Odd statement (from my perspective) -- even psychological health is likely associated, one-to-one, with certain physiological states.
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Odd statement (from my perspective) -- even psychological health is likely associated, one-to-one, with certain physiological states.
We cant expect vendors to give up their recipes by listing all the ingredients. That would be like Coke or KFC releasing their very protected recipes. What I expect to see sometime in the future is regulations for eliquid vendors that ensures a sanitary work environment.
Agreed. My hope is vaping continues to evolve, more studies done and is as safe as possible for us all! And not just sanitary conditions but overall health safety of inhaling flavors. If certain flavors/colorings are found not to be safe to inhale, it's eliminated or change. If some plastics are found to be unsafe/fumes unsafe when heated, it's changed. If WE demand safer PV equipment and ejuices and not buy from those who don't deliver or comply, we are more in control, not the businesses.
BT had control over us. They had opportunities to produce a safer cigarette-Project TAME/XA Cigarettes (well, debatable if it could ever be a ton safer, but an effort would have been nice) and they chose not to do it cuz of the all mighty dollar. And we all suffered the consequences. I don't want to see this happen to vaping because we're putting the blinders on to something we all love, are hooked on and so forth.
I think that's why if anyone speaks concerns, they get their heads chewed off and probably why we don't hear anything more from them again after the initial post.
IMO, it's a matter of forum etiquette that if you start a thread asking a question, you stick around to respond to replies, the theory being that you're interested in the answers enough to engage in some give-and-take and not simply rabble-rousing.
If I had to be away from the forum for any length of time, I wouldn't start such a thread and then leave.
However, people new to forums in general may not be aware of forum etiquette, so up to a point I tend to give them the benefit of the doubt. Up to a point.
(And if dissenting replies to a question are enough to drive someone away, perhaps forums are not the right place for them...)
When you have been around as long as some of us have, you will see that the ANTZ's will have "plants/trolls" on ECF who start negative/fear producing threads to generate a negative vaping title on the internet from ECF. That may not be the case with this poster but AgentAnia has a good point that starting a thread like this and never responding is poor etiquette at best. If you are not going to respond (even just a "thank-you"), then don't start the thread. If the OP had titled the thread: "I have a question about eliquid" and nothing else in the title, that would be a better method to ask for input on this "concern". And also stay around to respond to all those who took the time to read his "burning question" that appears to have not been that "burning" after all.
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Gotcha and thx for info. Let them troll all they want...I personally welcome their scare tactics. It only generates new ideas for us, makes us research more and makes us stronger. Vaping isn't going anywhere so their efforts are futile. They should focus on BT..
This thread led me to look up DIY...would love to try it and maybe back off the flavorings to help ease my nervousness on flavors/safety but WOW! Looks complicated. Someone "named" DVap is like a scientific/chemistry genius and was talking all kinds of formulas and stuff. Way over my head to try.
We all need to join CASAA and promote the studies on their site that show the safety and positive benefits of vaping. It would be nice to see every member of ECF have a CASAA banner so new members will be encouraged to join and help protect our ability to vape as we do today.
IMO, it's a matter of forum etiquette that if you start a thread asking a question, you stick around to respond to replies, the theory being that you're interested in the answers enough to engage in some give-and-take and not simply rabble-rousing.
If I had to be away from the forum for any length of time, I wouldn't start such a thread and then leave.
However, people new to forums in general may not be aware of forum etiquette, so up to a point I tend to give them the benefit of the doubt. Up to a point.
(And if dissenting replies to a question are enough to drive someone away, perhaps forums are not the right place for them...)
(IMO) It has nothing to do with forum etiquette at the behest of the poster. I think we all have to take some responsibility. I'm by no means new to forums but there are many who are and not just here on ECF. The reception one gets is what opens the door for them to "stick around." More times than not, people get so caught up in their hobbies or passion that they often forget they too were once new.
I've been on forums where I've been made to feel my question was the dumbest thing asked and what did I do......leave! We don't all think the same way and one thing I'm not going to do is stick around and feel like a fool. The OP's question was completely valid and to that end, it's real easy to label or assume someone to be a "troll" if they don't stick around but what does that say about the "bullies" who ran them off?
Someone said it best... "blind faith" and apart from DIY, we are vaping blindly. I enjoy vaping but my personal life doesn't allow me time to remotely consider doing it myself. With that said, I'll continue to order from sites that have the best reviews.
The subject has been covered numerous times before. A simple search in the forum postings will bring them up with all of the possible answers we could hope to get.
Sigh...
Both in this thread and elsewhere, I have tried to explain that our liquids are sanitary by their very nature. PG and VG do not allow pathogens to propagate. Nicotine has both antiseptic and insecticidal properties.
You can make your own e-liquid on the floor of the French Quarter McDonalds' mens room and it won't have one bad bug propagating in it.
Even if it did, the bad bugs still have to survive being vaporized on a coil that's glowing at a gazillion degrees F. I exaggerate to make a point, which is that our liquids are as safe as they can possibly be.
You have rubbed PG and VG on your skin. You have shampooed your hair in a solution that is loaded with it. You have eaten foods and drunk drinks that have more PG or VG in them than the average 10ml bottle of your favorite liquid. PG is even used by hospital HVAC systems to help prevent propagation of airborne bacteria.
You know that pink medicine and fever reducer you gave your children at a rate of about 5ml per four hours when they were sick? Guess what the liquid base was?
