Rayon Wick - Better Flow, Flavor, Longevity, and Nic Hit!! - Pt.2

[whiteowl84]

Too little and it spits. Bad. Unvapable.
I'm using staples though which are know for their spitting madness. With cotton you need to over wick and rayon is the same way. I've only used too much once.
For a 3mm coil and K-U you need half the width per coil or the entire width for 2.
If you trim right at the coil and thin enough it's totally managable.
But yeah it crazy fluffy.
When you unroll it it's all crinkled. If you pull on it lightly in every direction it'll double in size and get really thick. You can actually get more in the coil that way.

 

[TrollDragon]

I finally found a way to fill mine. Wicked with rayon OFC.

That is one impressive build in the Temple! It's such a beast to fill up the space, but has the airflow for it.

If I ever get enough fused Clapton wire, I'll give that a try for sure.

 

[flambo]

Hi flambo, Thanks for sharing!

Rinsing Rayon before hand takes most all of the break-in away. It really only takes a quick rinse or dip to freshen it. And it drys very quickly so little to no chance of any issue with dampness, like with cotton.

Our tap water is disgusting & I had doubts even about the filtered rainwater I used.
I only steamed it because, I had no idea who or what bagged up this spinning fibre.
Dried it in the fridge.
I guess rinsing with demineralised water would be better.

Tencel is good, just a little more hassle on getting the right amount in the coil. Ive got a bag here, just never go back to it.

I use 2 post RDA, STM RBA (& rebuild clearo coils occcasionally)
I don't even have a "proper" RTA to be able to understand the juice channels issues.
I've seen someone claiming a mix of fibres & rope performed better than FF. (He was very new to the fibre form, and hadn't found his "tencel touch".)
STM RBA is almost idiot-proof.
I've seen an option to mount, slip the sleeve back on, then thread & trim the wick.

My second TC mod forced me to improve my wicking, which is how I accidentally over-thinned for high PG & tested the 100% VG.
(I'd followed these threads' advice for Sally's/Grahams, which is less dense)

For horizontal coils, lightly back-combing the bit that goes in the coil puffs it enough to ensure good contact, and helps move the juice from the centre fibres to the contact fibres.
(fine comb)
FWIW, I've used cheap hair- thinning scissors to thin.

Can you take a macro of the forms you use, plz?

I think they are treated so they are more absorbant, unlike the tencel fibres.
That could explain the amazing longevity of tencel wicks.
lol- I've been tempted to re-use them when I've had to bin Ti coils which can't be dry-burned.
(I'm a building noob- have wire to last lifetimes and still buying ∴ I don't dry burn)

Here, I didn't trust the vendors re-bagging "lyocell" rope, and the shipping cost of Grahams from the US- may as well buy FibreFreaks in bulk. Possible local beauty supplly sources, but I was in a hurry to try rayon before I ran out of "organic" Muji, which stank of pesticide.
I was considering silica Ekowool, because I disliked cotton so much- the taste & I felt slightly ill.
My thing, so far, has been really low tobacco flavours or MFS unflavoured- (honourable mention to TFA Hickory Smoke)
If I hadn't liked TC, I'd have stuck to ss wire for its absence of taste, alone.

imo, the Kotex is still much better than cotton, altho I doubt I'll use it again.

 

[JeremyR]

Our tap water is disgusting & I had doubts even about the filtered rainwater I used.
I only steamed it because, I had no idea who or what bagged up this spinning fibre.
Dried it in the fridge.
I guess rinsing with demineralised water would be better.



I use 2 post RDA. I don't even have a "proper" RTA to be able to understand the juice channels issues.
I've seen someone claiming a mix of fibres & rope performed better than FF. (He was very new to the fibre form, and hadn't found his "tencel touch".)
STM RBA is almost idiot-proof.
I've seen an option to mount, slip the sleeve back on, then thread & trim the wick.

My second TC mod forced me to improve my wicking, which is how I accidentally over-thinned for high PG.
(I'd followed these threads' advice for Sally's/Grahams, which is less dense)

For horizontal coils, lightly back-combing the bit that goes in the coil puffs it enough to ensure good contact, and helps move the juice from the centre fibres to the contact fibres.
(fine comb)
FWIW, I've used hair- thinning scissors to thin.

Can you take a macro of the forms you use, plz?

