Let's Talk Batteries

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FeistyAlice

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So, basically, the green LiFePo4 green tenergy are worth crap and are dangerous? Pretty much everyone that vapes at 6V with Reos, in Italy, is using them (myself included). Did I get this right?!?

This link basically says it all. Everyone please read. Study it very closely. I'm going to read it every day until I can almost recite it by memory. I have no reason to doubt the validity.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-mods-update-february-2012-a.html#post5327522

I've been able to determine that, from various sources, with the Tenergy small batteries, specifically, the C rating is approximately equilivilant to the mAH rating. (This does not apply, as rigidly, to other batteries.) 1000 mAH=1AH so 900 mAH would be a maximum of 0.90 C; not nearly what is safe to use for our high drain applications. The Green marked LiFEPO4 are 750 mAH which is approximately 0.75 max C rating. That is even worse. DANGER DANGER DANGER!!!!!

From all the reading I've done, in past 12 hours, the one thing I know for certain is that my green label Tenergy RCR123a are going into the battery recycle box immediately. (I like to wrap them in tape to keep terminals from touching.)

I'm uncertain just what the chemistry is of the blue marked Tenergy. If they are what I think they are they are 900mah and therfore have a rating of <1C at max. I'm going to recycle those, too.

Always keep in mind that the manufacturers, of many of the brands of battteries, over rate the capacities.

I'm not going to take the risk. Period!!!

Feisty Alice
 

FeistyAlice

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Thank you my friend.....I'm honored:)
I try to do my best, using the memories of the exams of English language, which I supported during the the university years, because the translation software or the web translator, I realize that often are useless and take out nonsense phrases!!!:facepalm: If I should trust, solely, to their translations, you would take me for a fool:laugh:

In fact, when you mentioned about the blue Tenergy Lifepo4 I I was surprised.
I know that these batteries are only Li-ion and not Lifepo4, but I did not say anything because there was the possibility that you'd buy in any store that I have never seen.
However, there is a very simple way to understand this. If they are simple Li-ion batteries, then they should have the protection circuit. This last, generally has a thickness of 1-1.5 mm and is positioned in the bottom of the batt. Thus, it is sufficient that you compare the blue Tenergy with the green ones, if the blue are longer than about 1mm, then they are surely the Li-I 900mAh

About the Green Label tenergy, they are sold as a battery of 750 mAH: Tenergy 30200 LiFePO4 RCR123A 3.0V (3.2V) 750mAh Rechargeable Battery (even if, as I said, I think their true amperage is about 500mAh)

Here is the link of the tests made by some engineers that are in my forum: Dati misurati sulle prestazioni delle batterie
The 3D is very long, but you read only the important posts (those with data, numbers, and graphics) that are at intervals along the 3d....... helping you with a translator, you should be able to understand what are the brands and type of batteries that have values ​​of amperage rated, that is close to the effective one (tests, in fact, have been conducted comparing various brands of 18650, 18490, 18350, 16340/CR123A, 15270, etc ...)

And here there is a post that I wrote about Tenergy lifepo4 vs AW Lifepo 3v (it is partially in English:)): Tenergy lifepo4 vs AW Lifepo 3v

Then if you need a hand with the translation, I'm here for you:)

As I type this I see others have supplied some of the information I have just recently posted. This battery discussion is really cooking now.;)

Thank you so very much. I've been unsure about the chemistry of the Blue Label because of the notation, in very small print, about using proper charger and then LiFEPO4 in parentheses. I had to use a magnifying glass to read the small print.

The height difference between the Blue and Green label Tenery is less than 1mm and barely noticible by sight. There does appear, on very close inspection, to be an indention in the plastic, ringing the battery, about 3 mm, up from bottom, indicating a probable protection circuit. It is a much thicker circuit disc than on my other protected batteries. Later, today, after I take my sleep I will peel the plastic off to inspect.

