cotton test, just click it).

Oh that is nice!

And it'd dead simple to get some answers on specific details, just email the guy at Geeco that's sending those Zero clones out to reviewers and ask him:

Given Lees, Sales002@geeco.com.cn

Good idea, thanks.

If ordering from FT & some things say in stock and others say 5-7 days will they ship 'in stock' first or wait til whole order is complete. Wondering if I need to do 2 separate orders.

They ship when all products in your order are available - the ETAs for each are visible in your basket, and then again in your Order History.

So yes, if you are ordering products with an unknown ETA, and you have other products In Stock that you hope to get fast, two separate orders is better. This applies especially for pre-order products, though that's not the case with the Flask.

FYI that "7 business days" is the generic estimate. When I ordered my 50W flask, it said the same - but then one day later, that changed to an ETA of 3 more days. One day further on, it said my product was Waiting for Packaging, which the next day changed to Packaging then Shipped (one day ahead of the ETA.)

So at the time of my initial order it said I might have to wait up to 10 days, but in the event it shipped three days later. For popular products such as these, the 7 days is indicating how long there will be between each batch as a worst case, it's not a specific estimate.

 

[Unior]

Thanks! What I needed to know.

I just looked at that Geeco link. The flask I saw had copper plate on top instead of stainless. Also screws are the hex not Phillips

 

[TheBloke]

Thanks! What I needed to know.

I just looked at that Geeco link. The flask I saw had copper plate on top instead of stainless. Also screws are the hex not Phillips

That's not the new flask, then. Brass/copper plate sounds like the Kangxin, the first TC Flask that came out. This is the new Infinite one, which has the same chip as the Geeco: 60W VW Variable Wattage APV Box Mod.

 

[Tronk72]

There's also this 60W Vaporshark clone that seems to be using the same board as the Geeco:
$47.87 60W VW Variable Wattage APV Box Mod - w/ temperature control function / 1*18650 / aluminum alloy / black at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

 

[TheBloke]

So here's a further change on the Infinite chip: it appears that it never asks for New Coil Up/Same Down, and therefore quite possibly has no Kanthal/Nickel detection.

That's been reported by UKV_Kenneth in the FT discussion thread. He's had it a day or two and is never asked New Coil.

I'm wondering what this is going to mean in practice for getting base resistance resistance right. I guess the main advantage of New/Same is that saying Same tells it to use the stored value in situations where it might have changed since the mod last read the atty. Now I think about it, I can't find many cases where that's going to happen much. So maybe it's no big deal, and Infinite dropped it as an unnecessary complication. But maybe I'm missing something?

I've also asked him for confirmation of what this means for Kanthal/Nickel detection - what happens when he vapes on Kanthal with TC turned on? He's already indicated that he switches "manually" between modes, suggesting that there is no detection. You have it in TC mode or you have it in Kanthal mode, and if you vape Kanthal in TC it tries to detect its temperature and presumably vapes poorly as a result.

I couldn't get final confirmation from Mike Vapes' video, as he didn't talk about it. He did however switch out of TC mode before he put a Kanthal build on, which could well be indicative.

At first I thought this was a downside, and I suppose technically it is versus proper, instant Nickel/Kanthal detection. But overall, not so much - not much different to how Yihi does it, albeit less convenient because you can't just switch Power to Joules and have the temperature remembered. If you do a lot of switching between TC and Kanthal builds, you're going to be dialling your temp in, and out, a lot.

But frankly for me it's not even a downside compared to what I'm used to, because I already have to do that on my Waidea where the Nickel/Kanthal detection sucks. I gather that might be unique to my batch of Waidea, and it's certainly not in the Heatvape.

Maybe Infinite had trouble getting it to work and figured it was better just not to try - and quite possibly they're right. People grip less about slight inconvenience than they do about seemingly broken features.

For final confirmation I'll update as and when I hear back from Kenneth on FT - I asked him to try vaping Kanthal with TC turned on.