American Lung Association lies about risks/benefits of different tobacco products (including e-cigs)
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According to this chart from West & Shiffman based on Cochrane review data, the ALA is pushing the least effective method of all.
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For some reason I can not see the chart but in responding I can see the link for it so am posting it for those like me who see no chart File:Smoking cessation-West&Shiffman.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
According to this chart from West & Shiffman based on Cochrane review data, the ALA is pushing the least effective method of all.
According to this chart from West & Shiffman based on Cochrane review data, the ALA is pushing the least effective method of all.
I agree but don't they do a good job of raising money?
Without their backing, the Govs can't try to force people into sticking with traditional tobacco cigs for the tax money.
I would love to see all of these "authorities" on the witness stand. The lawyer could start the first week off by going through the 4000 count list of toxins/chemicals in the traditional cigarette.
"Please answer yes or no only please"
"Do eCigs carry Tar?"
"Do eCigs carry formalgahide?" (sp)
"Do eCigs carry rat poison?"
hmmmm, maybe he'll need 2 weeks for that list.
Then the grand finale
"Are traditional cigs safer than ecigs?"
I would love to see all of these "authorities" on the witness stand. The lawyer could start the first week off by going through the 4000 count list of toxins/chemicals in the traditional cigarette.
"Please answer yes or no only please"
"Do eCigs carry Tar?"
"Do eCigs carry formalgahide?" (sp)
"Do eCigs carry rat poison?"
hmmmm, maybe he'll need 2 weeks for that list.
Then the grand finale
"Are traditional cigs safer than ecigs?"
Meh - they'd just answer each question with what they've been saying all along, "We don't know...."
I'd rather hear this line of questioning:
Lawyer: Dr. Antz, you and the groups you receive funding from have publically opposed e-cigarettes as a safer alternative to smoking. Is that correct?
Dr. Antz: Yes, because we don't know if they are really a safe and effective way to quit smoking.
Lawyer: Dr. Antz, you were given funding by anti-smoking organizations, who themselves are funded by Big Pharma, to test e-cigarettes. Is that correct?
Dr. Antz: Yes we tested e-cigarettes, but I don't know where all of the funding comes from.
Lawyer: Right. So what, exactly, did you discover?
Dr. Antz: We discovered that e-cigarettes can leak and that the labels are sometimes inaccurate about the nicotine content. We also discovered that very little nicotine is delivered to the user via e-cigarettes, based on our method of having them use the unfamiliar, low-quality devices just like they would traditional cigarettes. And we discovered that there are other nicotine-related impurities found in the liquid. And don't forget that we found tobacco-specific nitrosamines, too.
Lawyer: Are those nicotine impurities or nitrosamines harmful to humans?
Dr. Antz: In the right amount they might be.
Lawyer: They "might" be harmful in the right amount? Did you find them to be "in the right amount" to be harmful?
Dr. Antz: Well...no....
Lawyer: Did you find any other impurities or toxins in the samples you tested?
Dr. Antz: Yes! We found diethylene glycol in one sample. That is highly toxic to humans and found in antifreeze!
Lawyer: Really!? Did you find the "right levels" of diethylene glycol to be toxic to humans and has it been found in any more samples?
Dr. Antz: (inaudible)
Lawyer: I'm sorry, I didn't catch that.
Dr. Antz: No.
Lawyer: "No" to both. And since your group didn't report it, it's safe to assume that no other impurities or potentially dangerous levels of chemicals were found?
Dr. Antz: Not yet.
Lawyer: Alright, so, with all of the resources you have at your disposal, you've discovered a few leaky or mislabeled cartridges and some chemicals in amounts non-toxic and non-carcinogenic to humans. Would that be fair to say, Dr. Antz?
Dr. Antz: I guess you could look at it that way....
Lawyer: Yes or no, Doctor.
Dr. Antz: Yes.
Lawyer: One more question. The groups you represent - the ones who fund your research - have implied that e-cigarettes might contain dangerous chemicals and be just as dangerous as tobacco smoking....
Dr. Antz: We don't know...more research needs to be done...
Lawyer: Exactly, Doctor! So, tell the jury why you didn't do THAT research?? Since you just admitted that more research needs to be done, explain to the court, Doctor, why didn't you actually test e-cigarettes for dangerous levels of chemicals; or cancer-causing levels of chemicals; or compare the toxicity of e-cigarette vapor compared with cigarette smoke; or even interview the hundreds of thousands of former smokers - who have now been using e-cigarettes for a few years - to see if they are having any adverse reactions??
Dr. Antz: No, but....
Lawyer: In fact, you weren't even trying to discover if e-cigarettes are safe and effective, because even the good members of the jury can figure that out. All these tests were designed for is to scare customers away from e-cigarettes and back to Big Pharma products which pay for your research. Isn't that right, Dr. Antz??
