my opinion: heavy users are downfall for the rest

[Myk]

Not sure if it's been mentioned but don't forget anti-tobacco has dipped their hands into the tobacco settlement money and by extension NRT is in it too. The more people smoke the more money they get directly from BT.
Why do you think BT agreed to the settlement that also protected them from lawsuits and bans?

 

[AndriaD]

Say, I know that there is a full moon today. But what's with the accumulation of .. uhm.. uninformed people in this thread, please?

Trolls *LOOOOVE* full moons.

Andria

 

[DaveP]

Big Pharma is undoubtedly the biggest gun in the push to have the FDA control ecigs, but big tobacco is at least sitting quietly on the sidelines secure in the knowledge that a $4B business is theirs for the taking if big pharma is successful in persuading the FDA to come down hard on mom and pop businesses. They know that a little cig-a-like like the Blu isn't going to attract most of the knowledgeable vapers who already use products much more effective than theirs.

I'd wager that BT has a super VV/VW mod design waiting in the wings for FDA approval as soon as the playing field is grassed, limed, and finished. Not only do they want to retain their current customers, they want to gain OUR business and that's going to take some technology and a feature rich product with exceptional flavor and vapor at the right price. Big Pharma is just protecting the products that already steal profit away from Big Tobacco. BT isn't sitting around praising their little cig-a-like Blu. They are after the entire market.

 

[DaveP]

This article talks about (among other points) studies that show teens who use e-cigs aren't likely to move to tobacco cigarettes. This in turn hurts big pharma AND tobacco companies. Big Pharma stands to lose money on products that enable people to quit smoking and Big Tobacco loses new smokers in the case stated. It's not just big pharma that's worried.

A New Study Has the Potential to Kill the E-Cigarette Market

 

[Jman8]

I'd wager that BT has a super VV/VW mod design waiting in the wings for FDA approval as soon as the playing field is grassed, limed, and finished.

I'm semi-interested in this wager. I'm wondering how much it will be offset when China clones this product and levels the playing field? And how much other crime syndicates who will surely get into game will affect said playing field?

The people/vapers who think everything will be done above board once (harsh) regulations are in place, humor me.

 

[Talyon]

I'm semi-interested in this wager. I'm wondering how much it will be offset when China clones this product and levels the playing field? And how much other crime syndicates who will surely get into game will affect said playing field?

The people/vapers who think everything will be done above board once (harsh) regulations are in place, humor me.

You humour easily sir, lol.

 

[Midniteoyl]

Under the radar is the last place we should be. It'll just make it easier to ban. And it's vaping, not smoking.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

I agree, but 'in your face' isnt it either... The ... smokers did that too and several cities have regulated their smoking now too.

 

[zapped]

I'd wager that BT has a super VV/VW mod design waiting in the wings for FDA approval as soon as the playing field is grassed, limed, and finished. Not only do they want to retain their current customers, they want to gain OUR business and that's going to take some technology and a feature rich product with exceptional flavor and vapor at the right price. Big Pharma is just protecting the products that already steal profit away from Big Tobacco. BT isn't sitting around praising their little cig-a-like Blu. They are after the entire market.

I doubt it Dave.

Some of you know that Im involved with the Consumer Opinion Center here in Richmond Va. They are basically the research arm of Phillip Morris/Altria the maker of cigarettes like Marlboro.

They have conducted several studies and surveys lately in regards to electronic cigarettes.

In one such study that I was a part of, the researcher was absolutely clueless about anything other than cig-alikes. I had to rate her online survey and even corrected her about a survey question that asked how many cartridges I used per day.

Thats not an accurate measure of how much the average vaper uses per day.......except for the 2 percent or less who still use cig-alikes and pre-filled cartridges.

She seemed amazed that clearomizers like the CE3's she had pictured had measurement marks that showed how much eliquid was in the reservoir.

When I told her I averaged about 6ml a day of eliquid a day and that the claims of a cartridge equaling a pack of cigarettes were untrue she seemed genuinely at a loss for words and very much an amateur in regards to her knowledge of vaping in general.

Based on that conversation and from what Ive seen as a participant in numerous vaping studies conducted there I can confidently say that it appears that Altria at least is concentrating on the cig-alike market and is pretty clueless about anything beyond that.

 

[quadraginta]

It is always a pleasure to note how comfortable you are

Do I know you from somewhere?

with distorting what someone has said to match your own agenda.

I'm not sure what agenda you are referring to, but I would certainly be interested to learn just what I am distorting.

And if you think that's ad hominem then I would suggest that calling people self-righteous is downright rude.

What I said was "more" righteous, not "self-righteous". There is a difference and one does not carry the sense of opprobrium that the other does.

You certainly seem comfortable with distorting what someone has said to match your own agenda.

Why don't you stick your head where the sun don't shine?

VERY cogent comment. Your wisdom shines with its own internal glory.

 

[e-pipeman]

Do I know you from somewhere?