I think they are treated so they are more absorbant, unlike the tencel fibres.
That could explain the amazing longetivity of tencel wicks.
lol- I've been tempted to re-use them when I've had to bin Ti coils which can't be dry-burned.
(I'm a building noob- have wire to last lifetimes and still buying ∴ I don't dry burn)

Here, I didn't trust the vendors re-bagging "lyocell" rope, and shipping cost of Grahams from the US- may as well buy FibrFreaks in bulk. Possible local beauty supplly sources, but I was in a hurry to try rayon before I ran out of "organic" Muji, which stank of pesticide.
I was considering silica Ekowool, because I disliked cotton so much- taste & felt slightly ill.
My thing, so far, has been really low tobacco flavours or MFS unflavoured- (honourable mention to TFA Hickory Smoke)
If I hadn't liked TC, I'd have stuck to ss wire for its absence of taste, alone.

imo, the Kotex is still much better than cotten, altho I doubt I'll use it again.

I did post some shots of about 8 in the past, ill see if i can find them.

Tencel is a top, which means its directly after the spinnerets in long continuous fibers that havent been touched or milled further. The rayon most of us use have been processed in a mill. Cut, crimped, and carded into the fiber matte. Some of this processing does abrade the surface of the fiber microscopically as its running though the mill.

The crimping, or the curves in the individual fibers, is what gives it more bounce, there are different levels of crimp; which sallys seems to have less crimp than say ku so it meshes together more when wet down.

Tencel is a slightly different rayon in general, with a different manufacturing process.


How long are you talking?

Because we go over 300ml with rayon fibers like sallys. Of course correct density of what ever fiber your using is key. I find each type of rayon does need slightly different density.


On the water thing. Ive only done it a few time and myself dont really find it necessary. My waters not that bad but has chlorine, its wasnt bad when i used tap water. Just use britta filtered water, either tap or picture filtered, in a bowl. Thats plenty good. if you find you like to prep it. drip dry and a couple paper towels make short order of it. Lay it on paper towels after a short drip dry and it will be dry in no time.

 

[Sloth Tonight]

Question, havent encountered this before. Will likely rewick tomorrow but just curious...

So, on day 3 of heavy use on this setup in my squonking atty here. Coils not gunked, rayons not loose (i push on ends and no gap), not too tight, seems perfect and has been for 3 full days. In fact it has been the best vape ive ever had (new to me atty...just mind blowing)

Tonight, when i take a 3 second drag or longer, it tastes bad. Kind of burnt or metallic, dry hit esque.

Checked for hot spots and there are none. Short drags taste fine.

Im baffled. Any ideas as to why thats happening?

 

[whiteowl84]

Is it possible the fire button got mashed in your pocket?
I've had that happen.

 

[vincom]

Question, havent encountered this before. Will likely rewick tomorrow but just curious...

So, on day 3 of heavy use on this setup in my squonking atty here. Coils not gunked, rayons not loose (i push on ends and no gap), not too tight, seems perfect and has been for 3 full days. In fact it has been the best vape ive ever had (new to me atty...just mind blowing)

Tonight, when i take a 3 second drag or longer, it tastes bad. Kind of burnt or metallic, dry hit esque.

Checked for hot spots and there are none. Short drags taste fine.

Im baffled. Any ideas as to why thats happening?

View attachment 614411

for long draws your setup looks to be too thick in the coil and tail, juice is getting choked off where wick is entering coil and/or too much power/high temp setting for those long draws .
thin out wick or decrease power for longer inhales
for short draws that setup would work ok though because theres sufficient juice in the wick/coil for the short duration time of a 3sec drag.
imo until more rayonattis chime in

 

[whiteowl84]

That's what mine look like on my RDTAs when I wick on the deck instead of under it. Actually I have that hole crammed full right now and it's wicking fast enough to chain vape a SSFC at 170w but not so fast it spits or pukes in my mouth. I've been trying to find a happy meduim with RDTAS and rayon and it looks alot like above only I cut right were the coil ends so theres less material. After a week it turns brown in that area so I remove it.

 

[Aal_]

Question, havent encountered this before. Will likely rewick tomorrow but just curious...

So, on day 3 of heavy use on this setup in my squonking atty here. Coils not gunked, rayons not loose (i push on ends and no gap), not too tight, seems perfect and has been for 3 full days. In fact it has been the best vape ive ever had (new to me atty...just mind blowing)

Tonight, when i take a 3 second drag or longer, it tastes bad. Kind of burnt or metallic, dry hit esque.

Checked for hot spots and there are none. Short drags taste fine.

Im baffled. Any ideas as to why thats happening?

View attachment 614411

Hey sloth, sometimes even with the best wicking, if the combination coil length/ diameter / power is wrong, it is very hard to keep up.

If you are sure your legs are properly covered and short, try to change one of those parameters above. It might be that the center of the coil is heating up too much for liquid delivery (especially in a nice tight coil like that).