Dr. Antz: Of course not!
Lawyer: I rest my case.
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Glad to see that I'm not the only one who holds fantasy conversations with the enemy.
Yup, it is priceless, but the enemy can look at it too and plan what their answers would be. Maybe all the legal threads should be accessible to signed in members only.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Jerry, they may read it and plan a defense, but any good lawyer could drill through any level of garbage they my offer. Unless, of course, they had additional studies peer reviewed by other ANTZ then provided as news bites for the 5 o'clock news. Then they'd have a growing body of "something" the was irrefutable.
Yes, the charging ecig looked odd, but there's another unfortunate blooper, IMO.
This bullet note? It leads one to believe that ecigs can cause transition to something that will actually hurt you.
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Youth that discover nicotine from ecigs may later switch to the nasties?
Is that kinda like youth that discover cooking on electric stove may later switch to a dirty coal burner like grandma.
Is that kinda like youth that discover cooking on electric stove may later switch to a dirty coal burner like grandma.
The thing is, they really don't HAVE any good answers.
That's kinda the point here.
We have seen how they twist insignificant findings to suit their agenda, such as "a minute amount of Diethylene Glycol was found in one e-cigarette tested", has become "e-cigarettes contain DG an ingredient found in anti-freeze". They also create total fabrications and spout them as the truth, such as "e-cigarettes are a gateway to cigarette smoking for children".
It's true that a good lawyer can tear these untruths and fabrications to pieces, but why should they have to.
I'm serious, I really would like to see the Electronic Cigarette News section be only available to signed in members and out of the view of the enemy.
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I suggest the CASAA book club! First on the reading list to help with the "battle" at hand, an ancient classic with a longterm track record of unprecedented success!
I honestly believe the Sun Tzu and its timeless wisdom SHOULD be applied here -- with profound possibilities! Take this ex. of the wisdom!
This may sound absurd, but these are all tactics I'm sure are ALREADY being used on us... The Art of War itself is mandatory reading for a lot of business and law students. The institution(s) by their very nature -- are well organized, versed, funded. We'll make a Star Wars reference here and say the Empire is ready to crush the Rebellion. When the Death Star finally does fire, the galaxy’s going to tremble and it's going to take a hell of alot more than a Jedi mind trick to prove these aren't the droids you are looking for!
I honestly believe the Sun Tzu and its timeless wisdom SHOULD be applied here -- with profound possibilities! Take this ex. of the wisdom!
This may sound absurd, but these are all tactics I'm sure are ALREADY being used on us... The Art of War itself is mandatory reading for a lot of business and law students. The institution(s) by their very nature -- are well organized, versed, funded. We'll make a Star Wars reference here and say the Empire is ready to crush the Rebellion. When the Death Star finally does fire, the galaxy’s going to tremble and it's going to take a hell of alot more than a Jedi mind trick to prove these aren't the droids you are looking for!
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I suggest the CASAA book club! First on the reading list to help with the "battle" at hand, an ancient classic with a longterm track record of unprecedented unsuccess!
This may sound absurd, but these are all tactics I'm sure are ALREADY being used on us... The Art of War itself is mandatory reading for a lot of business and law students. The institution(s) by their very nature -- are well organized, versed, funded. We'll make a Star Wars reference here and say the Empire is ready to crush the Rebellion. When the Death Star finally does fire, the galaxys going to tremble and it's going to take a hell of alot more than a Jedi mind trick to prove these aren't the droids you are looking for!
I would be interested in your analysis of the war tactics that are employed by the DOT in its Proposed Rule banning the use of e-cigarettes on planes.
To read the 15-page document filed by DOT, go to this page: Regulations.gov
And then click on the PDFbutton under the "View As" column heading.
I suggest the CASAA book club! First on the reading list to help with the "battle" at hand, an ancient classic with a longterm track record of unprecedented unsuccess!
I honestly believe the Sun Tzu and its timeless wisdom SHOULD be applied here -- with profound possibilities! Take this ex. of the wisdom!
This may sound absurd, but these are all tactics I'm sure are ALREADY being used on us... The Art of War itself is mandatory reading for a lot of business and law students. The institution(s) by their very nature -- are well organized, versed, funded. We'll make a Star Wars reference here and say the Empire is ready to crush the Rebellion. When the Death Star finally does fire, the galaxy’s going to tremble and it's going to take a hell of alot more than a Jedi mind trick to prove these aren't the droids you are looking for!
Also 6. Any military operation takes deception as its basic quality. Confuse the enemy with false information.
I see they're still teaching Sun Tzu in business school.
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