I'm not sure what agenda you are referring to, but I would certainly be interested to learn just what I am distorting.




What I said was "more" righteous, not "self-righteous". There is a difference and one does not carry the sense of opprobrium that the other does.

You certainly seem comfortable with distorting what someone has said to match your own agenda.



VERY cogent comment. Your wisdom shines with its own internal glory.

Thank you for this insightful post. Your previous post was rude and snide. I replied directly and rudely. If you don't like that then I would refer you to the last comment I made in the post you quote from. Perhaps you should add me to your "ignore" list if this makes you uncomfortable.

 

[quadraginta]

Pols are not exactly our opposition. Arguably, our opposition is amongst us. Possible our opposition is us.

Pols are the ones passing the laws which are the spur for this discussion. If they weren't passing those laws we wouldn't need this discussion.

What motivates a vaper to conclude that the only proper place to vape in public is where smoking is allowed? This is germane to the discussion at hand.

I think your brush is too broad. Yes, there are some vapers who may be concluding that. I think they are one end of the spectrum, and I don't agree with them any more than I agree with the in-your-face Vaping Warriors™.

There is a middle road, which is using common courtesy as a guide.

What motivates a vaper to conclude that whenever someone vapes in public, when others are around, it is inherently disrespectful?

Don't know.

What motivates a vaper to conclude that the best way to teach the general public that vaping is not harmful to them is by macho aggression?

This is relevant to this discussion. Both these questions, when stated as assertions, are type of things our opposition is advocating for.

<snip>

Both those questions are misrepresentations of the position which most of the people in this discussion seem to be advocating.

 

[quadraginta]

And all of that is before we even get into the fact that Big Government and taxes are starting to come into the picture more and more.

Tell me about it.

NC is on the verge of passing a $0.05/ml tax on ejuice.

I've asked my "representatives" (and I use this term advisedly) if they actually understand how small a ml is. None of them have seen fit to respond.

 

[quadraginta]

<snip>

There is a fine balance between informing people and taking offense when ignorance irritates your eardums.

I understand the fear of second hand smoke, so I don't react defensively when confronted. "I'm sorry it bothered you, let me move a bit further."

To me, this is not admitting defeat, it's simply being considerate and maybe I just got up and don't feel like schooling the unlearned at 7am so I suck it up and move on.

<snip>

It would seem that this sort of attitude is "rabid"

I guess I'm "rabid", too.

 

[Verb]

Tell me about it.

NC is on the verge of passing a $0.05/ml tax on ejuice.

I've asked my "representatives" (and I use this term advisedly) if they actually understand how small a ml is. None of them have seen fit to respond.

I wonder if it will be applied to all VG sales; since, pure VG is unflavored zero nic e-juice. That is the way ethanol, that has not been denatured, is treated in PA, even if you just want to use it as a solvent and have no intention of drinking it.

 

[quadraginta]

I have read your posts. No-one likes hate but somehow you encourage discord.

Discord isn't when someone disagrees with you.

 

[e-pipeman]

Discord isn't when someone disagrees with you.

Agreed. But,as I said, you do encourage discord. I have decided to stop feeding you, therefore.

 

[quadraginta]

As vapers we need to encourage people to understand why we do this. It's because it works.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...ore-effective-than-nrt-smoking-cessation.html

Top scientists warn WHO not to stub out e-cigarettes

Arguing about the rights that people have to breathe clean air is interesting but out of date by about 100 years. The industrial revolution, nuclear testing and the internal combustion engine (together with aviation and diesel) mean that clean air couldn't be a right even if we could legislate for it.

Not sure about where you are, but on this side of the pond we've been legislating clean air for over half a century.

It's worked pretty well so far, too. And getting better. I'm old enough to remember. We've gone from leaded gas and temperature inversions that had people leaving towns for their health to states suing power companies for emissions.

Cleaner air is possible - and not burning tobacco will help with that.

Sure. By a margin so microscopic that using it as an argument is laughable.

We should be nice to each other when we are arguing for the right to vape. When people argue for the right to complain about vaping my hackles rise. You should see my hackles!

My hackles get raised when people start accusing me of being some sort of stealth shill for Big Whatever.

 

[e-pipeman]

Not sure about where you are, but on this side of the pond we've been legislating clean air for over half a century.

It's worked pretty well so far, too. And getting better. I'm old enough to remember. We've gone from leaded gas and temperature inversions that had people leaving towns for their health to states suing power companies for emissions.



Sure. By a margin so microscopic that using it as an argument is laughable.



My hackles get raised when people start accusing me of being some sort of stealth shill for Big Whatever.

Yawn...(10 chars)

 

[quadraginta]

May I expound, vape as much as u like, but always use vape ettiquite.
When in doubt stealth=vape and hold.

Another "rabid" stealth shill for Big Something-or-Other.

We should start a club.

 

[dr g]

Only vapers know the difference between cloud sizes.