Lorillard purchases Blu E-Cigs

[Myk]

The FDA will regulate vaping just like they regulated the Swedish Snus a couple of years ago..

As any of the DIY people will tell you the juice mixers are making a lot of profit.
Johnson Creek is already set up to match anything the FDA could realistically require and they charge no more than any other US made juice.
The price could go up but I bet they would eat a lot of the price just like tobacco ate a lot of the price of the SCHIPs tax.

If the FDA went too far they would be admitting they were against obviously lower risk products and that would start turning antis like my sister against them.
Without me prodding when I was lamenting about how I couldn't do 0mg in the morning she said that it still had to be healthier than cigarettes even if I stayed on nicotine.

 

[Cyrus Vap]

No I won't believe them, or anyone, which is all I've been saying! NO ONE. Please don't misinterpret me, and I'm sorry if I've been mis expressing myself.

I believe in the little man, individuals, and individual responsibility: I like freedom. That's all I'm saying There are no guarantees.

Nor will I buy, as I make my own juice, and prefer taking the risk, the labor, and the leg work wrt to 'safety' on myself. If flavour art ends up giving me cancer, fine, stain on me. If anything is dangerous about vaping IMO, its gonna be the flavors.

In consequence I don't won't any of these clowns playing with e juice. In my naive fantasy we should remain free to keep this thing as grass roots as possible and self regulate with our dollars and voices. They can and will hurt us more than we can hurt ourselves, I truly believe that. That's what organized crime wearing the facade of regulation does. At least the mafia is honest about what they do.

I don't take things on faith, and believe its up to me to read my own research, use my own logic, and draw my own conclusions.

So if the antis come up with claims that the flavoring makes juice ________ (fill in the blank) you will believe them because there are added substances that are not disclosed. Extremely few places give out more information than "flavorings". Those that do have a long list of chemical names that few can understand.

It's not so far fetched since one of the claims about menthol is that it makes nicotine more addictive. I don't see why that would apply any less to juice.

Of all the people I can imagine making my juice ingredients and mixing them BT is the one I would trust at that job the most.

 

[Cyrus Vap]

As any of the DIY people will tell you the juice mixers are making a lot of profit.

yes

Johnson Creek is already set up to match anything the FDA could realistically require and they charge no more than any other US made juice.

Not familiar with them or their protocols, school me please? Thank you!

 

[Vocalek]

The FDA will regulate vaping just like they regulated the Swedish Snus a couple of years ago..

I'm not aware of any regulations issued by the FDA under the Tobacco Act that affect Swedish Snus. The FDA has been too busy considering Menthol, Flavored Cigarettes, Dissolvables, and MRTP to bother doing anything with snus yet. Perhaps you are confusing the Tobacco Act, which gave FDA regulatory powers over cigarettes and smokeless tobacco, with the PACT act which requires Internet Vendors to collect state sales taxes on tobacco sales? http://www.doj.state.or.us/tobacco/pdf/npm_pact_act_reporting_requirements.pdf

 

[Myk]

yes



Not familiar with them or their protocols, school me please? Thank you!

I'm not sure what you want schooled on. Juice packaging would be food prep. That's a hair net, gloves and possibly a coat. Since you wouldn't be touching the juice gloves wouldn't even be needed but as SOP in food prep would probably be required. JC and Dekang treat it like chem lab clean room.
Inside the Lab at Johnson Creek - YouTube (there's probably a Dekang video in the sidebar)

 

[kristin]

The FDA will regulate vaping just like they regulated the Swedish Snus a couple of years ago..

The FDA doesn't regulate snus. The reason snus prices went up is because of the PACT Act, as Elaine mentioned above. PACT (Prevent All Cigarette Trafficking Act), which was an amendment to the Jenkins Act, prohibits the delivery of cigarettes and smoke-free tobacco through US mail and imposes numerous requirements on retailers who deliver those products, including making sure sales are reported and taxes are paid. The PACT Act does not currently include other tobacco products such as dissolvables and e-cigarettes. In order to include those products in the law, another amendment to the law would have to be proposed and passed by Congress. Additionally, tax rates for e-cigarette supplies would have to be voted upon per state.

The cost of snus went up due to the loss of companies able to comply with the requirements, increased shipping costs by having to use alternative shipping companies and now having to pay already established tobacco taxes. The purchase of blu by a tobacco company would not accomplish any of those things.

Not familiar with them or their protocols, school me please? Thank you!

