Bans, bans, bans!
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See that's the problem with cessation programs that were designed by non-smokers and approved for the rest of us. After all these years they have come to understand this and finally now NRT is approved for long term use.
It's empowering to be in charge of your own cessation and do what is right for you without a bunch of medical people wagging their finger at you to hurry up and get off the nicotine. Nic does me way more good than harm as long as I don't have to smoke in order to have it.
But Senator Harumph totally agrees with Senator Snort, so it must be true, right?
A growing meme is also colors. Adults apparently don't like colors. I think this started from Barbara Boxer but others are now using it:
h ttp://www.cachevalleydaily.com/news/article_c50af150-ad97-11e3-91f1-0017a43b2370.html
It's not an all-or-nothing kind of thing, here.. Come on
An entity can be pretty powerful -- but not have all-encompassing power
Besides, BT is not the only player, either.. Other groups are also competing for their own self-interests...
BT fought off the cigarette bans for many years. If not for their lobbying all bans would have began much earlier. It seems like a long time now but 25 years ago cigarettes were only banned in theaters and elevators. Those of us that smoked would do it everywhere, grocery markets, office buildings and such.
It was these bans from smoking outside that ticked me off although I saw it coming, for if no other reason, people disposing their cigarette butts by tossing them wherever they pleased, especially right outside building entrances.
BT has been trying but losing their battles little by little.
It was these bans from smoking outside that ticked me off although I saw it coming, for if no other reason, people disposing their cigarette butts by tossing them wherever they pleased, especially right outside building entrances.
BT has been trying but losing their battles little by little.
I didn't read where anyone called someone in this thread an ANTZ. The use of the word "analog" on ECF is nothing more than a colloquialism used on this forum, which makes your comment laughable.
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I have to agree, WV.
While both Steve and Zoid (among others) have both made their objections to the term "ANTZ" quite clear, this new objection seems odd. The term "analogs" is a sign of a militant vaper?? Oh well, you can lump me in with the occupy crowd, then. They would be quite offended to be tied to an elitist, money-grubbing, corporate stooge like me, but okay....
I won't stop using either term, naturally. I have always viewed their gripe with "ANTZ" as a principled one, and I even understand it. I happen to agree with the assertion that we shouldn't call other vapers that term. I reserve that term for people like Stanton Glantz.
That said....Steve is way off the reservation with the term "analogs" being anything more than a general vaping term.
Roaring thunderously via Tapatalk...
You are being generous, Ed. He is way "off the reservation", as shown by the above statement, to a much larger degree. There are those who are working diligently to have vaping banned everywhere possible who would find him a wonderful addition to their little "bund"
I've noticed that even the media is picking up on the use of the word "analog" for tobacco cigarettes. I'm always encouraged when they do, because it means they are looking further into the vaping culture and not just repeating what they hear from the tobacco control folks.
Those militant vaping media types, eh?
Those media guys really remind me of the Occupy Wall Street crowd when they talk like that!
Roaring thunderously via Tapatalk...
Even with all the bans and all the taxes and all the evidence that smoking kills, Big Tobacco still pulls in BILLIONS each year. So the bans and the taxes, etc.....just the cost of doing business.
people died. lots and lots of people died. for decade upon decade. then the truth got to them and their families. we're still supposedly in a democracy. although, the system is broken from my point of view, a militant coop the nation over is something that's highly motivational in terms of avoidance.
people in power are very good at pulling the wool over your eyes. do you really think the tobacco companies bared the brunt of that legislation and those taxes... or even the class action or civil suits?
hell no! we, the people... the smokers... we're the ones that have to hide our habits. the factories and farms are still where they were to begin with.
we, the people are the ones that watched as our beloved, deadly addiction went from just over a buck and a quarter a pack to over $6 a pack in just about a decade... little step by little step.
yeah, sure... when the class action hit, it might have been big tobacco that gave the big payout, but we've paid them back in spades and guess what. OUR LOVED ONES HAVE NOT RETURNED FROM THEIR GRAVES NO MATTER HOW MUCH EXTRA A PACK OF MARLBORO COSTS.
if prohibition taught us anything, it should be obvious that;
1 the working class doesn't give up their vices easily
2 we're willing to fight for them
3 more often than not, we're willing to make great sacrifices for them
4 often, people are willing to alienate, even completely give up their loved ones for them
BT knows this. it's their job to do so. they also know how to make it seem like a bunch of little blows to keep their customer base rather than one big one and lose them. the way the prices and taxes raised in stages allowed for us to get used to each stage and accept it before the next one came along. it eased us into working harder for the next pack we secretly get to smoke in hiding in the comforts of our last remaining safe haven... our own homes.
wake up, steve. the truth is out there...
Money = Power =money =power =big tobacco interest with a lot of money=Power =more legislation to curb their losses and loss of money=power =money big Money....sad I know..
We need a Full, Robust, and organized resistance....Believe it or not radicals have a place strategically in any real movement. Malcolm X, Bobby Seale, Huey Newton, etc...made MLK's non-violent requests for equality seem particularly reasonable by comparison. The big hurdle is organization on multiple levels and We are fortunate that the "Old-timers" here founded and launched CASAA with those purposes in mind. I'm all for Diversity in our resistance as long as no one behaves like an .......
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Steve-o. Really?
It was simply cheaper for BT to "buy" their way out of this rather than keep litigating and suffering the barrage of bad press. You can't keep fighting a government that just prints their own money whenever they need it.
) So... Big Tobacco pays a settlement to be left alone and they simply pass on the cost. Easy as pie. Guaranteed reimbursement for those costs because we were addicted and still bought the damn things. Everybody won (Except us).What you should be asking is why did your elected officials allow themselves to be bought off. All of a sudden it wasn't about our health or our kids' health anymore. LOL!
KODIAK™;12571790 said:Steve-o. Really?
It was simply cheaper for BT to "buy" their way out of this rather than keep litigating and suffering the barrage of bad press. You can't keep fighting a government that just prints their own money whenever they need it.
!
^^^This is So True^^^
I will go even further. I know a few "militant vapers" here on ECF. I don't approve of their methods, but I don't try to stop them, either. Some of them are seen as A-holes.
I thank them for fighting the good fight as they see fit to.
Roaring thunderously via Tapatalk...
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Yeah, the truth is they pretty much no longer have any power, don't bother donating in any significant way to politicians and don't spend much lobbying anymore. The people who are proposing the anti vaping legislation aren't even the ones who accept donations from BT- whether in the open, or sacks full of cash, as some seem to believe...
KODIAK™;12571790 said:Steve-o. Really?
It was simply cheaper for BT to "buy" their way out of this rather than keep litigating and suffering the barrage of bad press. You can't keep fighting a government that just prints their own money whenever they need it.
What you should be asking is why did your elected officials allow themselves to be bought off. All of a sudden it wasn't about our health or our kids' health anymore. LOL!
They bought their way out of smoking prohibitions? How so? I remember when smoking was allowed just about everywhere. People smoked far more than they do now, BT made far more than they do now.
Master Settlement Agreement back in '98(?). $200 billion over 25 years. (roughly and with caveats).
I beg to differ. Without sleuthing for facts, I'm guessing they make *a lot* more now than they did even 20 years ago. There are other major markets besides the U.S. All BT did was put more emphasis on peddling their wares elsewhere. (It's why the Greeks and Russians only live to age 29.
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