Liquid is insanely expensive.

[Ultra-X]

hi. im newb here. but did some research before i started vaping and came to many of the conclusions here in this post.
juice itself is not hard to make (not including the base with nicotine).
Only the base itself with the nicotine would be considered not immediately manufacturable at home.
We can all do "thrift" if we want.
Your own personal "cost per time" and your ability to tolerate whatever you make ... this is the balance.
So far (being 13 days in), i have come to conclusion that i will probably be buying my juice for quite some time.
Getting all the stuff i need, then mixing to my liking, still is an endeavor in itself, not without cost, and can easily
add up to a sizeable sum which i think i'd rather spend on stuff i know i like "at this moment".

I think it's great that i can fry my own hotwings.
But that little restaurant down the road, that flavor is unique to them - and i'm willing to pay for it!

I do think overall this consumable will be cheaper once more people get into it, so as a vapor-er,
im promoting it to all who will listen because in the long run, it'll help my own bottom line.

(2 cents)

 

[suspectK]

I pay about $0.50/mL on average, but I'll spend around $1/mL on quality liquid, and i only buy online. Though, I don't see how pink spot is still in business for their prices.

Sorry, if that last statement was against the rules. Still haven't fully read them..lol.

 

[KjAthena]

I can and do mix up some very simple one note DIY flavors at under 10 cents per ML....But there were some up front costs involved in buying base/PG/VG flavors and bottles/equipment.....these are my day vapes. I however ALSO buy some gourmet/premium juices from favorite vendors at about 60 cents per ML as my evening/treat vapes. IE I get downright giddy when I receive vapemail from my favorite vendor....they have complex flavors that many have tried without success to duplicate for a LONG time...they include personalized notes charms for my PV's , have fantastic customer service and come in the wonderful glass dripper bottles I love...Its like a un-birthday gift very single time I get one...I am very happy to buy the products they offer...35.25 for 60ML of wonderfulness including shipping= 59 cents per ML

 

[Camaroboi13]

Idk man...even if I spent $1 per ml of juice, I still only vape about 1ml per day. 1 dollar a day beats 5 dollars a day for a pack of medium 100s...

 

[ImThatGuy]

From what I've read and heard...

Branded cigarettes = expensive
RYO cigarettes = cheaper

Branded/Premium e-juice = expensive
DIY e-juice = cheaper

I see no valid argument/debate to this...

 

[WillyZee]

when you have some venders that are only open for 15 mins to 1/2 hour per week ... I can't think of many businesses operating like that.

So yes ... people will charge more and have lineups of folks looking to buy

 

[Mrs C]

B&M prices @ $5.99 for 10ml discounts larger sizes per ml. 2 Days a week they run $3.99 which equals the quantity discounts and they have $3.00 clearance shelf to rotate stock. (Basically means it's steeped for a month maybe 6 weeks before it hits that shelf .

 

[Myk]

My new local averages about $1/ml.

I can justify a lot of B&M business markups but liquid is one that I have to put into the category of price gouging. I don't remember the cost my my DIY per ml or the size of a bottle I figured up to be 80¢ but there is no justification for the prices some charge when you consider that I didn't get bulk pricing on my ingredients.
Sorry but if I can buy retail, double my cost and still undercut you by hundreds of percents there's something wrong.

My guess is the cost of liquid has nothing to do with needed profit margin to run a business and they figure an average of 3ml a day is $3 vs an average pack a day habit is still saving money. Their competition is cigarettes so that's who they undercut. Until there is real competition outside of a pack of cigarettes that's how it will be.

 

[retrox]

DIY is most economical when you vape more than 8 ml or so per day, which is generally only the case if you're chain-vaping or vaping at high wattages. I typically hover right around 6-8 ml per day. I don't vape constantly, but I'm usually doing it between 15-20+ watts which tends to burn through lots of juice quickly.

"Boutique" liquids can be far more expensive than smoking for high-wattage vaping, so for me they're not an option for ADV selections. I like to keep a few that I really like on hand to treat myself with occasionally though.

 

[TheSystemHasFailed]

And never forget boys and girls...SUBJECTIVITY!
Although, with that said, anyone who says with vicious conviction that sub-premium juice is just as good as premium, is out of their mind.

Here's the thing with DIY, it's good and all, but I have no prob paying for a juice that is dialed in and consistent.
AVE for example. So, point is, you can get juice that is really good, and at times un-obtainable due to popularity, cheaper than a B&M.

Obviously buy the B&M's juice if your order hasn't come in, as opposed to even THINKING of smoking a disgusting and ridiculous cigarette.

 

[Jonathan Tittle]

IMO, $1 per ML is only expensive if you're buying simple flavors (i.e. blueberry, lemon, strawberry etc). If you're buying a juice that's a flavor blend, something that took time to get right in both stages (i.e. non-aged and aged over time), then $1 per ML isn't really horrible pricing.

If you can nail down a 4-8 flavor blend in a few attempts, and it's spot on, sell it. If not, there's really no argument here. Boutique vendors will always be able to sell at higher costs if they offer a unique selling point.