Feisty Alice
 
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FeistyAlice

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Hi everyone I'm new to posting here. Not new to the reo( I've had a grand about 6 months) I also use the green tenergy's. I have used them for about 4 months,first couple of months I used the blue tenergy's. I have had no problem out of them and love both blue and green, until yesterday. I was vaping away and I notice my hit was cut short. When I took off the door of the reo the spring had collapsed and the tenergy's were very hot. They didn't explode but probably close (IMHO ) upon further inspection the mechanical switch had melted the bottom of the plastic button. Im no expert by no means but it all look like a dead short, although I had not used the reo any differently that I have for the last 6 months and things had been fine. I don't know if this helps anyone I hope it does. I just wanted to let everyone know, this happened within in seconds I didn't hold the button for more than 2 seconds before this happened. So everyone be carefull when stacking batts no matter what kind or chemistry they are.

I am so happy to hear you did not get injured. Your experience will add more fuel to our "fire" to get everyone to understand the importance of using only safe batteries. Thank you so much for sharing your exerience.

I grew up in KY; Shelbyville. I've been in Texas so long, though, I get TX and KY towns confused in my memory. What are you close to? Mlinky, a valued REOnaut, lives in Louisville.

Feisty Alice

{edit} Right at this moment I'm using a GLV SuperMini, with a 6" gooseneck and an M1A1 1.5" tank with a 1.7 ohm Resurector. Although the GLV has four hole in the bottom, for venting, imagine the risk using the small Tenergy in it with such high drain from the 1.7 ohm carto! GLV Super Mini will take only the RCR123a size. I have been using a single Ultrafire (just checked... it's AW) protected 3.7v thank goodness.
 
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Mudflap

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There is so much information on this thread about batteries that needs to be seen by all.

I really feel it should be moved to it's own thread. More people might have the opportunity to find and read it! Just my own two cents!

The information has been posted, linked, stickied, bolded, and shouted from the rooftops. At the end of the day, some folks will read up on batteries and make the appropriate choices for their application and others will read far enough to determine the necessary battery size and then go buy the cheapest they can find.
 

nerak

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The information has been posted, linked, stickied, bolded, and shouted from the rooftops. At the end of the day, some folks will read up on batteries and make the appropriate choices for their application and others will read far enough to determine the necessary battery size and then go buy the cheapest they can find.

I agree Tripp. Some will throw caution to the wind. Just felt that since this a VV REO's thread, and stacking batteries is also done in other REO's, it might help to have the information separate. I apologize if my suggestion is out of place.
 

Mudflap

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I agree Tripp. Some will throw caution to the wind. Just felt that since this a VV REO's thread, and stacking batteries is also done in other REO's, it might help to have the information separate. I apologize if my suggestion is out of place.

Your suggestion was just fine and I wasn't implying otherwise.

I think Rob knew what he was doing when he chose the notcigs chip for his VV Reos. The built in protections will most likely prevent some bad results when less than ideal batteries are used in his mods. And they will be.

Still, we should continue to inform and educate everyone who shows interest. You do a tremendous job with that.
 

FeistyAlice

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The information has been posted, linked, stickied, bolded, and shouted from the rooftops. At the end of the day, some folks will read up on batteries and make the appropriate choices for their application and others will read far enough to determine the necessary battery size and then go buy the cheapest they can find.

Yeah but, yeah but...... a lot of people don't have the time to do a lot of surfing around the subforms and threads. Just saying.

Hugs, Feisty Alice
 

Mudflap

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Yeah but, yeah but...... a lot of people don't have the time to do a lot of surfing around the subforms and threads. Just saying.

Hugs, Feisty Alice

Agreed! That's why I'm disturbed by the fact that many vape oriented vendors are selling cheap, low quality, low c-rating, batteries.
 

gorman

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Well, the thing is, until now everywhere I read, everybody was claiming that Tenergy, being LiFePo4 were safe due to their chemistry not requiring protection. As this doesn't appear to be the case, I think that in the Reo section (and on the website) there should be a clear warning not to use them and to buy only the AW LiFePo4 (that appear to have high enough c-rating).

Edit: sorry, missed Wayne's request. You are right, obviously. I just hope this doesn't remain buried withing a multipage thread.
 

ufo

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Ciao ufo, check the main battery topic in the ECF library. It specifically mentions Tenergy LiFePo4.

