Beginner MTL coil buid.

[Coyote628]

You'll get a variety of response from different people because they have different preferences. When people talk about what gives a "satisfying" vape. They are talking about what is satisfying for THEM. It is different for everyone. What one person finds satisfying may not be good at all for another person.

I would get 28 AWG and 30 AWG. I would not use 32 -- it is VERY thin and used in tiny pods devices like the Myblu pod.

For MTL, I would not recommend anything larger than 28 AWG for 316L. If you look at "heat capacity" on Steam Engine | free vaping calculators you'll see that it is green for 30 AWG 316L wire at 1 Ohm. It will be yellow or red with thicker wire.

My own preferences are similar to those posted by @Hawise. Except that I use an 8 wrap coil in the Galaxies RDTA. I close off the air flow a lot for a true MTL vape so the thin 30 AWG wire helps keep the heat down. I vape at 12 Watts or less. I use 2.5 ID, 8 wrap, spaced 30 AWG 316L.

28 AWG is easier to work with since it is slightly thicker and doesn't deform as easily. But I prefer the performance of 30 AWG for MTL.

Others have completely different preferences. Some like wide open air flow. Some like thick wire. Some like running at 20 Watts or higher and lots of heat.

MY personal preference, and im just weird like that, is 22ga kanthal. I do 7 wraps on a 2.5mm mandrel, and use dual coil setup, gets me .19 to .23 ohms. I do DL and varying airflow, depending on the atty of the day. And depending on juice flavor, ill vape anywhere from 65 to 85 watts. I get fairly massive clouds and big flavor with this and thats what i enjoy. But like i said, im kinda weird that way.

 

[Coyote628]

Ive had the same set of coils on my rdta for months. Dont even remember how many. The 22ga plain kanthal i use cleans off nicely, that may be the biggest reason i go that thick on my wire guage. They dont deform much when im cleaning and rewicking either, if any at all. I might need to push them back in position occasionally but they havent lost their shape at all. I learned this stuff by experimenting and messing around with it. And i kinda bought the 22ga stuff kinda on accident, lol. But im one to not let machinery beat me and i tweaked out a setup that works just fine for me.

 

[smoked25years]

MY personal preference, and im just weird like that, is 22ga kanthal. I do 7 wraps on a 2.5mm mandrel, and use dual coil setup, gets me .19 to .23 ohms. I do DL and varying airflow, depending on the atty of the day. And depending on juice flavor, ill vape anywhere from 65 to 85 watts. I get fairly massive clouds and big flavor with this and thats what i enjoy. But like i said, im kinda weird that way.

No worries. There's no wrong or right way to vape. MTL or DTL is fine. Since the OP want to vape MTL, his build will need to be different though.

 

[Coyote628]

No worries. There's no wrong or right way to vape. MTL or DTL is fine. Since the OP want to vape MTL, his build will need to be different though.

But of course. Just throwing my 2 cents in there.

 

[DaveP]

Basically i’d like to get beetween 0.8 and 1.6ohm coil.
It can be khantal but i’d prefer SS to be able to use it in TC.
So i’d like your advices on which wire to use, what gauge, the diameter of the coils, the number of wraps and maybe the type of cotton to buy.

Start with the easy coils and work your way into other designs if you feel you need to. Kanthal is somewhere around double the resistance per inch of wire as Stainless (given that gauge is equal). SS316L is popular because a 2.5mm coil with 10 wraps will give you something close to 1 ohm and fewer wraps or a smaller coil diameter will take you lower and still maintain a wrap count that will produce good flavor.

Kanthal wrap count will be too low to vape at .5 ohms. At .5 ohms you would have to build a 2mm coil with about 3 wraps (rounded). In that range you need to switch to a lower gauge Kanthal wire or use the same gauge with SS316L and 5 to 6 wraps. Play with www.Steam-Engine.org for a while and the relationships sill become apparent.

