vaping/smoking for Hawaiian minors just a got a whole lot cooler.
Hawaii Minimum Age
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An interesting thing about the news coverage is there are no interviews with 18-20 year old smokers and vapers who used to do it legally and now cannot. They are mostly responsible tax payig employees or students. They are being marginalized, demonized, and humiliated without any consideration of unintended consequences. Somebody should be keeping an eye on police incident reports in the next few months. Will there be a spike in petty crimes and similar problems. Are there going to be court dates for fights and petty violence where we find out the defendant was irritable because he could no longer buy cigarettes? HI is conducting a population level experiment that might have lessons for other states.
I just noticed a news article that says the police won't start enforcing the new law until April. Has the rebellion started already?
"Some police have said they will not start enforcing the ban immediately, including those in Honolulu who won't start issuing citations until April 1, according to NBC News."
Hawaii law raising smoking age to 21 goes into effect
I just noticed a news article that says the police won't start enforcing the new law until April. Has the rebellion started already?
"Some police have said they will not start enforcing the ban immediately, including those in Honolulu who won't start issuing citations until April 1, according to NBC News."
Hawaii law raising smoking age to 21 goes into effect
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You nailed it.
The only way to fight it now, is if Americans could be trusted to nullify during court. No victim equals no crime, no crime equals no criminal. No criminal equals no law broken. Yes, it's our duty to nullify even the "law" was broken. It's the people's right to nullify bad laws. The question is, how many Americans can we trust to know & understand the constitution & who are prepared to fight for it?
Oops, gotta go, my favorite show is on.
My thinking has always been...
They won't stop until we make them look like fools.
In fact, I posted those very words on this forum quite some time ago.
And Carl Phillips saw fit to quote it as part of his blog...
Anti-THR Lies and related topics
The Big Island is the most amazing place I've ever been, and I've been around a bit.
I'm running out of interesting places to go here in the United States.
So I'd love to get a look at that list of yours.
And for the love of God, please don't tell me your list includes Branson.
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And for the love of God, please don't tell me your list includes Branson.
Lot of Places I'd like to see. And a Lot I'd like to See Again. But this is Not on the List.
My thinking has always been...
They won't stop until we make them look like fools.
In fact, I posted those very words on this forum quite some time ago.
And Carl Phillips saw fit to quote it as part of his blog...
Anti-THR Lies and related topics
The Big Island is the most amazing place I've ever been, and I've been around a bit.
I'm running out of interesting places to go here in the United States.
So I'd love to get a look at that list of yours.
And for the love of God, please don't tell me your list includes Branson.
You mean, "Branson LAKE"?
My husband is from St Louis... we spent some time a few days ago looking at flood pics on weather.com, with him going "I know that gas station!" or "I know that intersection!" all of which are currently under at least 3-4 ft of water... AT LEAST!
Andria
On the topic of the HI ban. Are we certain it applies to everyone who was 18-20 before 12/31? Are thousands of HI residents expected to quit cold turkey as of Jan 1?
As I understand it, the Minimum Age to Buy, Posses or Use tobacco or "e-Cigarettes" in Hawaii is now 21.
And it Doesn't matter how old you were on Dec. 31st.
Do you suppose they thought this through? The police have now said they aren't enforcing this until April. I'm not surprised and can't wait to see what happens then. If I was a cop I would not be wanting to risk my life confronting the boys in the hood to enforce this law. Picture the local TV news story, "Shooting broke out between Honolulu police and gang members in the ....neighborhood after an officer tired to ticket ... for underage smoking..." Come on folks this is nutty bananas with whipped cream. Let's humiliate a tough kid trying to be a man who probably has drug issues and a psychiatric condition by humiliating him. The legislators may be that dumb but the cops aren't.
This is comparable in meanness to the human experiments the Nazis are accused of during WWII. If this is such a great idea then ban tobacco and ecigs from the islands and make everybody quit together. Otherwise it's just a bunch of thoughtless adults experimenting with kids' lives.
Hey I'm just telling you what I understand about what I've Read.
And I think talk of Humiliation and comparisons to Nazis Atrocities is a tad Over the Top.
And I think talk of Humiliation and comparisons to Nazis Atrocities is a tad Over the Top.
I don't. Every single time I tried to quit smoking before vaping, I completely lost my mind until I gave up and went back to smoking.
Andria
(I predict) They ain't going to enforce nothing as far as using goes. It's just for retailers/vendors. They might try sending in a bunch of 19 year olds that look 30 and nail some vendors.
They might (very unlikely) bust 1 to 3 minors a year just to send a message. But if they were to bust more than that, they'd risk it backfiring.
I'll be looking for usage to go up amongst minors cause they managed to make it more appealing.
They might (very unlikely) bust 1 to 3 minors a year just to send a message. But if they were to bust more than that, they'd risk it backfiring.
I'll be looking for usage to go up amongst minors cause they managed to make it more appealing.
I don't think it's over the top at all. My gut tells me this is a very bad idea and there might be some tragedies that come from it. Now that it's supposely in force some possibilities are coming to mind. If most of the kids stop smoking with out incident then may be it was a good thing. I think it's more likely things won't go so well. What they might have done was leave vaping alone and encourage switching to cushion the blow but we know the new restrictions were about vaping, not smoking, so they weren't going to do it that way. Islands would be the perfect place to try a totoal ban that applies to everybody. That would be the right thing to do.
Wrt the Final Solution and the experimentation of the 40's you're right, but not the laws and experimentation of certain social controlling (not necessarily ethnic/racist) fascist policies of the late 20's and 30's, which are very much appropriate and similar in terms of what led up to the latter atrocities.
I think what is Missing from All this is How Does Raising the Age to buy Cigarettes (or e-Cigarettes) from 18 to 21 save any Children?
If Children weren't being Saved when the Age Limit was 18, raising it to 21 aint gonna do anything. You could raise it to 40. Still doesn't "Save the Children".
So if they aren't saving the Children, why don't they just Call a Spade a Spade. And start saying that they are Trying to save the Adults. Because raising the Age Limit from 18 to 21 is Only Effecting Adults.
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I would love to live in a place where nobody is interested in drugs or alcohol or smoking (or watching NFL football) but the problem is how do you get there from here. At least for one of them there is a promising solution. We could vape our way out of the Tobacco Age without making any laws or spending any tax money. The government could just shut up and .... out. HI is reacting to vaping, not smoking and I think they've miscalculated. Prohibition was a miscalculation that took a while to fix.
Funny how most problems with gov't could so easily be solved if they'd just shut up and .... out. Getting elected to office should come with a roll of duct tape, to be applied anytime they get delusions of grandeur.
Andria
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