Controlla il thread nella library, fa riferimento esplicito alle Tenergy LiFePo4. Ora sono su Tapatalk, se no te lo likerei.

I apologize if I answer in Italian, but it's hard for me to enter into technical details using a language not mine. I therefore ask to my friend Gorman, who knows English better than I, to translate this my post in my place:)

@gorman
L'ho letto. Ma, a quanto mi pare di capire, non si riferisce esplicitamente alle tenergy cr123a, ma celle tenergy non bene specificate (parla infatti di small: forse la tenergy produce anche taglie più piccole....non so).
Invece, so per certo che la tenergy produce anche altri modelli (come ad es le 18650 che hanno un valore di 10C Cylindrical) Questo mi induce a credere che quel 3d che a cui ti riferisci (anche un pò vecchiotto, visto che è del 2010) non sia da prendere alla lettera, visto che parla di uno "C rating" di 1C per le tenegy cr123a e dice anche che "buone celle" Lifepo4 devono avere da 5C a 10C, ma come hai visto dal link che ho messo, la tenergy fa tranquillamente batt da 10C, quindi come possono esserci celle tenergy di "buona qualità" ed altre di "low-quality grade"???? Un pò strano, non ti pare?:D

Inoltre, se buone celle Lifepo4 devono avere minimo 5C di scarica, allora bisognerebbe presumere che le AW Lifpo4 raggiungano minimo tale valore, ma chissà perchè ho cercato per tanto tempo i dati riguardo queste batt e non ho mai trovato nulla che lo faccia supporre (se non voci ufficiose) Tanto più che, conosci anche tu le tenergy da 3v e solo a svaparci ti accorgi dallo spunto che non possono essere solamente da 1C.....l'atom non si muoverebbe neppure:D

Ed ancora: supponendo che le AW Lifepo4 avessero minimo 5C (requisito minimo per buone celle Lifepo, come viene sostenuto in quel link) allora dovrebbero avere uno spunto molto, ma molto superiore alle tenergy.......e sai bene anche tu che non è così, anzi non si notano praticamente differenze tra le due batt.;)
Quindi, io leggo sempre con molto interesse dati, informazioni e 3d in materia di batt (e di ogni altro argomento tecnico), ma alla fin fine cerco sempre di verificare personalmente la fondatezza di ciò che leggo, perchè, come in questo caso, di dichiarazioni un pò "dubbie", a mio avviso,ce ne sono ;)

Inoltre, riguardo alla questione sicurezza, uso le tenergy cr123a da una vita, le ho maltrattate, sovraccaricate, mandate in corto e mai (dico mai) mi hanno dato problemi.....neppure si scaldavano più di tanto: quindi l'esplosione la escluderei proprio, almeno per l'uso che facciamo noi con queste batt.
Anzi, ho sentito rari casi di esplosione di AW IMR, ma di Lifepo4 non mi è mai capitato.
Ho fatto tutta questa tirata, di cui mi scuso, solamente per arrivare ad una conclusione: quando si parla di batterie e della loro sicurezza, ognuno ha le proprie teorie, i propri dati e le proprie convinzioni e si trovano in giro informazioni che spesso sono molto contraddittorie tra loro.....ecco perchè "finchè non provo, non credo"
Ho provato CR123 Li-ion di vare marche, tenergy Lifepo4, AW Lifepo4, ecc.... praticamente ho provato quasi tutta la tipologia, ed a me sembra che le tenergy Lifepo4 siano gran buone batt, forse un pelino meglio anche delle AW.....e questo a dispetto di qualunque dato od opinione io possa leggere in merito.

Ti chiedo un favore amico mio, tu che sei quasi di madrelingua, potresti tradurre questo mio post, perchè io ci metterei una vita, visto che si parla di questioni abbastanza tecniche.

Grazie
 

whatitstrue

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As to the question of why the postive battery or "top" battery drains faster. The simple answer is because electricity is pulled from the battery from the positive end. When you have stacked batteries the positive end will drain faster becuse its supplying more of the power to the device.

As has been said, swithcing battery positions mid way thru will keep the drain more concistant between the 2 because of this.

