FDA to propose rule on ecigarettes Monday 4-28-2014

[Maurice Pudlo]

[censor] the [CeNsOrInG] FDA, [CENSORED] up sons of [ceNsoRs]!

Collectively if we all just stopped using nicotine in any form, the lost revenue would speak volumes Tobacco Tax Revenue

Would just not using nicotine for a month be enough? Would six months be enough? Maybe a whole year? In 2011 revenue was on the order of $17,653,708,000, that's $48,366,323 per day. $339,494,384 per week. $1,471,142,333 per month.

Maurice

 

[LDS714]

Ya they should ban putting mustard on hot dogs sense they think adults don't like/need flavorings.

No. Ketchup on hot dogs should be banned. It's the ketchup that attracts children to all of the poisons contained in hot dogs.

 

[Sirius]

Anyway, if the FDA deems the juices a tobacco product, I foresee the same labs extracting nicotine from other Solanaceae that do it now for e-juice suppliers and us DIYers and just labeling it,(extracted from plant products)It would be the same thing as long as it's organic imo.
That would solve the tobacco products problem of regulations from the government on nicotine. You better bet they will do what they can to get into our pockets while they can. Any way they can. That is why I have 2 ltrs of nicotine solution in my freezer. lol

 

[CassiusCloud]

I guess it's time to break out the Nicoshine still and start stillin me some nicoshine

 

[LDS714]

Anyway, if the FDA deems the juices a tobacco product, I foresee the same labs extracting nicotine from other Solanaceae that do it now for e-juice suppliers and us DIYers and just labeling it,(extracted from plant products)It would be the same thing as long as it's organic imo.
That would solve the tobacco products problem of regulations from the government on nicotine. You better bet they will do what they can to get into our pockets while they can. Any way they can. That is why I have 2 ltrs of nicotine solution in my freezer. lol

Kind of reminds me of the surge in popularity of potato skins a few years back. People were going nuts over them to the point that the demand for the skins was outstripping the demand for the rest of the potato. So finally, we'll have some sort of secondary use for the leaves of the Solanaceae. I can see it now, "Today in the commodities market tomato leaves were up a half..."

 

[shelzmike]

Well that's bad. The FDA would have to change a few things to include e-cigs but it does look possible. I'm not sure they cold make the leap from nicotine base to tobacco so easily. I suppose synthetic nicotine would be a short circuit. I will have to ponder this. I think it would be absurd for such an action though.
This is probably old news to many but I think it won't hurt to re-quote it.
Quote from FDA -
"September 22, 2009 ... Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act ...
According to the act

…a cigarette or any of its component parts (including the tobacco, filter, or paper) shall not contain, as a constituent (including a smoke constituent) or additive, an artificial or natural flavor (other than tobacco or menthol) or an herb or spice, including strawberry, grape, orange, clove, cinnamon, pineapple, vanilla, coconut, licorice, cocoa, chocolate, cherry, or coffee, that is a characterizing flavor of the tobacco product or tobacco smoke

Any company who continues to make, ship or sell such products may be subject to FDA enforcement actions."

Wait, was this just a proposal or did this actually pass? While thinking about it I do not know of any flavored cigarettes (but could be because I never looked for them) but I DO see those many flavored "Bluntz Wraps" or whatever in the flavor of Juicy Mango and and Grape, etc. Those are made of tobacco and have nicotine so why aren't those a big deal? And plus we all know what that is actually being used for...

Will there be some way to write them once the regulations are proposed for review? If so there are 13 vape shops here I will be going to to get them to write as well.

You can always write your congresspersons, every day, all year, on any topic. This is what people should have been doing all along...not waiting until BS rhetoric has been passed around.

Truth be known the wording of e-cigarette could just be the answer to our problems here. I don't use a e-cig I use a mechanical vaping device. The juice I use is customized or DIY and my atty is rebuildable dripper that I maintain.
Come on now people, the more complicated we make it the longer it will take them to regulate us. Maybe by the time they get to us mechanical and RDA users they will only be into page 5000 of vol.10 of the FDA Regulations sometime near the year 2029.

I suppose that that really wouldn't matter because the only real way they can damage us is with banning online sales of e-liquids. We are way to organized now to even let that stop us. Most of us would just go underground with the nic-liquids and anything else anyone would need. We'll find a way. Vaping is way to important to those of us that were burdened by the tobacco industry for so many years imo.

