I refuse to buy clones or fakes. Anyone else?

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Papadragon

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  • Deleted by Caridwen
  • Reason: Insulting- knock it off

Steve803

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I doubt there is a cultural difference in my understanding of the expression "you get what you pay for", since I am also a native English speaker and uh, an economist [something I try to deny in polite company, but that's my life:)].

What I am contesting is the "thought-stopping cliche" which is what "you get what you pay for" actually is. It stops us from actually thinking because everyone thinks it is a true statement. It is not. It's an old wives' tale.

"You get what you purchase" is far more meaningful, realistic and useful because it makes us actually think.

Your story about your purchase is really an illustration of what I mean. You have defined a number of criteria for your purchases, and you evaluate an item and buy it according to your criteria. So you ARE getting what you've PURCHASED.

The actual price you are paying is incidental, irrelevant, essentially meaningless. It depends on so many factors that have nothing to do with the item's function or manufacture. You've got all sorts of stuff mixed up with price: monetary factors like taxes, MSP, overhead and profit margins, supply criteria such as rarity or market flooding, psychological factors like economic patriotism and elitism...

The actual price you are forking out could be a lot less than other products of the same category, or a lot more, or the same. The actual price in dollars, bucks, greenbacks, bottles of whiskey, kittens, or whatever you're trading, is just a number. It's just what you are willing to give over for the thing.

Something with a higher price is NOT necessarily better quality/value/worth, something with a lower price is NOT necessarily lesser. "You get what you pay for" always implies that inexpensive = not as good. And is a way of dissing lower-priced stuff automatically.

You were not being personally attacked when I wrote about the psychological criteria that we sometimes put into our purchase choices. It is a factor in some people's reasoning.

As long as you have decided what criteria are important to you, whatever they are, and what number of dollars you are willing to exchange for your item, you're good.

Just your criteria may not be the same as mine...

Good explanation Maggiemw and since you are an economist you would understand the numbers I put forth are what I found as value for a product that I found to be of lesser quality. I'm not saying that paying the big bucks for a product means it is better. I can get more miles for a better quality product even if it costs less then the big name brands. You can buy whatever you desire as you feel is value to you.

The originator or the post is looking for support for a products inventor and not the knock off king that stole an idea for fun and profit. It appears you are looking for an argument and I fed into it. vape in Peace and Quiet and let me make my statement as you are allowed to make yours.
 

Maggiemw

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It appears you are looking for an argument and I fed into it.

No, I'm too old to be looking for an argument. I thought we were contributing to a discussion, given that this is a discussion forum. You know, lots of ideas and perspectives being tossed around by a lot of different posters?

By the way, the OP would be hard-pressed to find the actual pedigree of what he sees as "original inventions."
 

2coils

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Benefits? Taxes? You might want to look at the management costs of these businesses. The only companies that have issues with too many benefits are government run or unionized. Most of the price gouging (which is what it is) is due to the owners and upper management wanting to rake in enough cash to start a different project. I'll tell you, they aren't paying their lowly packing workers and inventory makers a ton because they make so much profit. Probably a bunch of 19yo kids being payed $8 an hour.

Also I wonder how many of these American companies share your loyalty when they're sourcing all the parts they need to make these mods. My bet is damn near 100% of them buy their steel from china as most steel made in the US today is used in military applications. There only 3 or 4 blast furnaces still in operation in the entire USA. What would you say when you found out these companies are sourcing all their materials from other countries when they could source them here?

I would agree with you that some companies will get their materials from China and OTHER parts of the world. I will not back off my claim that its extremely expensive to run a business here opposed to China. All one has to to is look on the back of EVERYTHING we buy. It is like this for a reason. The whole manufacturing and economic structure is broken. I pay the bills for 8 business. The costs are never ending. At the end of the day the owner puts a small paycheck in his pocket. Most small business share the same problems.

Buy your products where you please. There are some folks out there that will do what they can to support our own economy. Others don't have that luxury or desire. That is fine too!!

Comparing the expense of a USA made item versus an item made in China, from a cost perspective, is impossible.
 

Zealous

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Here's the thing that I'm finding hard: (hopefully this isn't off topic & sorry in advance if it is) How does one KNOW the product they are purchasing is the real thing & not a fake? Now I'm not talking about "clones" as many vendors will just list the name of the product & say it's a ________ clone. Those are obvious & not what I'm talking about.

