Kids are not my problem, who will think of the adults?
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I didn't state "my immigration opinion" which is much more complicated.
What I stated, and it has as much to do with vaping as any other analogy, is that focusing on the wrong thing won't work, particularly when there's easy ways to get around it. It becomes an abstract symbol of a crusade, rather than a real solution. And it infiltrates all of life. Politics too. Life the universe and everything.
Look for the other agendas. But flavors-bans, like the wall, still have motives. Even if both are ineffective solutions.
Pick your analogy. Trojan horses?
Whatever, take the point and take it "Outside", unless your pleasures in life arise out of irritating half the people here.
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No.
The point is about abstraction. About "easy fixes" to complex problems. About politics. And about manipulating the population. And it's all part and parcel, and the other posts say that too.
Pick your abstraction.
"Scary looking gun" ban?
Flavor ban?
Wall fixing immigration?
All simple fixes that, as far as I can tell, won't work. Further, we're discussing MONEY. And hidden agendas. And social issues, addiction, health, or population or terrorist acts.
And that's what we're discussing.
But I don't think Whitmer is insincere in her desire to "deal with youth addiction". I just think 1) she's not telling the whole story and 2) that she's probably naive about it.
And we're all subject to this phenomenon. Red or blue. There's probably 100 examples.
This forum seems to contain many jaded people who are quite complacent to remark, "I'm not surprised by anything anymore" and, "I saw it coming," and to dismiss outrage and activism as naive and optimistic. As satisfying as it may feel to say "I told you so," hearing that you've given up does nothing to help the problem.
^^ Yeah, and vote them all out too, until they start dealing with the actual complexities and/or at least quit placating us with simple solution crap.
Gotta disagree with you pops. If it wasnt all about the money, they wouldnt be killing so many kids before they even have a chance. Sometimes, its all about the money. If they gave a damn about these kids, you know.
Sometimes the simplest answer, is the correct answer.
Sometimes the simplest answer, is the correct answer.
Expert: More kids test positive for THC than nicotine
Michigans's e-cigarette ban comes with harsh-penalties
"According to the column, a person found in possession of a single pack of e-cigarettes and pods could face years in prison, as well as fines (emphasis added):
These interventions are, indeed, unduly harsh. According to the executive order, anyone found with four or more flavored vaping products is "presumed to possess said items with the intent to sell." This is punishable by imprisonment of six months and a fine per item. Given that disposable e-cigarettes and pods are often sold in packs of four or five, the fines and years of imprisonment can easily add up."
These interventions are, indeed, unduly harsh. According to the executive order, anyone found with four or more flavored vaping products is "presumed to possess said items with the intent to sell." This is punishable by imprisonment of six months and a fine per item. Given that disposable e-cigarettes and pods are often sold in packs of four or five, the fines and years of imprisonment can easily add up."
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I respect your opinion.
Seriously though, I can't explain that list I published if it was "all about the money" from any one angle, since doing all that ANTZ stuff COSTS money to our society in the short term. Besides...who's money? From which side? "The money" is too vague. There's BT money, there's state revenue money, there's money SAVED due to lower HC costs for smokers switching, there's theoretically HC money saved if youths don't take up vaping, there's mom-and-pop shop money. Money is just an abstraction of something else. But who's something-else?
I think there's many forces at play all at once, and life is messy. But at least we agree that it's money-related in large part, from all sides, including sales, including healthcare, and everything in between. Because money is an abstraction of other stuff.
Its all about demonizing vaping to the point of being able to own it. Its about money from profits, and making anything short of the approved and regulated design illegal.
The same people that want to control vaping, are the same people that legalized the other stuff, knowing full well the dangers it poses to children.
The same people that want to control vaping, are the same people that legalized the other stuff, knowing full well the dangers it poses to children.
Just to clarify --- there's no 2011 tobacco settlement in question, it is the 1998 Master Settlement Agreement (MSA).
Oh. So in your point money = BT takeover and maybe state revenue.
OK.
For the record, you'll find several threads here that say I think that such IS happening, and that it's probably "over" for vaping as we know it today. Go ahead and protest/call/write though.
So if you're being "zen" about it and saying "this is what's happening around us this second", sure. I think the larger issue is more complex. My guess is that there's a bigger agenda with backdoor deals to 1) eliminate smoking (nic free cigs?) 2) Give states revenue and 3) give BT incentive by throwing us under the bus and letting them take the market.
I think it's an out and out conspiracy, but with a larger issue of eliminating cigs and probably loose tobacco too.
And I'm wearing my tin-foil hat this morning too. But it would make sense.
Short of all that, it would mean that our politicians are even dumber than I think, and that they're all simpletons and they think we're all sheep, and they're easily manipulated by BT. And/or getting kickbacks.
Ask the kiddies how to get around a vape flavor ban, they google better than we do and we do it, right?
I mean sheesh. The politicians just can't be that dumb. Whitmer either. She might be ANTZ but she's just not that dumb. There's got to be more to it. Money, yeah. But where? I think it's long-term healthcare costs for society as a whole (500,000 deaths per year from smoking). I think that's their real target, and also reducing nic addiction (damages circulation).NY flavored e-cig ban is not enough to stop teen vapers
I mean. Duh.
I've got my "fackbook blocker" going but I used the Inhaler and successfully quit smoking. Then the doc I went to left for greener pastures the next one up would not re-new the script citing how foolish I was, substituting one form of addiction for another. I mentioned carbon monoxide and particulate matter then we parted company. I began to smoke again, I am sure somewhere he was pleased. I didn't have the time or patience to shop for a doc with some sense and not just initials after the name.
If you're interested we have a petition to get Governor Cuomo out of office in NYS
Sign the Petition
Sign the Petition
Yeah, ticks me off too.
On the other hand I don't think it's about parents abdicating their parental responsibilities. My parents tried very hard and I still smoked and drank. I would probably have done worse but cigs and alcohol is all that was around when I was teen. Parents try but it doesn't necessarily work.
What's changed isn't parents not trying these days. It's parents wanting society to do what they have tried and failed to do themselves. And I suspect society is going to have no more luck than the parents did. Kids are going to rebel. It's probably something that got built into our genetic code over millions of years. Like the goody-goody obedient kids who only do what they are told are less likely to survive and produce offspring or something.
If you're interested we have a petition to get Governor Cuomo out of office in NYS
Sign the Petition
Unfortunately, I believe NY is at the same level of corruption that Cali is. Your vote no longer matters.
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