It's like complaining about how Apple sells their laptops for 3-6x what Dell sells theirs for. There's really no comparison and both companies exist to cater to different markets. If you DIY and build your own computer, you're going to be able to do it much cheaper and you'll be able to buy better hardware. Apple doesn't use bleeding edge hardware, Dell offers some of it but it costs. You pay for time, effort, labor etc.

DIY is the only way to go if you're concerned about pricing.

 

[KjAthena]

All of our B&M's charge around the $1 mark, however they often have discounts on 1 flavor per month or sales like buy 3 get 1 free. One of them does have some really good juices abet way too strongly flavored for me without diluting with unflavored. I have no problems popping in for a bottle here and there to support them or to keep me from buying smokes while awaiting vapemail

 

[Butch]

Still dirt cheap when compared to analog.

 

[Kropotkin]

I don't get it.

Suddenly there are all these threads where people foam at the mouth because some poor sod somewhere in Vapedom is selling a product - a juice, a mod, an atty, it really doesn't matter - at something other than absolute rock bottom, slave labor prices. It's as if these posters think everybody supplying vape stuff is obligated to work for free and eat dirt for their personal convenience. And if somebody else actually dares to buy one of the offending products, it's taken as a personal insult!



What on earth is up with that, anyway? I don't even like capitalism, and even I think this is completely insane.

 

[Criticalmass]

At the vape stores around me, and at a lot of retailers online, this stuff is going for $1 per ml. I understand that artificial food flavoring is expensive (that's why Pepsi costs $12 a can, right?), but should this stuff cost as much per ml as a $750 bottle of wine?

I can't believe more eliquid makers aren't competing on price in a market like this. Is demand really outpacing production by *that* much?

Because some people will pay it...

 

[SharonMM]

Well what's nice about vaping is that there really is something for everyone, and you can get a quality liquid at any pricepoint. One of my favorite liquids I've tried lately was from a B&M in San Diego that a friend sent me. When I inquired about what was in it, he told me a list of simple, commercially available flavorings... so really, its a just DIY liquid being sold in a storefront. I don't DIY myself, but I don't doubt for a second that people are creating some really fantastic, layered, complex, vendor quality juices right at home. I buy the premium vendor stuff too, but I enjoyed the DIY juice just as much.

The boutique/premium stuff is obviously overpriced when you consider the cost of raw materials. But its still worth it to a lot of people. I think it would take a tremendous amount of time and patience to make yourself a "unicorn". Not to mention how much money you would waste on mistakes in the process. I do think there are a lot of people who have the wool pulled over their eyes in terms of quality. At the end of the day, all eliquid is comprised of is flavoring(s), and/or pg/vg and nic. What matters is, who is doing the mixing.. the recipes are everything! Same ingredients at different ratios make a world of difference.

 

[Criticalmass]

Yeah, I"m not paying a dollar a ml. And I find it humorous that people are always bashing Mt. Baker Vapor. With careful research, every liquid I have ordered from them has been great and here's the best part, I have VERY expensive tastes... It is nice to find something that is inexpensive and tasty. It also proves that an affordable business model can still be profitable.

I have never felt the need to justify my expenditures by putting down cheaper alternatives. I always wonder what the real motivation is for people that do. I guess it makes them feel better? It seems rather juvenile to me. (IE: something a teenager with angst issues might do).

Personally, I have spent $600.00 on a dinner for two many times, and in only a very few circumstances was it worth the price of admission. Best food I ever had ran me about $40.00 at a hole in the wall mom & pop restaurant in New Orleans. We let the tourists spend their cash on Emeril's and Commander's Palace and kept the truly great places to ourselves.

That said, I have no problem spending $$ for something I like. If it's worth it. Hence the Nicoticket banner in my signature -- > And even they don't run nearly close to a dollar a ml.

 

[Myk]

Not to mention how much money you would waste on mistakes in the process.

I got worried about that when I bought too much DIY stuff not knowing whether I could handle the PG flavorings or whether I'd get along with that vendor's nicotine.
Then I figured up that $300 was half of my expensive liquid's yearly habit ($600) and I should have about 5 years worth of DIY in that order.
I could have a complete failure at finding anything I could vape nearly 10 times to have to worry about the money wasted.
I've even stopped worrying about whether I bought too much nicotine and will it last 5 years.

Considering there's always flavorless the money wasted really isn't an issue.

Liquid is kind of like fountain soda. It's so cheap (even buying the ingredients as a retail DIY customer) that places could literally give it away as a hook to get people in to buy other things (i.e., free sampling). Somewhere along the supply line someone is loading up their pockets.

Unlike Kropotkin I am pro-capitalism. If places want to price gouge that is their right. But that price gouging has sent me to DIY and it will send others.

 

[HauntedMyst]

Liquid is insanely expensive.

It can be so just buy from Azure. 120ml's for $16. I've found their stuff needs a few weeks of vaping but once you are over that curve, you're into some pretty cheap vaping.

 

[Caridwen]

Quite a few suppliers sell the premixed flavoring they use to make their liquid. Mom & Pop's, Vaperite, Vapor Bomb and several others do as well. You add the Nic base, pg/vg. Still a real big savings. Even if you did this with just one or two of the liquids you vape it'd be a money saver.