But then there are other listings like the one I was looking at last night. The product was a "Cobra" RBA but @ $8 was OBVIOUSLY NOT a "Cobra" Ok, so that's obvious too but only because I know the price is WAY too low to be what WOULD be charged for a Cobra(and the reviews all mentioned the poor quality of the product). But then I find another listing on another vendor's site for a Cobra (I'm looking at Cobra minis) and this one is around $26. The thing is that now I'm confused about how to know if it's ACTUALLY a Cobra or a fake someone's trying to sell as the real deal.

The vendor is someone who is associated with ECF so from that I would take it to mean they are a trusted vendor. But since I saw the super cheap one (not on this same vendor's site; it was another one) I'm now just not sure how to figure out if what I'm buying is the real deal.

So, from this point of view I think I would prefer to do away with the "fake" products too. I don't know how I feel about clones I don't think anyone saying their product is a clone is being deceitful or trying to steal from anyone. But the ones that call their product the exact same name as the real item are really frustrating.
 
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dr g

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I doubt there is a cultural difference in my understanding of the expression "you get what you pay for", since I am also a native English speaker and uh, an economist [something I try to deny in polite company, but that's my life:)].

What I am contesting is the "thought-stopping cliche" which is what "you get what you pay for" actually is. It stops us from actually thinking because everyone thinks it is a true statement. It is not. It's an old wives' tale.

"You get what you purchase" is far more meaningful, realistic and useful because it makes us actually think.

Your story about your purchase is really an illustration of what I mean. You have defined a number of criteria for your purchases, and you evaluate an item and buy it according to your criteria. So you ARE getting what you've PURCHASED.

The actual price you are paying is incidental, irrelevant, essentially meaningless. It depends on so many factors that have nothing to do with the item's function or manufacture. You've got all sorts of stuff mixed up with price: monetary factors like taxes, MSP, overhead and profit margins, supply criteria such as rarity or market flooding, psychological factors like economic patriotism and elitism...

The actual price you are forking out could be a lot less than other products of the same category, or a lot more, or the same. The actual price in dollars, bucks, greenbacks, bottles of whiskey, kittens, or whatever you're trading, is just a number. It's just what you are willing to give over for the thing.

Something with a higher price is NOT necessarily better quality/value/worth, something with a lower price is NOT necessarily lesser. "You get what you pay for" always implies that inexpensive = not as good. And is a way of dissing lower-priced stuff automatically.

You were not being personally attacked when I wrote about the psychological criteria that we sometimes put into our purchase choices. It is a factor in some people's reasoning.

As long as you have decided what criteria are important to you, whatever they are, and what number of dollars you are willing to exchange for your item, you're good.

Just your criteria may not be the same as mine...

:toast: What a great post!
 

fourtytwo

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...I am also a native English speaker and uh, an economist [something I try to deny in polite company, but that's my life:)].
...

Oh dear. All this time, I thought of you as a nice person. Now I find that you are an.... economist!?!?

:ohmy:

:lol::lol::lol:

I also find your comments on "thought-stopping cliche" to be very annoying. I agree with you 100% but you say it far better then I ever could.
 
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crxess

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Since this is still going think I will ask, on the economic standpoint.

It is right to buy Apples from the farmer with his road side stand while knowing he is supplying the local Grocery store?
After all he is cutting out income for several other people.

Under the right conditions I might put a really nice copy in my hand. It would be pleasing to the Eye though I would always know it was of lesser value.
Mona Lisa anyone?
Lastly, what are the differences between a Clone, Replica and duplicate? :D
 

Caridwen

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From the standpoint of ECF-

Unacceptable
Counterfeit - An exact replica of original device. This would include, logos and/or any markings in which the original device contains.

Acceptable
Clone - This is a device that may appear similar, with similar functionality, but does not contain any of the same markings.
 

fourtytwo

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Since this is still going think I will ask, on the economic standpoint.

It is right to buy Apples from the farmer with his road side stand while knowing he is supplying the local Grocery store?
After all he is cutting out income for several other people.

...

Is that not the reason many people perceive Factory Outlet malls to be a better value then regular retailers?
 

tanzmitpalmer

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I got a confession. I buy generic drugs as if my life depended on it. Now, I'm sure some will perceive that to be off topic.

I've got a confession, too. Sometimes I'll go ahead and download albums from bands I love because they released the week before I get paid.

It generally makes me even more pumped to have the real thing in my hands when I do get paid.
 
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