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Michael I know you were using the same stuff as me did you notice the same flavor hit I did?
I didn't like what the Sodium Bicarbonate did. The one I made with Sodium Chloride is better, but I'm not sure if it is any better than using just Distilled Water. I smoked for 51 years and don't have super fine taste buds.
45 year smoker here so I know what your saying. I got a deffinite flavor hit from the bycarb so I'm just going to try saline.
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Hi everyone, I usually dilute my VG with 15% distilled water and never had a problem until recently when I switched vendors to My Freedom Smokes. But now my juices do not last that long. I go through them a lot faster. Has anyone else encountered a similar problem? I always thought VG was VG.
I've seen consistencies vary vender to vender. I would reduce the DW to maybe 10% and see if it improves. Another thing you can do being that VG is fairly cheap is switch back to your regular vender. If you feel that there is a drastic difference in quality you can also contact MFS and complain. They are pretty good as far as replacing bad products.
The VG wizards lab has is very consistent so maybe you may consider purchasing from them
The VG wizards lab has is very consistent so maybe you may consider purchasing from them
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I appreciate everyone going over things so thoroughly here.
Re; sweetener, and the various choices, consensus so far is that certain sweeteners go better with certain flavors:
Fruits/ sucralose type, and Bakery or Tobacco/ another… is that right? and would someone fill in ?
I know CC is EM, but what is TFA Sweetener?
Re; sweetener, and the various choices, consensus so far is that certain sweeteners go better with certain flavors:
Fruits/ sucralose type, and Bakery or Tobacco/ another… is that right? and would someone fill in ?
I know CC is EM, but what is TFA Sweetener?
We don't think PGA could be considered "necessary" in any way. We think it helps in the steeping/mixing/blending process (and it helps keep our juices thin in the cold weather/house).
'Highly doubt it would help irritation - it would likely make it worse...but at the 2% we use, we don't feel it's much of a player for sensation/irritation or (agree with you) overall flavor enhancement/muting.
As far as the 'break down into sugar' issue...at 2% of a tank, we're talking a quantity so miniscule (spread out 'over the time it takes to vape the tank') that it doesn't seem to us it could possibly affect blood glucose levels. (If 3ml tank - then 2% would be .06ml inhaled over several hours).
As far as diabetes issues and vaping -- I'd definitely be concerned about PG (especially if taking Metformin to control blood glucose)...as both contribute to lactic acidosis). The acidosis/renal function issue is very real for those that have IV drugs with PG administered...and vaping anything is the basically the same as mainlining it. The VG might be an issue (as it possibly has the potential to increase blood glucose, if I'm recalling correctly???). If I had diabetes issues, I'd definitely be 'respectfully cautious'...and do a lot of test vaping while monitoring levels (leaving out the flavors for testing, then adding them and retesting). I wouldn't trust anyone's opinion on an issue like diabetes, because you are the only one with your body and your variables!
Thanks for the appreciation. Keep up the good work - you've helped a LOT of folks yourself with your info!
Agree with graffinfected - TFA Sweetener (and most others) are sucralose.
Sucralose makes the vape sweeter - and that's all it does in a vape (aside from gunking coils).
EM (ie, "Cotton Candy") is an entirely different thing. It's an additive - that sometimes makes a vape taste sweeter. If you've ever vaped 'Cotton Candy' you'll know it's usefulness as an actual sweetener is totally limited by how "sweet" it actually is...and that is not very sweet.
EM (in our opinion) is far more correctly described as an "additive". It "softens" & smooths rough edges; it tends to make the vape seem somehow 'thicker' (similar to what marshmallow flavors do). EM changes the nature of the flavors in various ways; it helps to blend some flavors; it mutes flavors (definitely); too much adds a 'burnt sugar' taste...and it also seems to increase 'coil gunk' (in ours, but some swear it doesn't in theirs ???).
There is no hard & fast rule about "use this with certain types of flavors" and "use the other, with other types". Of course, if all you want is for a vape to be sweeter, then use Sweetener/Sucralose (or something like stevia) for sweetening. As far as the other reasons you might add EM, you'll need to experiment with it and see how it affects your flavors before being able to determine with what flavors it "works best" (for you).
Hello all. So, ended up picking up a bottle of some .9% saline solution used for washing wounds. Ingredients are .9% sodium chloride and purified water. I made a 236ml batch of VG base with 9% (21.24ml) distilled water and 9% saline (.9%). I skipped the PGA as I'm still in the intermediate stages, and have been happy with my DIY except for the recent realization that the VG was drying myself and the lady out a bit (dry sinuses, mild soar throat). Having vaped the 10% VG no nic most of the day, and sampling the 6 different mixes made with the new saline/DW base, I can attest that there is a noticeable 'wetness', an added smoothness, to our vaping. I cannot for the life of me taste the saline, but I can absolutely feel a difference in body and vapor. I will miss the thickness of the VG for a time, I can tell, but overall this has been a learning experience and my comfort and health is more important than a perceived lushness to my vape.
