Issue with many vape shops...

[stols001]

Oh, I totally agree! I wish I'd known this stuff a long time ago. Thankfully, no one offered me a mech mod, but seriously, I wouldn't have known what it was if they did. My thoughts would have been "What a pretty looking tube mod."

It's just that not everyone thinks to research their vape equipment online, even, and I'm sure a lot of older transition-ers wouldn't do so either.... Possibly, at least some. I wonder if this issue with vape shops is somewhat different in other countries, and if there are some places where vape stores are more useful than others, and if so, what happened to make them more that way.... Like, did anyone feel TPD requirements improved the vape store experience (other than the ways in which it caused it to suck, I mean) for example? I just wonder if it's time to give up on the idea of vape B&M being able to do much education unless the owner's a pretty knowledgeable vaper and wants to take the time to train employees, etc? I don't know the answers, but I do think that by the time a person becomes educated enough to own a mod, they can buy something far more cheaply online. The last set of things I bought in a vape shop and it was one of the laundromats, the employee sold me 5 nautilus coils and only gave me 4. They were loose in a box, and only my extreme desire not to have a fit in a store allowed the purchase to continue.

When I got home and actually COUNTED them, I had to laugh, I'm afraid. I did not return for my "extra" coil. It's a little hard to take anything said by an employee such as ^^^^ seriously, though I'm sure had I been seeking a different kind of vape, that employee might have been quite helpful.

While I don't love purchasing vape equipment at incense vendor type smoke stores, I do like the fact that we have a lot of them about. I imagine I'd be able to get at least SOME equipment easily, even if it all gets banned. If I visited even of a fraction of them around here, I'm quite certain I could get all the N2 coils I needed fairly rapidly-- as Long as I Counted Them prior to leaving the establishment. LOL.

Anna

 

[EIHYPI]

Back a number of years ago mech mods were much more popular amongst vapers who wanted to subohm because there weren't too many high wattage subohm capable devices and those mods that were around that could subohm were so much money in shops. Those shops sold me 2 mechs around the same period of time without wondering about my previous experience or current experience with mods. Even though it's on the customer to educate themselves as many believe, I was never asked about my experience which I believe should happen somewhat in shops. It's not their responsibility but they are selling something, they should know basically what they are selling. Nowadays I don't think that a new vaper has a chance in getting sold a mech. I think thst the ones that get sold a mech are usually the ones who know enough about them. There is enough regulated mods on the market that shops are basically making their money on regulated mods. The issue that I believe is prevalent is the cool bro dude kid who wants to be vape cool and show off to their friends a mech. They can walk into a shop and get sold a mech with no questions asked just like years ago, from those same shops and that's an issue. The main problem with shops nowadays amongst the ones who are new to vaping especially is getting sold the wrong regulated setup for them.

 

[90VG]

@dethmedalmuziq That happened to a friend of mine. He wanted to quit smoking, and knew I did with vaping. So instead of asking me, he went to a vape shop and they sold him a Smok Stick V8 with a Baby Beast. A pack a day smoker can't inhale that right off the bat. It's in his junk pile now. It's a regulated mech mod on a powerful tank. That's stupid for quitting smoking as first mod.

 

[puffon]

What's a vape shop?
The ones around here ...... me off so bad with their massive mark ups and just not giving a damn what customers wanted that I even stopped looking for any such thing as a decent vape shop. Eff em.
I don't need any stankin' vape shop.

I actually do drop into one local combo tobacco/vape shop (!!??) about twice a year for a non vape item. I Purposely vape like a fiend when I go in there just to let them know I don't spend a damn dime on their over priced stuff.

Bruce in Ocala, Fl-who is an informed, take no crap consumer

I've given up on them around here too.
What about Gainsville? Being a college town, they might have more to offer.
Too long of a drive for me tho.

 

[MMW]

Most shops in NH seem to be sponsored by Smok ffs. That's their target audience and the biggest reason I never go to any of them. Slanging juice and coil heads.

 

[Eskie]

Oh no, I am against increasing regulations, you misread my post. I'm just stating that people need to do their own research on what to buy for their needs and not rely on vape shop employees. We do not need more government regulations to be our babysitter.

In a perfect world, buying in a B&M vape shop should be personalized vape gear selection and education. If it's a person doing their own research, they do better online than the local B&M. As many are folks looking to stop smoking, and have a vague at best idea what vaping is and what they should be researching, they're at as much at risk of a poor selection as walking into a shop with employees who are uneducated in vaping and uninterested in educating their customers.

