Status
Not open for further replies.

Xobeloot

The Dirty Monkey
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 29, 2013
4,742
19,792
Grafenwöhr, Germany
26n xobedriver on the chalice. Epic cloud machine!

a4a3edas.jpg


bejagede.jpg







Sent from the zoo using Tapatypo 2
 

EagleTa2

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 27, 2013
484
1,427
Phoenix, AZ

james1980

Super Member
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Mar 25, 2011
432
679
45
lincoln ca
I thought my nemp tasted good before but now that I got it in a reo with a 9 wrap .55 micro .8 Ω, it is even better I just wish I could get more then 2 vapes before having to re squonk got use to my patriot and having 10 vapes before re dripping , have a cyclone bottom feeder on the way not sure if it will make a difference .
 

Alexander Mundy

Ribbon Twister
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 1, 2013
4,408
26,100
Springfield, MO
My wife read something about lead content in brass. I'm no expert but I'm listening cause it means I get to get more RBAs :)

Interesting, I did a quick bit of google surfing and found this: http://realbeer.com/jjpalmer/Welding.txt

Excerpt:

........

"A Few Words About Brass
Brass is an alloy of Copper and Zinc with some lead thrown in for
machinability. The lead percentage varies, but for the common brass alloys
used in plumbing fittings it is 7% or less. Lead is entirely soluble in
copper, but the presence of zinc changes this. In Brass, the lead exists as
minute globules. These globules act as an intrinsic lubricant during
machining. The result is a micro-thin film of lead being smeared over the
machined surface. It is this lead (a very small amount) that can be dissolved
off by the wort. While this small amount of lead should probably not be a
cause of concern, most people would be happier if if wasn't there at all.


Well, never let it be said that the Space Program never yields technology
applicable to the home. Some chemists working on the International Space
Station Alpha program were consulted for an etchant that could safely remove
the lead from the surface of brass parts. The chemists determined that a 1-to-
1 volume ratio of Glacial Acetic Acid (98% by vol.) to Hydrogen Peroxide (30%
by vol.) would accomplish this without pitting the brass. This procedure was
performed in the lab using the standard laboratory concentrations of these
chemicals. The process consisted of a 30 second dunk, swirl and rinse at room
temperature, and was successful in removing the lead, as determined by a Lead
Home Test Kit (swabs). In addition, the procedure had the added benefit of
turning the brass into Pure Gold. (Okay, the color of, anyway.)

Because 98% Acetic Acid and 30% Hydrogen Peroxide are not available to the
average brewer, the experiment was repeated using the concentrations available
in the supermarket. These are 5% Acetic Acid (White Distilled Vinegar) and 3%
Hydrogen Peroxide. Due to the difference in concentration, the relative
concentration ratio is changed. For the household variety concentrations, a 2-
to-1 volume ratio of Acetic Acid to H2O2 is needed.

The process was expected to take longer with the more dilute solution, so the
brass part was immersed for 10 minutes. The results showed the same gold color
and the Lead Test swab indicated the lead had been removed. The buttery yellow
gold color can be used as an indicator that the process has completed. Home
Lead Test kits should be available at most hardware stores.

This procedure for removing surface lead from brass can easily be conducted at
home. A 10-15 minute dunk, swirl, and rinse in a 2/1 volume ratio of 5% Acetic
Acid and 3% Hydrogen Peroxide has been shown to be effective. By the way, the
solution can be irritating to the skin so either wear gloves or use tongs.
"

........

"John Palmer is a metallurgical and welding engineer for McDonnell Douglas
Aerospace in Huntington Beach, California. "

I'll get some lead test kits and try this procedure to see before and after on my new RM2.

Got to shovel more snow now and pick my father up from the hospital and take him home.