There might be some bad flavor compounds out there, but those are few and far between and they probably mean that the vendor isn't using food grade materials. That would include vendors using "organic" methods of extracting flavors. I will prefer the basement guy using artificial strawberry flavoring over the west coast dood who thinks naturally extracting the acids and sugars from organically grown strawberries is somehow safer. At least the artificial flavorings are food grade and meet or exceed FDA and FCPA standards.
I promise, I'm not biting your head off. But I would like people to use some common sense, and not give into the media's demonization of business.
Come on, y'all. The air is fine, the water is fine and your liquids are fine.
So my question was posed with no common sense in mind? According to who?
And what does media demonetization of business have to do with anyone posting a valid question in the hopes of receiving valid answers?
Sorry if I don't live on the forum and have the time to search and read every single thread since that seems to be the quickest answer one gets around here.
I hope when I become a seasoned vapor that I never forget I once was a newbie and can actually help someone else without being condescending in the process.
Thank you for the education, but sorry you missed my point. I wasn't the one who started the thread and worried about sanitary conditions. some of the places I lived in college were literally condemned and torn down, not sure how I thought those places were cool to live in..YUCK. I prefer not to buy stuff from a place thats like a toxic waste site, but my conern was safety regarding actual products. And I realize that some foods have PG/VG and various food coloring. BUT, Again, SIGH......as I've stated before, I'm not in the habit of heating and inhaling food. So honestly, I'm personally getting tired if this comparison. Eating food is different than inhaling it! Bananas are good for me, but I don't want to smoke it. And I could probably bet smoking it would not be too good on the ol lungs.
And because these foods are deemed safe to go thru my digestive tract, I'm not sure if the food is deemed, if inhaled, safe for my respiratory tract. So sure, it's, FDA safe FOOD grade which means consumption. Personally, I would prefer PHARMACEUTICAL grade for inhaling. Just my opinion.
And I think it's ok to question the plastics of tanks, the material make up of wicks or anything else like it. I have a strong suspicion if we don't question, request or demand high quality, safe PVs then inferior cheap products will be used and usually cheap doesn't equate to safe.
And BTW, I have no clue what your talking about w/pink medicine..I don't have kids. But if it's medicine, damn straight it was pharmaceutical grade, not food grade. Just say'in......
It's not actually all that complicated at all. Several members have made calculators and after you've been doing it a while you can pretty much do it in your head. I do, and I'm mathematically challenged
The questions have been answered. Repeatedly. However, the answers never seem to be good enough. These threads pop up all of the time here. The questions are always the same, and for some reason the persons asking never seems to be convinced that our liquids are as safe as they can possibly be.
Nothing in life is completely safe. Even stepping outside or crossing the street is a calculated risk.
I getcha and understand. I read on here a lot about vendors, PV's, batteries, coils, liquids...same kind of info over and over...if there wasn't repeat threads, there probably wouldn't be a lot to talk about. But it only seems that if people question health, safety...then the answer sometimes is demeaning like: "old topic, already covered, don't ask, go away..."
Could you imagine if a noob came in here and asked what PV to use and the answer was " we already discussed that a million times, troll, do your own search and go away". LMAO!!! I think the forum would be like one person..the creator of it. And being new and still in discovery mode, there are a TON of liquids/suppliers out there. You're buying over the Internet w/people you don't know and inhaling this stuff. It's new, it's scary and everyone has an opinion, many conflicting (some vets say don't buy liquids from China, some do is just one example) so to ask questions of safety is kind of normal.
Personally, I'm going to look into DIY because I can get nic w/out all the extra flavorings and stuff. I can just a little of my own. Talk about intimidating....read a post from someone named "DVap" and he's like a chemistry wiz. I'm nervous to ask any questions on those threads because I can't speak or spell French and that's what it looks like to me on all those DIY threads....completely over my head. Is there a DIY For Dummies book?
I see your point. It just gets rather tiresome to answer the same safety, battery, etc questions over and over again. In fact, most of the questions new vapers have can be answered by spending a little time here:
New Members Information
Here's a great DIY recipe calculator that really takes a lot of the guesswork out of the process.
eJuice Me Up - Best eJuice Calculator
It even has a bunch of recipes that you can try, or it will let you come up with your own. It's a lot of fun and I've learned a great deal from it.
While you are correct in that eating it is not the same as inhaling it....PG has been used in medical INHALERS since the 1950's. Also by the very way that smell works, you cannot smell anything that does not then go into your lungs. That means the flavorings.
Well, the long weekend is long over and still no reply (even a thank-you for the replies) from the OP. But I'm sure the "planting of doubt" negative title of the thread is alive and well on the internet.
I agree, but/and after a few minutes of furious introspection, I have to proclaim mea culpa.
I lurked here for over 5 months before signing up. During that time, I read all the InfoZone, blogs, banners, and stickies, and (oh my) hundreds of threads. I followed links to articles and reports. I familiarized myself with all the forum rules. I learned how to use the search feature. I became familiar with all the issues and with all the aspects of vaping. I learned how to recognize junk science and to break links to it. If I had questions (not yet being a member) I ran searches and read what had already been posted to answer (or not) those questions.
So yes, I get annoyed and impatient sometimes with posters who continue to start threads asking "the usual questions" when they could have found the answers in existing material. However, mea culpa, just because I went about it one way doesn't mean everyone else has to, or should, go about it the same way. As I've said before, I try to give them the benefit of the doubt and reply courteously and helpfully, but apparently courteous answers aren't enough for some people. And dissention is not allowed? Oh please.
I think from now on, instead of taking the time to write an actual reply, I'll use IBCR's method and simply post links to already-posted information. Easier for me, and probably more helpful to the original poster.
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