Just IMO.

 

[cigatron]

Hey sloth, sometimes even with the best wicking, if the combination coil length/ diameter / power is wrong, it is very hard to keep up.

If you are sure your legs are properly covered and short, try to change one of those parameters above. It might be that the center of the coil is heating up too much for liquid delivery (especially in a nice tight coil like that).

Just IMO.

I agree, long contact coils like that are notorious for overheating the center. Not necessarily burning the center but just overheating it causing a metallic dry hit-ish taste.
I'll bet the wick separates in the middle when you go to pull it. Happens a lot with long fused claptons/aliens too.

 

[vincom]

i didnt think of that, yes , space the coils

 

[awsum140]

My eyes are still semi-open, but if you look at that coil it is slightly darker towards the center. That would support the "too much heat in the center of a contact coil". The color difference is subtle, but it's there. I'll join the make it a spaced coil crowd. Try it, as a certain politician once said, what have you got to lose?

 

[Sloth Tonight]

Thanks all. I used spaced coils for about 6 months and switched back recently. I will poke around with this but i doubt thats the problem, my spaced coils got dark on the center first too. Plus the center gets hot first, and this coil practically lights instantly. So i find it confusing x.x well hope its not a need for spaced coils because i find i greatly prefer contact. Thanks for the feedback all...will experiment with your advice.

 

[Aal_]

Or if you are like me, and don't like spaced coils, just make it a bit wider diameter which in turn will make it a bit shorter with the same wire length.

What's the inner diameter anyway?

 

[Sloth Tonight]

You may be right about needing to space or decrease length tho, these are parallel SS coils. On a mech tho, so not crazy powerful. Hmm

 

[Sloth Tonight]

Or if you are like me, and don't like spaced coils, just make it a bit wider diameter which in turn will make it a bit shorter with the same wire length.

What's the inner diameter anyway?

Its 2.5 and unfortunately i cant go bigger in this atty. Its a smaller atty, o 16 little. 2.5 is the biggest z coil i can fit between the posts.

 

[whiteowl84]

Unless that's q 30mm atty that isn't a long coil. What sort of mech?
Before rebuilding just look at the middle of the wick. If it's brown it just got fired really hard.

 

[Sloth Tonight]

Unless that's q 30mm atty that isn't a long coil. What sort of mech?
Before rebuilding just look at the middle of the wick. If it's brown it just got fired really hard.

So heres my setup. Its a 16mm atty on a reo p67 mech squonker. Its a parallel 28g SS coil 2.5mn id 7 wrap. Its .34 ohms

I did just rewick and dry burn. The middle of the wick was a tad dark but the darkness washed out. I just rewicked a little looser. Maybe since its a mech and i squonk it doesnt need to be so full.

Since its a new atty its a bit confusing because im not used to it. Its definitely less airflow than am used to. Thats part of why i like this atty. The small chamber and less airflow is giving amazing flavor. 2Mm airholes on each side so its a DLH but i had 3 on each side in my last atty

Maybe it did get fired too long sometime because for 3 days i didnt have an issue like this, thats what baffles me

We will see how this wick does. Sorry, not super even and pretty

 

[DavidOck]

Any chance of a poor/loose connection anywhere? Would cause wild fluctuations in the power delivered....

 

[cigatron]

Thanks all. I used spaced coils for about 6 months and switched back recently. I will poke around with this but i doubt thats the problem, my spaced coils got dark on the center first too. Plus the center gets hot first, and this coil practically lights instantly. So i find it confusing x.x well hope its not a need for spaced coils because i find i greatly prefer contact. Thanks for the feedback all...will experiment with your advice.

If you're open to suggestion I would like to propose that from a purely electrical standpoint that coils do not fire in the center first. The voltage drop is uniform across the entire length of wire and therefore the wire produces the same watts/mm over it's entire length.
When a coil is unwicked it most certainly gets hotter in the middle first, as you said, but thats due to heatsinking of the metallic posts and greater convected airflow around the ends of the coil. This happens to a lesser degree with unwicked spaced coils because convected air can pass through between the coil wraps.

Ok, so why does a wicked and saturated coil turn the wick darker in the middle sometimes? Some juice get vaporized off as it enters the ends of the coil and more so as it tries to reach the center. Greater length/dia ratio coils exacerbate this problem as you can imagine but so do contact coils where air cannot pass between the wraps.

When wicked correctly and kept to a reasonable length/dia ratio my spaced coil wicks tan or brown evenly down the entire length of the coil, that is, when I don't chain vape the center dry too many times.