Taste is subjective, IMO. I used Kanthal for a long time until TC mode came on the scene. I switched to SS and found that TC mode didn't impress me for flavor and vapor (pretty much equal). I didn't see anything in TC mode that power mode couldn't provide, so I switched back and forth for a while and settled down in Power mode again with SS316L.

I'm also a MTL vaper, but I vape in sub-ohm MTL mode at 8W to 12W, mostly 10W. I like the flavor best with a coil from .5 ohms to .7 ohms.

 

[CagedSpam]

Maybe I'm off base but a conversations about coil building is not complete without discussing the RDA/RTA you are building for. I feel like some RDAs can be challenging to coil for MTL until you know what coil to use.

<---Certified .5ish ohms MTL vaper. Love these threads btw.

 

[UlkaHuren]

Its been awhile since I’ve done MTL, but if I were to setup for that and I do primarily TC vape, I would get a Vandy Vape Berserker MTL RTA. As for coils I used a 2mm coil of 5 wraps of twisted 28g stainless. The thing to remember is that stainless measures a lot less than Kanthal in ohms, but performs at the same power. So 0.8 in stainless would be more like 0.4 ohm. Always space the coil, especially with twisted and more so for TC mode and stainless. Any variance because of touching wraps will be a bad vape. This should vape good around 20-25W in TC mode. If you want more power then you could do the same coil as above with stainless 28/32 clapton wire.

Why twisted? It’s cheap and easy to twist up on a drill. It also vapes like a larger wire, but heats up faster because it has less metal. It’s about as fancy as you can get with lower power.


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[Janusz]

Thank you for the detailed explaination.
I want to use SS mostly for it’s versatility.
But at the end i think i’m just gonna try a bunch of stuff like both 26 khantal and 30 SS, both spaced and contact coils and from 2 to 3 ID to see what i like the most.
I got a question tho, how long will a coil last
approximately?

Thicker the wire the longer coil will last... but... it is somewhat safer and sometimes even faster to build and install new coil than properly dry burn and clean old one.

I do not know if you realize how thin and flimsy 30 gauge wire is... installing and wicking such coil even for experienced vaper is really PITA... 30 gauge wire is 0.25 mm (quarter of 1mm)... if you even slightly touch it your coil legs will bend... if your cotton will not have good contact with wire you will have poor vaping experience and wicking it snuggly is big chalenge as pulling it through will mangle the coil legs or coil itself... proper wicking is no less important that diameter, number of wraps or kind of metal wire... for satisfactory vape it is in my opinion more important than your chosen resistance range...

If you plan to use tank that provide true/proper MTL you have to be aware that hole under your coil will be no bigger than 1.6 mm and on some tanks even smaller... so this tiny airflow hole will not work very well with 3 mm diameter coil... the same is true about smaller diameter holes with 10 or more wraps... air will not hit the entire lenght of coil evenly and a lot of juice on ends of coil will be boiled not vaporized causing a lot of spitbacks crackling noises... If you raise your coil up you will mitigate somewhat that problem but flavor will be muted...

On some well regarded on this forum for exceptional flavor MTL RTAs build deck is so small that you will not be able to fit 3mm diameter coils... even 2.5 mm when placed low to airflow hole is a small challenge... but if you insist on using 30gauge wire I wish you luck...and... patience...

 

[papergoblin]

I don't do SS or TC. However for Kanthal the wire gauge will be determined by ohms and how many coils your are running.

Example .5 ohm single coil in 22GA 3mm ID 8 wraps, the same with 26GA is 3.5 wraps, so 22GA would be better. Now if running dual coil you'd double the wraps, in 22GA you'd have 2 coils with 16 wraps and in 26GA you'd have 2 coils with 7 wraps, so 26GA would be better.