 

[ScottP]

Why are you guys straight bashing on vape shops? Online stores don't do anymore to educate or inquire about a customer's experience before selling a mech. They will happily sell one to a newbie just as fast as a B&M shop will. Don't get me wrong, I 100% do think that they should ask about experience and knowledge before selling them, but to blame them for doing the same thing as online shops seems somehow hypocritical.

I agree with Eskie that in a perfect world a B&M salesperson would talk with the customer and make sure they got what they NEEDED and understood how to use it properly and all risks associated with whatever device was being sold. Unfortunately we live in a world where time is money and the faster they can make that sale and move to the next customer, the more money they make. However allowing a customer to pick what they want and make the sale "no questions asked" is exactly the online business model as well. So to exclude them from this discussion is kind of missing the point.

 

[stols001]

Well, I think that's absolutely correct but to be honest, I don't know that many folks purchasing their very first mod know about fasttech for example, unless they've done some research. I do think it's probably harder to get to online buying without at least some research, but not always. I guess there really is no way at this point to get the right vape into the hands of the correct customer 100% of the time. I like to think that folks having difficulty will go somewhere for assistance, but it can get frustrating when someone comes along with say COPD and a sub0hm setup and then they're already feeling they have "failed" at vaping, and then that member may have often spent what they budgeted on a setup, which often means members here may PIF equipment, but that's kind of an ideal situation. I think there are plenty of folks who've gotten turned off by the experience (since they didn't know enough) and just moved back to smoking. Or, they may not show up on a site like this at all.

Or, they do, purchase what is helpful, and stick around and succeed. I suppose in an idealistic world everyone would get the perfect setup the first time, and success at vaping has less to do with the initial setup and more to do with persistence and willingness to try new things, as well. There's always the optimistic look, too. I mean.... I could have easily put my setup down and kept smoking, but I didn't as I really really wanted to succeed.

So, I'm not seeing any realistic way to increase education across the board without limiting individual freedoms in a way that seems reasonable. I just hope that folks who are having trouble with their vaping equipment know a more experienced vaper who can help, and I think that might quite often be the case, as well.

Ann

 

[EIHYPI]

Why are you guys straight bashing on vape shops? Online stores don't do anymore to educate or inquire about a customer's experience before selling a mech. They will happily sell one to a newbie just as fast as a B&M shop will. Don't get me wrong, I 100% do think that they should ask about experience and knowledge before selling them, but to blame them for doing the same thing as online shops seems somehow hypocritical.

I agree with Eskie that in a perfect world a B&M salesperson would talk with the customer and make sure they got what they NEEDED and understood how to use it properly and all risks associated with whatever device was being sold. Unfortunately we live in a world where time is money and the faster they can make that sale and move to the next customer, the more money they make. However allowing a customer to pick what they want and make the sale "no questions asked" is exactly the online business model as well. So to exclude them from this discussion is kind of missing the point.

People generally know what they are looking for when they buy something online. If not it's their problem. But when someone walks into a vape shop, they are greeted by, "hello what can I do for you, how can I help you". There are human beings behind the counter. Some questions should then be asked like, "how many cigarettes do you smoke" or "are you looking for a mtl device or dl" and then followed an explanation on what that is. People go to a shop for the customer service that is hopefully there so they can be assisted with making the right choice in a purchase on a topic they are clueless about.

 

[Eskie]

Why are you guys straight bashing on vape shops? Online stores don't do anymore to educate or inquire about a customer's experience before selling a mech. They will happily sell one to a newbie just as fast as a B&M shop will. Don't get me wrong, I 100% do think that they should ask about experience and knowledge before selling them, but to blame them for doing the same thing as online shops seems somehow hypocritical.

I agree with Eskie that in a perfect world a B&M salesperson would talk with the customer and make sure they got what they NEEDED and understood how to use it properly and all risks associated with whatever device was being sold. Unfortunately we live in a world where time is money and the faster they can make that sale and move to the next customer, the more money they make. However allowing a customer to pick what they want and make the sale "no questions asked" is exactly the online business model as well. So to exclude them from this discussion is kind of missing the point.

I don't think you can hold an online vendor to the same standards. An online vendor has no ability to provide individualized evaluation and education. That's also why it's so much cheaper than a B&M. Their overhead is warehouse space (and not all that large unless it's a huge vendor), and shipping employees. No fancy displays, no salespeople, no more expensive real estate expenses (unlike a store) warehouses are not in located in high rent areas, while a B&M does need to consider things like accessibility for customers.