+1000, the whole time I have been researching and involved with eCig activism the ONE thing that irks me the most is the fact that they have the word cigarette right in there when in fact it is not even close to a cigarette. I realize it was the initial marketing tactic but now that has screwed me and we are sorta stuck in the place we have to use that term - I mean, look at the domain name of this forum..just in the initial introduction of any discussion on the topic, cigarettes enter the minds and thought processes of opponents almost immediately. I never call it an eCig..ever...because it is not.

Okay and I can see why. I understand that products on shelves are unregulated such as some air freshners, herbal remedies etc... What I should have better explained was, I don't think electronic cigarettes should be in the the unregulated category because of the societal negative stigmas attached to "unregulated products." I want everyone to try ecigs and I don't want anyone to turn it away just because of a stigma associated with those types of products because ecigs are so much more than the negative connotations many people today attach to an unregulated product. Regardless, it's been a tobacco product since 2009 and for logical reasons which I stated on an earlier thread. This industry picked up fast and deeming it as a tobacco product was the best way to keep our ecigs in our hands.

Nah, I live in Franklin County, VA (of Lawless fame) a.k.a. Moonshine Capital of the World...ask anyone around here how well regulation has worked out in the past for us. Perhaps though I think maybe you are saying in the face of a TOTAL ban, regulation is the only level of acceptance we can live with? Maybe...

And speaking on the subject of regulation, it is CLEARLY an issue of BT/BP worried about profits and using lobbyists and influence as a Red Herring against vapors, knowing the loss in profits and in no way worrying about health....I mean the FDA has no regulation over herbal supplements like Hydroxycut and all this other horrible crap that is out there. Well, I suppose that is a misnomer though...I am sure the FDA would love to have more regulation but they don't so many people are getting sick from this crap. it is so aggravating the FDA doesn't just focus and spend their energy and time on crap that really hurts people.

Mike

 

[dylanlg2]

I guess it's time to break out the Nicoshine still and start stillin me some nicoshine

I am developing a cello case that will hold 15+ gallons of ejuice as we speak

 

[edyle]

Well first of all, it is a tobacco product as of 2009 when the FDA was trying to ban us all together. We have to have regulation, there's no way around it. It's a product on a shelf, you can't just have it unregulated so I'm unclear about what your proposed the plan of action is? And if we don't need government oversight, what do you propose? We let each state handle it? Is it safe to assume you're not from a state that has already imposed a 95% tax on electronic cigarettes? Every state creating their own regulations will not help this industry. Like in California for instance, where they are trying to ban ecomerce sales (online). I know that national regulation will be tough, but it will not be worse that each state creating and implementing their own rules.

A hundred years ago, I'm sure some judge somewhere when faced with a case ended up defining an automobile as a horse.
And another judge probably defined a tv as a book.

My protanks and vamo is not a tobacco product; fasttech doesn't sell tobacco products, they sell consumer electronics.

 

[CassiusCloud]

I am developing a cello case that will hold 15+ gallons of ejuice as we speak

Now i have a good excuse for a garden this year.
Tomatoes,peppers,potatoes,flowers of the same family..
Oh ya, And tobacco.

 

[Sirius]

I guess it's time to break out the Nicoshine still and start stillin me some nicoshine

Good thing I live in Georgia CC -- both tobacco and cotton grow here and I'll be setting up my Nicoshine still also bwahaha!
I'll be good on nic and wick 'til they plant me.

 

[edyle]

Yea I agree that regulation will most definitely bring on taxation. I do feel bad for the states that have approved a 95% tax because that is ridiculous. But does it worry you at all having an unregulated product? Not having quality standards does scare me because I want to make sure I'm getting the highest quality eliquid. I'm also really curious about the effects of heating the flavoring. If burnt sugar can be a carcinogen, is there any possibility that these flavorings can pose any threat? Does anyone have any hard evidence about it? I'm just curious.

I'd like to see standards too, but the experience so far shows no sign at all that any such regulations will be considered; the only regulations being considered thus far are regulations to stop vaping.

 

[Sirius]

+1000, the whole time I have been researching and involved with eCig activism the ONE thing that irks me the most is the fact that they have the word cigarette right in there when in fact it is not even close to a cigarette. I realize it was the initial marketing tactic but now that has screwed me and we are sorta stuck in the place we have to use that term - I mean, look at the domain name of this forum..just in the initial introduction of any discussion on the topic, cigarettes enter the minds and thought processes of opponents almost immediately. I never call it an eCig..ever...because it is not.

Yeah brother that term annoys the hell outta me as well. Well put btw.

Nah, I live in Franklin County, VA (of Lawless fame) a.k.a. Moonshine Capital of the World...ask anyone around here how well regulation has worked out in the past for us. Perhaps though I think maybe you are saying in the face of a TOTAL ban, regulation is the only level of acceptance we can live with? Maybe...