Anyhow, this is my preliminary experience, we will see how things pan out as time goes by. I plan to delve deeper into more advance flavor modelling and such, as I have sucralose sweetener, EM, koolada, vinegar, menthol crystals and lemon juice to tweak further mixes with.
Thanks for the info and help. Looking forward to see how these flavors steep and how much of a difference in moisturization I notice in my vape with this new base.
Anyhow, this is my preliminary experience, we will see how things pan out as time goes by. I plan to delve deeper into more advance flavor modelling and such, as I have sucralose sweetener, EM, koolada, vinegar, menthol crystals and lemon juice to tweak further mixes with.
Thanks for the info and help. Looking forward to see how these flavors steep and how much of a difference in moisturization I notice in my vape with this new base.
A couple of comments -
Glucose is a (relatively) complex 6 carbon cyclic polyalcohol.
PGA or "Pure Grain Alcohol" is 95% Ethanol/5% Water - the highest alcohol concentration that can be obtained by distillation. For example you could take 80 proof vodka (40% ethanol) and distill it and raise the ethanol to 95% but never 100%. That is why it is called "Pure Grain Alcohol" or sometimes chemist will refer to it as "Absolute Ethanol".
(In fact as a poorly funded grad student who had outside personal income I often went to the ABC store and bought Everclear - 190 proof Grain Alcohol, i.e. 95% Ethanol AKA PGA - out of my pocket for use as lab ethanol, lol.)
Ethanol, or PGA if you prefer, is a simple 2 carbon alcohol. It is NOT metabolized to sugar, it is oxidized by the liver to acetaldehyde, a toxic compound that is a large part (but not the only part) of a hangover. It can then be further oxidized to acetic acid (vinegar) and ultimately to water and CO2, but never to sugar.
Whoever told you this is mistaken - certainly diabetes and alcohol consumption in general can be a dangerous combination, and some forms of alcoholic beverages like beer have a high carbohydrate level and could be of concern by metabolism to sugar.
But the PGA amounts in vape are very low, and even if they were not PGA will not be converted to sugar, period.
As far as EM goes I agree with the previous poster. It does add a little sweetness but I use it mainly as a smoother, wetter, builder - it adds something rather vague I would call "Body" more than sweetness.
Depends on what you are making but for tobacco recipes I find that in general I can get as much sweetness as I want with Caramel and have never needed to resort to sucralose or any other "sweetener".
Glucose is a (relatively) complex 6 carbon cyclic polyalcohol.
PGA or "Pure Grain Alcohol" is 95% Ethanol/5% Water - the highest alcohol concentration that can be obtained by distillation. For example you could take 80 proof vodka (40% ethanol) and distill it and raise the ethanol to 95% but never 100%. That is why it is called "Pure Grain Alcohol" or sometimes chemist will refer to it as "Absolute Ethanol".
(In fact as a poorly funded grad student who had outside personal income I often went to the ABC store and bought Everclear - 190 proof Grain Alcohol, i.e. 95% Ethanol AKA PGA - out of my pocket for use as lab ethanol, lol.)
Ethanol, or PGA if you prefer, is a simple 2 carbon alcohol. It is NOT metabolized to sugar, it is oxidized by the liver to acetaldehyde, a toxic compound that is a large part (but not the only part) of a hangover. It can then be further oxidized to acetic acid (vinegar) and ultimately to water and CO2, but never to sugar.
Whoever told you this is mistaken - certainly diabetes and alcohol consumption in general can be a dangerous combination, and some forms of alcoholic beverages like beer have a high carbohydrate level and could be of concern by metabolism to sugar.
But the PGA amounts in vape are very low, and even if they were not PGA will not be converted to sugar, period.
As far as EM goes I agree with the previous poster. It does add a little sweetness but I use it mainly as a smoother, wetter, builder - it adds something rather vague I would call "Body" more than sweetness.
Depends on what you are making but for tobacco recipes I find that in general I can get as much sweetness as I want with Caramel and have never needed to resort to sucralose or any other "sweetener".
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Nice to learn the subtleties…
Seems like sweetening is something elusive since EM has those properties mentioned, but "sweetener" ie Sucralose may not provide smoothness like EM may.
I like sweetness but not at the expense of smooth… would you add both to sweeten and smooth a fruit juice?