The cost differential between B&M and online comes down to the immediate gratification of walking out with a new kit instead of watching for the mailman, and value added support from the store's staff. Sadly a good number of vape shops don't offer or stress then need for value added support and individualized guidance into the best choice for a customer.

 

[ScottP]

There are two types of consumers of any product. Those that show up to a store or even a dealership and have no clue what they want or even what they need, and those that show up after having done hours and hours of research, comparisons, and price checks. Those in the latter group will have a better experience, get what they really want, usually save money and rarely have buyers remorse. I don't think it will ever be possible to get the former group to become the latter, nor will it be possible to get sellers to force knowledge down someone's throat. How do you educate the willfully ignorant?

EDIT: I should add that most vape shop employees (not the owners) are just minimum wage workers. They care about as much about the customer as the average McDonald's employee does. They are just counting the hours until they get off and go do something else.

 

[gofishtx]

There are two types of consumers of any product. Those that show up to a store or even a dealership and have no clue what they want or even what they need, and those that show up after having done hours and hours of research, comparisons, and price checks. Those in the latter group will have a better experience, get what they really want, usually save money and rarely have buyers remorse. I don't think it will ever be possible to get the former group to become the latter, nor will it be possible to get sellers to force knowledge down someone's throat. How do you educate the willfully ignorant?

Yep, and it's not just vape shops. Try sending your grandmother to Best Buy to get a laptop just for emails and face booking her grandchildren and then find a salesperson sold her a gaming laptop with AMD Quad Core and Radeon Graphics 12 gigs of Ram and 1 TB memory. How many people rushed out and bought 4K Ultra Televisions and have nothing that transmits at 4K? So who is at fault? The store that did not train an employee to assist the customer to their needs or abilities? or the customer who did not do the research to get the best product suitable for their needs? Looks to me like the blame can go both ways, of course a salesperson can only impart the knowledge and if the customer is set on getting a mech mod or something else outside of their knowledge and capabilities then most of the blame still falls on the customer........

 

[ScottP]

Yep, and it's not just vape shops. try sending your grandmother to Best Buy to get a laptop just for emails and face booking her grandchildren and then find a salesperson sold her a gaming laptop with AMD Quad Core and Radeon Graphics 12 gigs of Ram and 1 TB memory. How many people rushed out and bought 4K Ultra Televisions and have nothing that transmits at 4K? So who is at fault? The store that did not train an employee to assist the customer to their needs or abilities? or the customer who did not do the research to get the best product suitable for their needs? Looks to me like the blame can go both ways

The blame can go both ways, but only if you want to have no more B&M stores for anything except groceries and gas. Minimum wage retail jobs have a very high turn over rate, so as fast as they could train people properly they would be gone....UNLESS they paid them enough to stay...BUT to do that they would have to raise prices and no longer be competitive, especially with online pricing, and they end up going out of business. Even if they offered super duper .... smooching service and bent over backwards to lead the customer to the perfect right product, if the price was too high, most customers would thank the sales person then go home and buy the exact same item online for half the cost.

I 100% agree it is a problem, but sadly it is one to which I don't really see a good solution.

 

[gofishtx]

The blame can go both ways, but only if you want to have no more B&M stores for anything except groceries and gas. Minimum wage retail jobs have a very high turn over rate, so as fast as they could train people properly they would be gone....UNLESS they paid them enough to stay...BUT to do that they would have to raise prices and no longer be competitive, especially with online pricing, and they end up going out of business. Even if they offered super duper .... smooching service and bent over backwards to lead the customer to the perfect right product, if the price was too high, most customers would thank the sales person then go home and buy the exact same item online for half the cost.

I 100% agree it is a problem, but sadly it is one to which I don't really see a good solution.

No solution I can see, you can't force someone not to do something stupid

 

[ScottP]

No solution I can see, you can't force someone not to do something stupid

Exactly. The good news is at least it would be hard to win a Darwin award with an vape device.

 

[OcalaFlGuy]

Why are you guys straight bashing on vape shops?

Because I've never seen one within 30 miles of here that was worth a flying damn?

I will say though that Marion county Florida is the most rip off local vender place I've ever lived in my
life. For most everything. So here anyway, it's probably Not just crappy vape shops.
Bruce in Slocala, Fl

 

[listopencil]

Why are you guys straight bashing on vape shops?

Because they're ripping people off.

If you already know what you're doing (and what you need) then the sensible thing to do is to go find your product at the best price from a vendor that offers reasonable customer service. And that vendor will be online. Because that vendor can take advantage of low overhead. And that vendor can acquire their merchandise at a better cost by taking advantage of more efficient logistics than a vape store can manage.