If this has been answered already. sorry I'm still sevral pages back.
 

ufo

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Ok people this thread is about Robs new VV Mod not battery,s

The last 5 pages I just read had nothing but battery chatter in it. Now we can not find any info on the Mod we originally started talking about.

You are absolutely right.
When I start talking about a topic, often I have the defect of not paying attention to where I am.
Take away all my posts if necessary, because they are effectively off topic

I'm sorry.:oops:
 

Mudflap

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Ok people this thread is about Robs new VV Mod not battery,s

The last 5 pages I just read had nothing but battery chatter in it. Now we can not find any info on the Mod we originally started talking about.

+1 on that Wayne

That's the nature of discussion forums. You can't control what people want to discuss. If you want to moderate it, go ahead.

abc_tom_holloway_ecigarette_nt_120215_wg.jpg


Tom Holloway might have read all sorts of glowing comments about his mod and how great it worked at 6 volts with stacked batteries. What if the same discussions included information about necessary precautions? I suppose it was his responsibility to go seek out that information so that mod discussions could stay "on track."

Just because you two have been vaping for a few years, have owned a few hundred mods between you both, and have read and understood the ins and outs of battery safety, does not mean everyone interested in VV Reos has an equal understanding. It needs to be discussed. A thread about a mod which will use stacked batteries seems like a pretty good place for that discussion if you ask me.

Thanks for the condescending slap on the wrist, though. That was very encouraging.
 

MXBNW

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Nope have at it.

I was just stating that its getting hard to find the info that this thread was intended to provide.





That's the nature of discussion forums. You can't control what people want to discuss. If you want to moderate it, go ahead.

abc_tom_holloway_ecigarette_nt_120215_wg.jpg


Tom Holloway might have read all sorts of glowing comments about his mod and how great it worked at 6 volts with stacked batteries. What if the same discussions included information about necessary precautions? I suppose it was his responsibility to go seek out that information so that mod discussions could stay "on track."

Just because you two have been vaping for a few years, have owned a few hundred mods between you both, and have read and understood the ins and outs of battery safety, does not mean everyone interested in VV Reos has an equal understanding. It needs to be discussed. A thread about a mod which will use stacked batteries seems like a pretty good place for that discussion if you ask me.

Thanks for the condescending slap on the wrist, though. That was very encouraging.
 

Odell

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Ok people this thread is about Robs new VV Mod not battery,s

The last 5 pages I just read had nothing but battery chatter in it. Now we can not find any info on the Mod we originally started talking about.

That's the nature of discussion forums. You can't control what people want to discuss. If you want to moderate it, go ahead.


Tom Holloway might have read all sorts of glowing comments about his mod and how great it worked at 6 volts with stacked batteries. What if the same discussions included information about necessary precautions? I suppose it was his responsibility to go seek out that information so that mod discussions could stay "on track."

Just because you two have been vaping for a few years, have owned a few hundred mods between you both, and have read and understood the ins and outs of battery safety, does not mean everyone interested in VV Reos has an equal understanding. It needs to be discussed. A thread about a mod which will use stacked batteries seems like a pretty good place for that discussion if you ask me.

Thanks for the condescending slap on the wrist, though. That was very encouraging.

Nope have at it.

I was just stating that its getting hard to find the info that this thread was intended to provide.

Gentlemen, Gentlemen......

1325795244_angry_face.gif
 

WannaGetHealthy

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wonderful gif for the occasion, LOL....but seriously, we're all a little on the testy side waiting for this mod, it's to be expected, and TBH, I learned some stuff here that I needed to learn. I knew the battery info was out there, but what I did NOT know was that the information that I once read was outdated. I used tenergy green labels in my grand during my brief experiment with 6v vaping because what I had heard was "yes they might fail, but because of the chemistry in the battery, they fail less dramatically than others." This information has been brought into question with events that have happened since. Safety is one of my top priorities. I didn't mind reading what everyone had to say regarding the subject, and if I had, I simply wouldn't have. Ultimately everyone will make their own decision. And really.....the fact that the conversation went as long as it did shows that it was worth discussing. If it wasn't interesting to those here, it wouldn't have continued.
 
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