Johnson Creek provides blu's e-liquid. They were inspected by the FDA back in 2009 and it sent a letter to them outlining how they were not in compliance with certain standards:Johnson Creek Enterprises, LLC 9/8/10. The FDA also claimed JC was selling an unapproved drug delivery device and was not complaint with regulations of such, but that was pretty much tossed out with SE vs. FDA. JC decided to implement as many safety standards as possible, addressing the violations of Current Good Manufacturing Practice the FDA outlined in their letter to now be food-grade standards, child safety caps, plastic shrink banded caps, nicotine warnings, age verification screens, ingredients listed on bottles, ultra sanitary conditions, personal protective equipment for employees, and print warnings for children and pets. FDA Registration Information - Johnson Creek Smoke Juice

 

[Jimi D.]

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I still think the government will still tax e juice somehow.

 

[Petrodus]

Well ...
The FDA can regulate THIS (insert your choice of mental images)

 

[kristin]

Thanks for clearing that up for me. I still think the government will still tax e juice somehow.

Of course - but CASAA will fight to make sure it's a basic sales tax and not a tobacco "sin tax." The "sin taxes" are based on the premise that the product causes harm or a burden on society. There is no evidence that e-liquid causes those things, so we have a very, very good argument against such excessive taxes. We already beat a 70% of retail tax proposal on e-cigarettes in Hawaii. No reason why we can't do it again.

 

[Jimi D.]

Of course - but CASAA will fight to make sure it's a basic sales tax and not a tobacco "sin tax." The "sin taxes" are based on the premise that the product causes harm or a burden on society. There is no evidence that e-liquid causes those things, so we have a very, very good argument against such excessive taxes. We already beat a 70% of retail tax proposal on e-cigarettes in Hawaii. No reason why we can't do it again.

Thanks for all of your hard work!

 

[Thulium]

Their have been lots of rumors about how BT has made cigarettes more addicting, but I have never seen any evidence from a reputable source. I'm not quite sure how they made cigarettes more addictive then it already was. The theory is BT made it more alkaline as nicotine is more effective in a base. My understanding is the nicotine in cigarettes is about 10% effective. There is about 10 mg of nicotine in a cigarette but only about 1 mg is absorbed. Soooo...... if somehow the nicotine absorption is increased to something like 15% to 20%....... I, and everyone else, would simple smoke less cigarettes.

It just so happens that the lawsuit about Brown & Williamson allegedly making cigarettes "more addictive" by including Y1 Tobacco containing up to 6.5% nicotine in their blends is the very Supreme Court ruling that Judge Leon and the Appellate Court unanimously cited as evidence that e-cigarettes that do not make health claims cannot be banned as medical drugs/device/combos. The reality is that using higher levels of nicotine will probably lead to a reduction in smoking and related diseases, but by careful equivocation the FDA managed to convince people that cigarettes containing more nicotine would be more addictive...not that they had any evidence of this, but the "general consensus" includes factoids "nicotine is addictive" and "no safe level has been established"

 

[Cyrus Vap]

I'm all in, been vaping 20 mg all day and couldn't stop, just took 5 hits of 33 mg and I'm done LOL

 

[Thulium]

I'm all in, been vaping 20 mg all day and couldn't stop, just took 5 hits of 33 mg and I'm done LOL

The average commercial cigarette contains 1.63% nicotine--or 16.3mg/g. The FDA tried to claim that Brown & Williamson's tobacco products should be regulated as drug delivery devices because of the addition of tobacco containing 6.5% (65mg/g) nicotine, but the Supreme Court ruled that it was the presence or absence of medicinal or therapeutic claims that determined if a product was a "traditionally marketed tobacco product". Most of the nicotine is destroyed by combustion or lost to sidestream smoke, so most smokers only absorb about a milligram of nicotine per cigarette smoked. This has caused many people to think that an e-cigarette that might deliver as much nicotine as 5-20 combustible cigarettes could possibly be anywhere near as dangerous as an analog, but the truth is that they probably contain about the same amount of nicotine and I can't think of any reason to think that a cubic centimeter of liquid containing a small percentage of nicotine would be any more dangerous than an unlit cigarette containing a cubic centimeter of dried leaves containing an equivalent percentage of nicotine and other alkaloids--you'll want to keep it out of reach of small children that might try to swallow it and get sick, but otherwise it is not particularly dangerous unless and until FIRE is involved.