So a vape store is going to be more expensive just because of how their business operates and I know that before I walk in the door. The benefit you receive from paying those higher prices is that you get the convenience of dealing with the vendor face to face. So you're orders should be 100% correct nearly every single time. You should be able to get supplies for whatever equipment the business carries whenever the doors are open. You should be able to have a conversation with your salesperson to make sure that you are getting the product that you want. You should be able to return defective merchandise for replacement or refund with very little hassle. And so on.

I demand better service from a vape shop because I'm paying for it. If they can't provide that then they can go kick rocks. Rip somebody else off, I'd rather wait for my stuff to be shipped to me.

 

[ScottP]

Because they're ripping people off.

If you already know what you're doing (and what you need) then the sensible thing to do is to go find your product at the best price from a vendor that offers reasonable customer service. And that vendor will be online. Because that vendor can take advantage of low overhead. And that vendor can acquire their merchandise at a better cost by taking advantage of more efficient logistics than a vape store can manage.

So a vape store is going to be more expensive just because of how their business operates and I know that before I walk in the door. The benefit you receive from paying those higher prices is that you get the convenience of dealing with the vendor face to face. So you're orders should be 100% correct nearly every single time. You should be able to get supplies for whatever equipment the business carries whenever the doors are open. You should be able to have a conversation with your salesperson to make sure that you are getting the product that you want. You should be able to return defective merchandise for replacement or refund with very little hassle. And so on.

I demand better service from a vape shop because I'm paying for it. If they can't provide that then they can go kick rocks. Rip somebody else off, I'd rather wait for my stuff to be shipped to me.

If you actually believe a minimum wage salesperson or worse a commissioned salesperson has your best interests at heart and not just selling you the most expensive thing they think they can talk you into then you deserve to be ripped of.

Try going into a place like Best Buy and talk to their min wage sales people about a TV, start asking them questions about all the different technology. They are going to keep looking away in some direction that isn't you hoping you will get the hint to stop asking questions and just buy something already. Now if you go to a place with commissioned sales people they give you their undivided attention, BUT if you only need a 32" 720p TV they are going to do their damnedest to sell you a 65" UHD latest and greatest, but will settle for somewhere in between. In neither case are you going to get the right help.

Expecting more from a min wage employee at Mom & Pop's Vape Shop is just silly. The B&M prices ARE higher as you said due to their business model, the real estate costs, and labor costs. Their prices are NOT higher b/c they provide exemplary service. Most people pay those higher prices, not b/c of service but b/c we live in an instant gratification society where if people have to wait for something for more than 10 seconds they either get mad or bored and go do something else. Patience is a virtue that few still have and stores are more than willing to capitalize on that.

I do, however, think most people here on ECF have developed an unprecedented level of patience waiting on orders from FastTech.

 

[R2sojr]

My first experience with a vape shop was a alliance rda @.22ohms on an istick 50w. Dual 22 gage. Would barely even fire. Had no idea what the heck I was doing. Vaping should be personalized like a tailored suit. Someone should sit down with you, ask you why you wanna quit smoking, what do you enjoy about smoking, throat hit and etc. Then come up with a few items to choose from. BUT it’s more like how many packs you smoke a day. Ok you Smoke 1, here’s a subohm tank that requires 50watts right off the bat. Customer goes home, burns out both his coils the same day and goes back to smoking. Meanwhile the shop just collected $100 for a mod that’s $45 online and 1-2 bottles of juice. Customer now has negative views on vaping.

 

[ScottP]

My first experience with a vape shop was a alliance rda @.22ohms on an istick 50w. Dual 22 gage. Would barely even fire. Had no idea what the heck I was doing. Vaping should be personalized like a tailored suit. Someone should sit down with you, ask you why you wanna quit smoking, what do you enjoy about smoking, throat hit and etc. Then come up with a few items to choose from. BUT it’s more like how many packs you smoke a day. Ok you Smoke 1, here’s a subohm tank that requires 50watts right off the bat. Customer goes home, burns out both his coils the same day and goes back to smoking. Meanwhile the shop just collected $100 for a mod that’s $45 online and 1-2 bottles of juice. Customer now has negative views on vaping.

I agree 100%...1000% even. However, that is why a custom tailored suit costs thousands while an off the rack suit can be a couple hundred. So how do we get that level of service without having employees that have to go through serious training to ask the right questions and match the right products to the right situation, then get paid enough to actually stay put WITHOUT having that $50 mod cost $300?

That is my whole point here. Ripping on Stores for prices while simultaneously ripping on them b/c they don't have high paid, high trained staff is dumb. You can't have it both ways.