Seems like sweetening is something elusive since EM has those properties mentioned, but "sweetener" ie Sucralose may not provide smoothness like EM may.
I like sweetness but not at the expense of smooth… would you add both to sweeten and smooth a fruit juice?
As you've likely read (especially when working with single flavors), we wouldn't add anything until we'd determined the 'perfect percentage'. Then when we'd determined that, we'd vape at least a full ml of that flavor. The difference between a few hits off a tester and vaping a 1/2 tank (or more) can be ridiculously different! (we never make more than 10mls of ANY juice until we've tested it and each vaped a ml).
Sometimes around the 25-40th vape, what was wonderful, becomes sickening...and what was 'barely tolerable' becomes amazingly wonderful! And it seems to us, they tend to 'get sweeter', too.
It's only after doing that, we start messing with additives. And surprise of all surpises...we rarely find them necessary.
ymmv, of course
Thank you for that great info. I do monitor my levels every day and since I've started vaping there has been a very slight increase in my blood glucose levels but nothing alarming. I've discussed this with my doctor and he thinks that although this is not ideal it's far better then me smoking analogs and encourages me to vape and not use analogs. I get my blood tested every 3 months through a lab and myself and my doctor go over the results. So as long as things stay within acceptable limits I need not worry about vaping. But as I've discussed in a thread I started many months ago on "vaping as it relates to diabetics" it is important for diabetics to monitor this closely.
I 100% agree and have given this advice many times. Using an atty or dripper is fine when your mixing to determine if your going in the right direction with flavoring. But to determine the true results of a mix you need to vape it for a while. THis is why I drip as I mix to get my percentages right then will fill a clearo or RBA and vape at least a few days and have been known to put the clearo down for a week and go back to it before I actually fine tune it or make my big batch.
I could not really offer any experience having never done any fruits. EM as stated will add sweetness but not a lot. In Tobaccos caramels tend to also add a sort of fuller body and a definite sweetness, but the tobacco flavorings also tend to "cover" some of the "caramelly" aspect. In that context it is sort of like EM in that caramel also seems to add body, smoothness, more sweetness than EM, and also some additional flavors notes that seem to compliment tobacco taste .
But it is not like say, cherry. If you want a cherry tobacco flavor add cherry. Adding typical percentages of caramel OTOH do not tend to really give you a "caramel tobacco".
Many fruits OTOH I would speculate that you will detect a much more distinct caramel note, and caramel melon does not sound very appealing to me at least. So while I use caramel as a sweetener in tobacco and have no need for sucralose that likely will not be as applicable to fruits.
You may want to try some other more appropriate flavors if you want to avoid sucralose for some reason. Creams for example often go well with fruits at least in the culinary world. TFA (actually ECX Signature) "Sweet Cream" will add quite a bit of sweetness, so you might look to something like that strategy.
But a caveat on that specific one - TFA Sweet Cream. It also adds a distinct vanilla note and if you go much above 1-1.5% it can start to become very sharp and "peppery".
It's all about experimentation though right? (And driving one's spouse if there is one crazy over hundreds of little bottles, lol).
yeah… i did experiment with TFA creams and Sweet Cream is my choice… at no more than a 10% mix, added to taste to fruits that have a sharpness or bite on inhale.
I got idea from a Watermelon Smoothie store-bought that i like… pretty spot on. So i added it to a few sharpish fruit with great results.
ie Lychee (plus some sweetener which i am researching now)
SC will taste like cafe-latte to me if you up the % and coffee/fruit is not so great imo… not all that sweet though.
Whipped Cream has a sharp note to it imo… not for smoothing imo.
I got idea from a Watermelon Smoothie store-bought that i like… pretty spot on. So i added it to a few sharpish fruit with great results.
ie Lychee (plus some sweetener which i am researching now)
SC will taste like cafe-latte to me if you up the % and coffee/fruit is not so great imo… not all that sweet though.
Whipped Cream has a sharp note to it imo… not for smoothing imo.
I also highly recommend FA Fresh Cream if you are going for cream mainly. It is less vanilla and less prone to become sharp than TFA Sweet Cream, and my fav cream overall.
But it does not add the sweetness of TFA SC either if you are looking to sweeten also.
I often blend FA Fresh Cream and TFA SC to try to get the good and reduce the not so good.
But so far I have tried many creams and nearly all seem prone to become sharp quickly as you increase %
But it does not add the sweetness of TFA SC either if you are looking to sweeten also.
I often blend FA Fresh Cream and TFA SC to try to get the good and reduce the not so good.
But so far I have tried many creams and nearly all seem prone to become sharp quickly as you increase %
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