Follow up

Ok, got a little bit of time and performed the test using EPA Recognized 3M Lead Check Swabs.
These will detect leachable lead concentrations of at least 0.2%.
Below 0.2% brass is considered "Lead Free"
Swabbing a brand new RM2 on the lathed down outside area I got dark pink to blood red coloration on the first swab.
Quote "If the swab tip and/or test surface turn pink or red the test is positive - A HAZARDOUS LEVEL OF LEAD IS PRESENT. In general, when the swab is used immediately after activation, the darker the developed pink color the higher the lead content."
Soaked both the tested RM2 and a second new non tested RM2 (as a control in case the testing removed the lead) in a 2 to 1 solution of 5% acetic acid (distilled white vinegar) and 3% hydrogen peroxide for 15 minutes occasionally stirring then rinsed with tap water.
Retested both new RM2's and got negative results, so the surface lead is gone or at least below 0.2%.
I swabbed the test confirmation card that was included as a double check for the negative result and it showed the swab was active so the negative result is verified.
There is exposed brass inside the RM2 below the ceramic where a milling action was done to allow juice flow to the hole with the removed post, around the perimeter of the ceramic at top, and the drilled air hole, but they are a small area for testing.
All those areas turned the same gold color as the outside lathed down area did after the soaking so I assume the surface lead was also removed.

The questions that remain are:
Will surface lead leach into juice? (I have a feeling the answer is yes, especially with citric acid)
If so, is there an appreciable danger since the area exposed to juice is small? (Don't have a clue)
Has the surface lead in my used RM2 already been leached away by juice? (Out of test strips to check)
Once the surface lead has been leached away or removed, will it leach out of the brass to the surface again? (That would increase the likelihood of appreciable danger)
This is probably way "off topic" and if so what sub forum would be the best one to start a thread for this super_X_drifter?
Just thought I would let you know the results.
 

super_X_drifter

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Oct 4, 2012
10,635
45,119
Somewhere out there
www.youtube.com
Follow up

Ok, got a little bit of time and performed the test using EPA Recognized 3M Lead Check Swabs.
These will detect leachable lead concentrations of at least 0.2%.
Below 0.2% brass is considered "Lead Free"
Swabbing a brand new RM2 on the lathed down outside area I got dark pink to blood red coloration on the first swab.
Quote "If the swab tip and/or test surface turn pink or red the test is positive - A HAZARDOUS LEVEL OF LEAD IS PRESENT. In general, when the swab is used immediately after activation, the darker the developed pink color the higher the lead content."
Soaked both the tested RM2 and a second new non tested RM2 (as a control in case the testing removed the lead) in a 2 to 1 solution of 5% acetic acid (distilled white vinegar) and 3% hydrogen peroxide for 15 minutes occasionally stirring then rinsed with tap water.
Retested both new RM2's and got negative results, so the surface lead is gone or at least below 0.2%.
I swabbed the test confirmation card that was included as a double check for the negative result and it showed the swab was active so the negative result is verified.
There is exposed brass inside the RM2 below the ceramic where a milling action was done to allow juice flow to the hole with the removed post, around the perimeter of the ceramic at top, and the drilled air hole, but they are a small area for testing.
All those areas turned the same gold color as the outside lathed down area did after the soaking so I assume the surface lead was also removed.

The questions that remain are:
Will surface lead leach into juice? (I have a feeling the answer is yes, especially with citric acid)
If so, is there an appreciable danger since the area exposed to juice is small? (Don't have a clue)
Has the surface lead in my used RM2 already been leached away by juice? (Out of test strips to check)
Once the surface lead has been leached away or removed, will it leach out of the brass to the surface again? (That would increase the likelihood of appreciable danger)
This is probably way "off topic" and if so what sub forum would be the best one to start a thread for this super_X_drifter?
Just thought I would let you know the results.

Thanks AM. As much as I love my RM2s, I've eliminated them from my diet cause I'm trying to cut out anything I can that might be harmful. Cause even after soaking them, we can't be certain about future leaching. It's cool cause there are other great SS BF RBAs that I already either owned or have snapped them up.

I know, I know, I smoked cigs for 30+ years. I have done a lot of other stuff that wasn't exactly chicken soup for my lungs / brain either. Key words are "have done" not "do". Those days are long behind this kid.

BUT now that I am empowered with the ability to control what I inhale, I've decided to reduce any known harmful substances as is practical. It's simple. Anyone else can make their own decision on what they feel is copacetic with their own value system. Rock on. :) chef doan judge.