 

[Janusz]

Its been awhile since I’ve done MTL, but if I were to setup for that and I do primarily TC vape, I would get a Vandy Vape Berserker MTL RTA. As for coils I used a 2mm coil of 5 wraps of twisted 28g stainless. The thing to remember is that stainless measures a lot less than Kanthal in ohms, but performs at the same power. So 0.8 in stainless would be more like 0.4 ohm. Always space the coil, especially with twisted and more so for TC mode and stainless. Any variance because of touching wraps will be a bad vape. This should vape good around 20-25W in TC mode. If you want more power then you could do the same coil as above with stainless 28/32 clapton wire.

Why twisted? It’s cheap and easy to twist up on a drill. It also vapes like a larger wire, but heats up faster because it has less metal. It’s about as fancy as you can get with lower power.


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I agree. Twisted wire is really easy to make and perfect solution for high gauge (28 or 30) wire that alone is PITA to use.

 

[BrotherBob]

Thx for the answer.
I think i’ll try a setup similar to yours as i like a restrictive MTL vape at a low wattage.

In General lower ohm coils/higher wattage vaping will:
More Expensive
Heat The Coil Faster
Produce More Vapor, can mute taste (coat mouth/build up)
Drain The Battery Faster/shorten life
Use E-Juice Faster
Produce A Warmer Tasting Vape
Shorten Coil Life
Shorten Wick Life
May Produce more Dry Hits
Uses more liquid
May be less healthier - higher temps.
May Produce Spit Back
More PV Maintenance/Issues
More irritation to non vapers (tends create more negative comments regarding cloud production)
More exposure to carcinogens at high temps

In General higher ohm coils/lower wattage (generally MTL) vaping will:
Heat the coil slower, which may produce “less” vapor
Provide A “cooler” tasting vape, can produce more flavor
May use less E-Juice (<$ less money)
Prolong battery life (<$)
Prolong coil life (<$)
Prolong wick life (<$)
Uses less liquid
Less likely spit back
May result in less PV maintenance/Issues
Less irritation to non vapers
Aids stealth vaping
Less exposure to carcinogens at high temps

Low ohm coil is between 1.5-1.8ohms and a standard ohm coil is generally between 2.4-2.8 and high ohm is anything 3.0 ohms or higher
What Ohms should I choose?
Resistance is Futile - Vapor Connection LLC | Pittsburgh's Premiere Vapor Shop & Lounge
What Ohms should I choose?
Efficiency. Thinner wire and higher resistance VS thick wire and lower resistance
Higher Resistance, Lower Wattage vs Lower Resistance, Higher Wattage
The Vaper`s Guide to Flavour Chasing: 10 Tips To Maximise Flavour

 

[Janusz]

I don't do SS or TC. However for Kanthal the wire gauge will be determined by ohms and how many coils your are running.

Example .5 ohm single coil in 22GA 3mm ID 8 wraps, the same with 26GA is 3.5 wraps, so 22GA would be better.

No! Not for MTL Tank.

 

[Janusz]

Low ohm coil is between 1.5-1.8ohms and a standard ohm coil is generally between 2.4-2.8 and high ohm is anything 3.0 ohms or higher

 

[papergoblin]

No! Not for MTL Tank.

Reread my post, I said example, to show wire choice is dependent on coil, single or dual and ohms. I never said build this or that for MTL, however I've MTL .5 before. It all depends on the atty and wattage ran.

Right now I can MTL my Sapor with a .41 build at 34.2 W, which is 3.7 V. Gives a very cool vape or I can crank it up and do a DL.

 

[Shakur92]

Excellent. Experimentation is the way to go. I expect you'll find yourself fiddling with the wicking a lot as well.



The coil itself will last indefinitely. It'll work until you happen to damage it, and I've heard of people using coils a few years old. I usually eventually deform it while I'm pulling out old wicking, although in theory you can pop the coil (overheat it so it breaks - usually while dry burning) or overheat it in a way that damages it (it may have a significantly different room-temperature resistance or not work in TC properly).

The wick is another story. I have to rewick and clean the coil after a few days. How many days you get will depend on the same factors that affect the life of a drop-in coil - your juice, your settings, and how much you vape. I find I have to rewick and clean a bit more often than I changed drop-in coils

Thx for the answer. That’s nice to know.
One more thing, can i put any blend e-juice?
Or do i have to use specific blend depending on the ohms like premade coils?
Thx for your time.

 

[Shakur92]

Start with the easy coils and work your way into other designs if you feel you need to. Kanthal is somewhere around double the resistance per inch of wire as Stainless (given that gauge is equal). SS316L is popular because a 2.5mm coil with 10 wraps will give you something close to 1 ohm and fewer wraps or a smaller coil diameter will take you lower and still maintain a wrap count that will produce good flavor.

Kanthal wrap count will be too low to vape at .5 ohms. At .5 ohms you would have to build a 2mm coil with about 3 wraps (rounded). In that range you need to switch to a lower gauge Kanthal wire or use the same gauge with SS316L and 5 to 6 wraps. Play with www.Steam-Engine.org for a while and the relationships sill become apparent.

Taste is subjective, IMO. I used Kanthal for a long time until TC mode came on the scene. I switched to SS and found that TC mode didn't impress me for flavor and vapor (pretty much equal). I didn't see anything in TC mode that power mode couldn't provide, so I switched back and forth for a while and settled down in Power mode again with SS316L.

I'm also a MTL vaper, but I vape in sub-ohm MTL mode at 8W to 12W, mostly 10W. I like the flavor best with a coil from .5 ohms to .7 ohms.

Thx for the answer.
I’ll try both Khantal and SS to see which one i like the most.

 

[Janusz]

I never said build this or that for MTL, however I've MTL .5 before. It all depends on the atty and wattage ran.

Right now I can MTL my Sapor with a .41 build at 34.2 W, which is 3.7 V.

I can MTL at 0.5ohm........................ not a problem.....but not with 22 gauge, 3mm , 8 wraps... my AF hole in my doggystyle or dwarw or Gotank is no bigger than 2mm in diameter... I will not fit 3mm diameter 8 wraps 22 gauge wire (the lenght of coil even if not spaced would be over 5mm) in any of my MTL RTA tank. Even If I would fit such coil ramp up time would be very annoying at wattage that will give me not hot vape... OP clearly indicated he wants to use true MTL not MTL done in DTL tank...

 

[Shakur92]

Maybe I'm off base but a conversations about coil building is not complete without discussing the RDA/RTA you are building for. I feel like some RDAs can be challenging to coil for MTL until you know what coil to use.

<---Certified .5ish ohms MTL vaper. Love these threads btw.

Maybe I'm off base but a conversations about coil building is not complete without discussing the RDA/RTA you are building for. I feel like some RDAs can be challenging to coil for MTL until you know what coil to use.

<---Certified .5ish ohms MTL vaper. Love these threads btw.

Hey, thx for the answer.
I didn’t buy any yet as i don’t know much, but if you have any suggestions on a good one for beginners like with a simple deck and easy to build coils on, i’d gladly take it. Peace.

 

[Shakur92]

Its been awhile since I’ve done MTL, but if I were to setup for that and I do primarily TC vape, I would get a Vandy Vape Berserker MTL RTA. As for coils I used a 2mm coil of 5 wraps of twisted 28g stainless. The thing to remember is that stainless measures a lot less than Kanthal in ohms, but performs at the same power. So 0.8 in stainless would be more like 0.4 ohm. Always space the coil, especially with twisted and more so for TC mode and stainless. Any variance because of touching wraps will be a bad vape. This should vape good around 20-25W in TC mode. If you want more power then you could do the same coil as above with stainless 28/32 clapton wire.

Why twisted? It’s cheap and easy to twist up on a drill. It also vapes like a larger wire, but heats up faster because it has less metal. It’s about as fancy as you can get with lower power.


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Thx for the suggestions, i’ll take a look at those.

 

[TrollDragon]

For the tc i got a Smok Qbox that does it in SS,

Don't expect to have a positive experience with TC on any Smok, iJoy or Sigelei mods. They all have a very poor implementation of TC, with the iJoy being basically non functional.