Dailyvaper article - what do you think?

[rokyo87]

An article in DailyVaper from THR activist Carl V. Phillips:

SCIENCE LESSON: ANCHORING BIAS AND THE MISTAKE OF COMPARING SMOKING TO VAPING

I didn't brake the link because it's not junk science but I don't agree with the writing.

Carl V. Phillips mentioned that "95% less harmful" claim is misleading because this claim is exaggarated in a bad way. His opinion is that e-cigarettes are more likely 99,9% less harmful than tobacco cigarettes. I don't agree with this. We know a lot about e-cigarettes but we are far from knowing all about e-cigarettes. To date we can almost definitely say that e-cigarettes are less harmful than smoking tobacco cigarettes but we can't say that they are almost harmless as he wants to say in the article. We are still inhaling something into our lungs which is not intended for inhaling. We are still heating various chemicals with various wires and then inhaling them. I don't think this is harmless. Maybe even 95% claim is too much of a claim. Maybe just "safer than smoking cigarettes" would be better. But maybe he is right. Maybe I am. Nobody knows at the moment. What do you think?

 

[Kent C]

 

[Katya]

Study: Vaping Is '5,700 Times Less Dangerous Than Smoking' - Health Thoroughfare

Pick a number, any number...

 

[Rossum]

Pick a number, any number...

42.

I suppose we don't really know to quantify it accurately, but I'm confident vaping is not just "safer" than smoking cigarettes, but "much safer".

Besides, what do we mean by vaping? A few milliliters a day, minimally flavored, using temperature control, and barely inhaled? Or 10's of milliliters a day, heavy on questionable flavorings, at triple-digit wattage, using lung-busting inhales? If there are residual hazards to vaping, I'd expect them to manifest in those who favor the latter style first.

 

[rokyo87]

42.

I suppose we don't really know to quantify it accurately, but I'm confident vaping is not just "safer" than smoking cigarettes, but "much safer".

Besides, what do we mean by vaping? A few milliliters a day, minimally flavored, using temperature control, and barely inhaled? Or 10's of milliliters a day, heavy on questionable flavorings, at triple-digit wattage, using lung-busting inhales? If there are residual hazards to vaping, I'd suspect them to manifest in those who favor the latter style first.

I agree with you to some degree but I still have doubts about a lots of things in vaping. For example we inhale a lots of VG and PG. In fact we inhale it more than anyone in history and we don't know what would this bring in the future. As second we are inhaling VG and PG from heated wires (SS, Titanium, Kanthal,...) and we don't know if those heated wires will have any bad consequences on our bodies. We don't know how PG & VG reacts with those metal wires when heated let alone with flavours. And as third we don't really have long term studies of inhaled nicotine. Yes we have but inhaled through cigarettes. Yes we have but with SNUS where nicotine is absorbed through digestive tract and not through inhaling.

I suppose today we can say that vaping is safer than smoking but I am not so confident in saying "much" safer. Why not? Because vaping is at existence for about 14 years and in broad use for about 10 years. That's nothing compared to the length of human life (cca 80 years). And in science we are searching for things which we don't know and even tomorrow we can find something what will make vaping less safe or in pair with smoking.

I don't want to be rude but this is cruel reality and this is just my opinion on things around vaping. I hope I am wrong and afraid that I am right because I like vaping and nicotine very much and I don't want to be "forced" to quit like I was with smoking (which I liked too) because is so super bad for my health.

 

[marianna]

We are still heating various chemicals with various wires and then inhaling them. I don't think this is harmless.

Okay, so I will stop cooking immediately, cause for already more than 45 years I am inhaling food grade chemicals in metal pans.

 

[Rossum]

I don't want to be rude but this is cruel reality and this is just my opinion on things around vaping. I hope I am wrong and afraid that I am right because I like vaping and nicotine very much and I don't want to be "forced" to quit like I was with smoking (which I liked too) because is so super bad for my health.

I smoked for 36 years. It's been darn near 4 years since I switched to vaping. I know how much better I feel, hence my personal assessment that vaping is much safer than smoking.

There was also a recent 3+ year study in Italy of a small group of vapers who were never-smokers. Guess what that study found? Nothing.

 

[Katya]

And in science we are searching for things which we don't know and even tomorrow we can find something what will make vaping less safe or in pair with smoking.

True, which is why I choose to stay informed, but so far, vaping has proven to be an excellent tobacco harm reduction product, just like Swedish snus. But it is just that--tobacco harm reduction strategy, not harm elimination. If you want to be 100% sure, you'll just have to quit altogether.

There are other ways to further reduce potential dangers of vaping, if you're concerned:

1. Minimize exposure. Don't inhale (nicotine is very well absorbed through the mucosal linings in the nose and mouth), or inhale infrequently. Avoid direct-to-lung vaping and big clouds; MTL + higher nicotine concentration is a safer way to vape.

2. Reduce temperature of your coils. PG and VG are just sugar/alcohol molecules that are common and easily metabolized by our bodies. PG/VG are considered safe unless heated above ~420°F or so, where some carcinogenic aldehydes have been detected in vapor (formaldehyde, acetaldehyde and acrolein). Buy a temperature control mod if you want to be absolutely sure.

3. Minimize or avoid unnecessary additives in your e-liquids--flavorings, colorings, and sweeteners. If you can, just vape unflavored or barely flavored juices, and avoid diketones (diacetyl, acetyl propionyl and acetoin).

Evaluation of Electronic Cigarette Liquids and Aerosol for the Presence of Selected Inhalation Toxins

The median level of exposure is lower compared to tobacco cigarettes by 1–2 orders of magnitude, confirming their role as tobacco harm reduction products. However, any risk from exposure to DA and AP by EC use is totally avoidable, by using alternative compounds, and this was evident from the samples of similar flavor in which no DA or AP was detected.

Still not convinced? Try Swedish snus; it's been around for over 200 years and has proven to be very safe--through multiple studies.

Good luck!

 

[retired1]

but I still have doubts about a lots of things in vaping.

Uh huh, including making FUD threads. What did we say about that?

 

[DPLongo22]

Okay, so I will stop cooking immediately, cause for already more than 45 years I am inhaling food grade chemicals in metal pans.

Just don't cook at more than 420°F.

 

[Katdarling]

LOL!

 

[Beamslider]

How about if you are worried....Don't smoke and Don't vape.

That said...There is no way that vaping is as harmful as smoking. My health overall has improved massively since I switched.

 

[Rossum]

Just don't cook at more than 420°F.

 

[Beamslider]

Jeez.....Now I want a burger.

 

[DPLongo22]

Jeez.....Now I want a burger.

For ultimate safety, bake it at 150-200f (for 32-36 hours).

And don't run your clothes dryer either. Those things are carcinogen MACHINES.

I actually found the article to well written, reasonably presented, and an interesting read (at the very least). Thanks for bringing it to my attention (@rokyo87 ).

 

[Beamslider]

If it's not charred....Not edible

 

[DPLongo22]

If it's not charred....Not edible

Freakin' A to THAT.

 

[Beamslider]

And don't forget the caramelized red onions slathered on top

 

[marianna]

Just don't cook at more than 420°F.

In my country we just don't use Fahrenheit.

 

[DPLongo22]

In my country we just don't use Fahrenheit.

Nice!

I can't imagine why. You don't find 32-220 MUCH simpler than 0-100?

I think that'd be around 210-220 (ish), if my brain is working this morning. Is it still morning here?