I still eat a pretty poor diet but inhaling stuff is something I can control to some degree.

I also know that the REO 510 has a brass connector that juice passes thru but I can't eliminate that. It is such a small passage and doesn't heat up, so I accept that and am cool with it.

Hell yes, I'm totally good with this info in our big ol thread. After all, this is the tip of the spear when it comes to RBing A's. It pretty much happens here first then bleeds out into the rest of the vaping world, often convoluted along the way.

Dam Good info AM. Thank you for your diligence.
 

oplholik

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Mar 22, 2011
12,078
33,862
San Bernardino area, So. Cal.
Wow! Good info, I thank you for it. I'm thinking that maybe a soaking in the soloution on a regular basis might be a reasonable precaution to take to avoid having to scrap the RM2's we have. I have 3 of them, and do not like the idea of having to scrap $129 in rda's plus having to put out that much or more to replace them. Looking forward to seeing more discussion and thoughts on this. Thanks again for your efforts here.
 

oplholik

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Mar 22, 2011
12,078
33,862
San Bernardino area, So. Cal.
Dunno at this point scandal, hopefully this will get figured out. As I said, I don't want to scrap mine, as it will mean going back to regular atties. If I have to do that, I'd rather sell the three Reos that I use the RM2's on, and get something to use carto tanks, or clearos on.
 

ScandaLeX

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Aug 6, 2013
12,893
58,154
PhiLLy
Dunno at this point scandal, hopefully this will get figured out. As I said, I don't want to scrap mine, as it will mean going back to regular atties. If I have to do that, I'd rather sell the three Reos that I use the RM2's on, and get something to use carto tanks, or clearos on.

Thank you opl. This thread is too huge to check- has Rob chimed in on this somewhere?
 

Alexander Mundy

Ribbon Twister
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Apr 1, 2013
4,408
26,100
Springfield, MO
Hello All!!

So does this mean our RM2's are no good to use?

To each his own, but I personally am not advocating that and hope I did not come off that way.
Please, no mass hysteria.
To me that would be the equivalent of the ANTZ going after ecig's when there is no evidence they are harmful.
I was merely following up on an "pickling" experiment I said I would perform to attempt to remove any remaining lead on the surface of the exposed brass.
The amount of exposed brass that eliquid comes in contact with in an RM2 is very very small.
I have 2 new unused RM2's that I thought I would "pickle" to see if it removed that small amount of leachable surface lead before I used them.
What I have gathered from googlefu, and making some personal assumptions, is that the small amount of leachable surface lead eliquid comes in contact with is probably gone after a short while of usage.
We have been drinking water from fixtures and valves made of brass all our lives with a huge amount of brass surface exposed compared to this.
There have been concerns lately about the lead content of water that sits in these valves and fixtures, but the primary concern is more relative to children as they are much more susceptible to the effects of lead.
Again, nothing that I am aware of shows that the very small amount of exposed brass to eliquid in an RM2 is harmful.
 

super_X_drifter

ECF Guru
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
Oct 4, 2012
10,635
45,119
Somewhere out there
www.youtube.com
Yeah, I don't think there's any reason to panic. I'm only doing it cause my wife suggested it and because that meant I could shop SS RBAs :)

Rob has weighed in on the subject of brass several times, suggesting that the brass patinas after juice comes in contact with it. He's been in the game for a long time so I agree that there's not much reason for concern. Like I said, I'm eliminating it as a choice, not out of necessity.

Brass has been in vaping since long before I have. There is such a small portion of these devices in contact with the juice anyhoo.

I am no scientist but if all RBA's / Attys / cartos all contained brass id still chose them over cigs.

Think of all the brass mods that are in constant contact with people's hands and drip tips that are constantly sucked.
 

MamaTried

Resting In Peace
ECF Veteran
Verified Member
May 31, 2013
7,404
48,068
Northern California
there is more lead in my local tap water than there ever would be potentially entering my vape juice and I drink that stuff daily.

just my .02

but supe is having so much fun snapping up SS attys with the wife's blessing.


almost makes me want a wife just for the devious pleasure factor.








nah...
:)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread