Homemade Snus with Rustica Tobacco Leaf

[sunset]

I might start a snuff thread for just all rustica methods and recipies.

I will post my mixed recipies there.

Vaporer, Can't wait to see your recipes...I got my bag of Rustica out today and I've been debating if I'll order more.

And of course, Dred, yours, too....the one that's going to melt my face off.8-o

Seriously, it would be neat to try a few. So far I've just crumbled it and sniffed, which is pretty enjoyable.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

TV the bicarbonate (baking soda) to carbonate conversion:
(could have sworn I'd posted this already)

You did, but I needed Vaporer to translate .

Just checking : is Golden Virgina RYO what people here would call 'virginia',
or does the latter imply a bag of whole-leaf tobacco?,
just that I dont know how much 'processing' the RYO has had.

Good point. Dredbull is using RYO and Vaporer is growing his own Virginia Gold.

 

[exogenesis]

Thanks for the clarity Vaporer, will now try to make for myself.

(still think you mean higher pH)

Can you buy whole leaf virginia ?

 

[Vaporer]

Sorry for the late reply, net has been off here for over 30hrs.

sunset,
I havent dwelled into Dreds catagory of recipies yet. I've been going the snuff route with just menthol till I get the pH thing worked out.
Seems to be solved now. Hate to buy tobacco and not get the nic with it. lol
I have some ready to start flavor testing now.
The formula above works well for basic flavored snus as it has for snuff.
Went to find spearmint flavoring last night and they had none!
I own well over 1/2 of the Lorann line and many of other companies. Never have what you want. lol

TV just needs it in midwest redneck, I understand that. wooo hooo

exo, yes, higher pH......I attribute those previous statements to the aneurysm.
I live just north of Kentucky. I'm sure some farmer would sell me dried leaf from the barn.
I cant believe I cant find it on the net though. Other than American Spirit(RYO), you dont really know what its been through and it gets expensive once its cut and named for anything.

 

[exogenesis]

Enforced off-line here too, bad phone land-line probs all week, grrrr.

Sounds like spearmint does better than mint then, only one I've got
is from Decadent Vapours - contains PG tho, but very pleaant taste.

Tried making my own from rustica, went for full pH 9 (~12% sodium carbnate) / 50% moisture,
1% loran mint-oil, left in fridge for 3 days.

Tried it - tastes very salty (damn), but satisfies OK, not as nic.-strong as I was expecting.

Maybe the pastuerisation step is needed to fully release the nic. from the plant cells ??

 

[exogenesis]

Seems to have gone off the boil here, still doing this Vaporer ?

Turns out leaving in the fridge for over a week after wetting with carbonate makes the
mint-rustica-snus definately much better, getting a 'wow' burst from this stuff now,
in fact got very close to 'overdoing it' trying a full-size snus-worth.

 

[Vaporer]

Not done here exo for sure. Springtime outdoor stuff to get started........
Just had to many irons in the fire. Getting things knocked out one at a time pretty well now.
A friend sent me a link for leaf Nicotiana Tabacum. Just bought a lb.
I'm pretty well satisfied with the snuff results of the rustica and have the SnusX flavors working I like. With the rustica snuff trials, being mostly dried out, seems there will be a few differences in rustica snus as it comes to flavoring. There is some noticeable difference when left moist vs letting dry.

Interesting that a week in the fridge kicked it in. I wouldnt think micro action in that short a time at that temp. Maybe just better breakdown of the cell structure form constantly being wet with time?
What grind consistancy did you use? Not powdered from a mortar I presume. A blender type grind? That would be my choice. If powdered to fine some leaks through the tea bag material.

If you look at commercial snus flavors, they are fairly limited. Mint seems to work very well, while Wintergreen seems on the fence. There was an earthy bitterness that came through with some flavors in the SnusX that will probably be the same with rustica.

I'll make some mint portions today and fridge them for a time test.

 

[firechick]

 

[Vaporer]

Hey FireChick.
As you just read I ordered a lb from the link you sent me. Nice find.
Very much appreciated.

 

[exogenesis]

Be interesting comparison with the Tabacum.

I was grinding pretty fine in a 'herb grinder' 200 watt blade thing,
looks like snuff/dust when dry, at 50% water it swelled to something that
doesn't seem to escape from those d7.se snus pouches, which I think aren't as
fine-holed as teabag material.


btw weighed the 'stalk & rib' content of the 100g rustica,
reckon it's around 20% of the weight. Seems like less when you look at it.

The mint flavour I reckon complements the taste of carbonate (but not salt - NaCl),
which is just as well since the sort-of salty-sherbet-like flavour of CO3 is just
tolerable at the amount needed for pH 9. Think next time I'll go pH 8.5.

Also the fridged stuff seems to be getting darker, & I re-measured some pH9
I did earlier in excess water, pH dropped to 8.3 or less (sealed container),
so something chemical is still going on with the storage-time.

 

[Vaporer]

exo,
Still getting darker.....hmmmm sounds like something is going on.
Back in my early posts it never darkened with the bicarbonate, but I noted in the post it did with the carbonate. The longest I let it set was 24 hrs before drying it and it was color stable after that.
Could this mean less carbonate is needed overall as it may be taking time to react completely with the rustica?

Also, what was the base of your mint flavor? PG?

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Also the fridged stuff seems to be getting darker, & I re-measured some pH9
I did earlier in excess water, pH dropped to 8.3 or less (sealed container),
so something chemical is still going on with the storage-time.

Just to throw something out.....are you using distilled water or D.I? Can't really imagine that would make much of a difference, but....... And do you think a small amount of actual table salt would do anything? ...I know you just cringed .

 

[exogenesis]

Think the loran mint is just the essential oil itself - isn't it ?

Dunno if it means less carbonate needed, possibly the reverse if you were aiming
for a given final stable pH & it slowly goes down (pH) over a couple of weeks or more.

DI water used here, not sure if it makes any difference.

Salt Free Kids !, won't somebody think of the taste buds ,
but maybe you're right, not impossible some salt could give more stable recipes,
or quicker stablility anyway, not willing to contaminate mine tho.

 

[Vaporer]

Yes, the Lorann is just the oil. You had mentioned a vape flavor once and I thought iy might have been PG based.

The only way to really know would be to check the amount of freebase nicotine in it.
As long as the adsorption is to the base side, the determining factor would be how much was converted to freebase. Right?
Guess I'm wondering if more is being converted to freebase form or the pH is just reacting on the organic material left.

 

[TWISTED VICTOR]

Salt Free Kids !, won't somebody think of the taste buds ,
but maybe you're right, not impossible some salt could give more stable recipes,
or quicker stablility anyway, not willing to contaminate mine tho.

...'nuff said. I almost didn't post that 'cause I sensed your gag reflex all the way to the US. Distilled or D.I. ought to work equally well I'd think. Possibly your right on the higher pH. Snus makers may start out with higher pH and let set in vats with occasional mixing over a period of time. That may, in part, be the reason why V2 has semi-serious backorders when there's been a good run on sales. They probably have a good stock of pasteurized 'baccy, but it takes time to achieve the final pH before canning. Then again...I donno......

 

[exogenesis]

Guessing it's general organic tobacco plant material still 'soaking up' the alkali - slowly.

The spearmint c.g. peppermint, was the DV juice flavour I have that's got PG in it.
Can get the straight spearmint oil online tho, 50ml = £8, enough for around 5 kg snus at 1% content

Hmmm, grind, wet, add salt & carbonate & flavour, pasteurise,
then mature, could well be that is a critical part of commercial snus .

 

[firechick]

V,
I have purchased from them before, (though not tobacco), and they have always been fast, reliable, and fair. Let me know how the tobacco is!

 

[Bagazo]

Hmmm, grind, wet, add salt & carbonate & flavour, pasteurise, then mature, could well be that is a critical part of commercial snus .

This site sells a DIY kit and in the "how to" it states that after three days of pasteurizing it should be left 2 more days in the fridge to enhance taste.

Vikingasnus.se - how to make real Swedish snus

I would think that this is similar to the aging of wine. You have a bunch of organic compounds available to interact with each other as well as oxygen that creates changes in color, smell and taste.

 

[Vaporer]

Hmmm, grind, wet, add salt & carbonate & flavour, pasteurise,
then mature, could well be that is a critical part of commercial snus .

I think I'd hold the flavor till after the pasteurise and add it then.

Firechick,
All I have from them so far is payment confirm, no shipped yet. They may not notify and it's on its way.

Bagazo,
Nifty and simple little oven. An old microwave would work well if gutted.
Careful with that big capacitor! Wonder what watt bulb that is???

 

[Bagazo]

Vaporer, a gutted microwave oven is just a metal box. Maybe better just to get one and forego the gutting. Also it would be a good idea to insulate.

As to the bulb wattage, it would all depend on the oven size, amount of snus being made and the insulation of the oven. A high wattage and a dimmer might be a good idea to be able to control the temp.