 

[Petrodus]

I'm all in, been vaping 20 mg all day and couldn't stop,
just took 5 hits of 33 mg and I'm done LOL

Mmmm .... Thanks, that reminded me of something
I've been power vaping all day ... dripping 36 mg. (eGo 1000 mAh battery & monster atty/cart)
36 mg is the highest I have. Just switched to a 510 atty. 5 hits ... Aahhh that did the trick!
The 510 atty is small but geeze what a difference. Aahhh, I'm fine now.

 

[kwalka]

Mmmm .... Thanks, that reminded me of something
I've been power vaping all day ... dripping 36 mg. (eGo 1000 mAh battery & monster atty/cart)
36 mg is the highest I have. Just switched to a 510 atty. 5 hits ... Aahhh that did the trick!
The 510 atty is small but geeze what a difference. Aahhh, I'm fine now.

Oh yea well I just drank a whole bottle of 24... Mine is bigger than yours

Thulium,
Thank you, its nice to have folks like Kristin, Elaine and yourself bringing whats needed to these threads. I'm being serious, we would be a bunch of babbling idiots without actual facts and research to keep us in line and properly informed.

 

[rothenbj]

I'm not aware of any regulations issued by the FDA under the Tobacco Act that affect Swedish Snus. The FDA has been too busy considering Menthol, Flavored Cigarettes, Dissolvables, and MRTP to bother doing anything with snus yet. Perhaps you are confusing the Tobacco Act, which gave FDA regulatory powers over cigarettes and smokeless tobacco, with the PACT act which requires Internet Vendors to collect state sales taxes on tobacco sales? http://www.doj.state.or.us/tobacco/pdf/npm_pact_act_reporting_requirements.pdf

I believe what he's referring to is the PACT act that seriously effected the price of snus/snuff when mail ordering. Basically that act required UPS shipping with signature requirements. For someone wanting to order just a few cans at a time at around a $30 shipping cost, PACT had serious impact on purchasing online. The only way to contain costs is very large orders to bring down per can shipping cost.

Other requirements such as product registration with detailed ingredient lists also limited what was available in the US and, at least it appeared, a per can increase to cover the additional paperwork.

 

[kai kane]

Thanks for all of your hard work!

and thanks for the link to that video with the Lorillard exec - I'm halfway through and like what I hear so far. I am very optimistic about the future of vaping.

Edit: just finished the video. the last minute and a half says it all. I share his views.

 

[Stubby]

It just so happens that the lawsuit about Brown & Williamson allegedly making cigarettes "more addictive" by including Y1 Tobacco containing up to 6.5% nicotine in their blends is the very Supreme Court ruling that Judge Leon and the Appellate Court unanimously cited as evidence that e-cigarettes that do not make health claims cannot be banned as medical drugs/device/combos. The reality is that using higher levels of nicotine will probably lead to a reduction in smoking and related diseases, but by careful equivocation the FDA managed to convince people that cigarettes containing more nicotine would be more addictive...not that they had any evidence of this, but the "general consensus" includes factoids "nicotine is addictive" and "no safe level has been established"

When ready made cigarettes got to expensive I switched to RYO. I went from a bit more then a pack-a-day of lights to about half that amount with RYO. I smoked just as often, just rolled really small smokes. I did five or six hits and I was good instead of a dozen or so with the lights. Certainly wasn't more addictive as I just did less, but I can't say it was any less addicting.

The whole idea of "More addicting" is a red herring pushed by the ANTZ. They do the same thing with dual users in that they make up the story that people are "More addicted" if they use something like snus while still smoking. It's complete junk because for every snus or dissolvable or hit on an e-cig is in reality less cigarettes smoked.

Don't get me started with the PACT act. If I could just get SmokeFree Wisconsin to pay my shipping bill from my last order of Swedish snus I would be happy.

 

[kwalka]

The video was full of good pre written "just what the public wants to hear" typical corporate interview crap. Dont get me wrong if half of what he says comes to fruition it will benefit us as a community. I am just quite a cynic when it comes to listening to any corporate suit, no matter what industry he or she represents.

 

[Algernon]

Needless to say, the e-cig of the future will more than likely be pre-packaged and controlled. I don't see it reaching into the realm of tanks, pre-purchased e-juice with whatever strength you want, I see it dumbed down and controlled and I also see the public and mainstream e-cig users as being oblivious to the designs and influence that we as the deeper e-cig community have come up with on our own accord.

The variable voltage, 5ml Boge tank that I'm using now could very well be dumbed down to buying pre-filled cartomizers on a 510-style stick due to regulation and control and I don't see that as progressive for the community or the betterment of e-cigs or PV's in any sense of the word.