And speaking on the subject of regulation, it is CLEARLY an issue of BT/BP worried about profits and using lobbyists and influence as a Red Herring against vapors, knowing the loss in profits and in no way worrying about health....I mean the FDA has no regulation over herbal supplements like Hydroxycut and all this other horrible crap that is out there. Well, I suppose that is a misnomer though...I am sure the FDA would love to have more regulation but they don't so many people are getting sick from this crap. it is so aggravating the FDA doesn't just focus and spend their energy and time on crap that really hurts people.

Mike

Mike -- the whole problem is the nanny state mentality bro. Also the,(but the children may get ahold of it) Kidstapo imo. That is what I was trying to get across here about the flavors controversy awhile back. How many would let kiddos drink coffee for instance? You know I can't count the coffee flavors that are out there anymore,(because I don't like flavored coffee lol) They never beach about coffee now do they? Anything that looks like smoking they are going to label cigarette just like what's going on right now in WA. The Aussies are really catching hell right now.

 

[CassiusCloud]

Good thing I live in Georgia CC -- both tobacco and cotton grow here and I'll be setting up my Nicoshine still also bwahaha!
I'll be good on nic and wick 'til they plant me.

I'm in Tennessee,and there will be a lot of vapers and businesses in an uproar if SB 1698 "Tennessee Bill that Excludes E-Cigarettes from Smoking Bans and Tobacco Taxes" does not even get a chance..

They may have passed that "any gun owner can carry a gun without a permit" law,about two weeks too early ,i'm thinkin..

 

[Storemyace]

The FDA deems thousands of medications safe, that end up killing millions of Americans every year. I wouldn't believe a spit of garbage that comes out of their mouth.

 

[Sirius]

I'm in Tennessee,and there will be a lot of vapers and businesses in an uproar if SB 1698 "Tennessee Bill that Excludes E-Cigarettes from Smoking Bans and Tobacco Taxes" does not even get a chance..

They may have passed that "any gun owner can carry a gun without a permit" law,about two weeks too early ,i'm thinkin..

Oh yeah bro I can see it now,( Putin ) "I just invaded the Ukrine." ( Obama ) "Big deal, I'm about to invade Tennessee!"

 

[pamdis]

The FDA deems thousands of medications safe, that end up killing millions of Americans every year. I wouldn't believe a spit of garbage that comes out of their mouth.

Don't forget 'effective'! FDA deems thousands of medications SAFE AND EFFECTIVE. So it must be true! And if some, or millions, die, well, that's what we pay the FDA for - to decide how many it is acceptable to let die in order for the rest of us to have safe and effective medicines!

Like Chantix - 500 documented deaths - how many undocumented? - 5% effective - totally worth it!

 

[shelzmike]

Yeah, I read about Western Austrailia..that sucks. Hopefully it will be overturned. And yeah the nanny state mentality is simply a progressive and enabling environment that takes away parent's responsibilities (or adult's in general) for standing up and doing their part as it pertains to responsible, reasonable and expected "grown-upp-ed-ness" I mean when I hear that some poor kid got sick from drinking e-liquid my immediate thoughts are NOT omg, that stuff is dangerous and should be banned...rather, it is WTH? Those parents should be freaking smacked for being so irresponsible

Mike

 

[Razorback]

No. Ketchup on hot dogs should be banned. It's the ketchup that attracts children to all of the poisons contained in hot dogs.

Yes, because ketchup has tomatoes, and tomatoes has nicotine... I guess that's why I like it sooo much!

 

[Mowgli]

If you took nicotine out of the equation, what would they have to regulate?

...and that's part of why they're still unregulated.
Try to prove that what I'm vaping contains nicotine.
Very tricky stuff.

I DIY for myself and a few others.
I'm not worried for myself or my friends about regulation.
I'm concerned that millions of smokers that could have a reduced harm alternative might never get the chance to learn the truth about vaping or might be deceived by ANTZ propoganda need suffer a reduced quality of life and die younger than necessary.
History has shown that there have always been people quite willing to kill anyone to make money.
I'm not surprised that saving lives is secondary to making money, just disgusted.

The cat is out of the bag, we need to fight to keep it there.

 

[hairball]

Here's another kicker to all of this. Have any of you looked at the whole picture? IMO, it's not just about the money. It's about population control as well. Look at how many jobs will be lost in this country if we live longer. If the FDA really cared about our health, 99.9% of the drugs on the market wouldn't exist. They kill us and they know it...it provides jobs.