Nature's Flavors recipe thread

[Faylool]

You might be interested to read some of the descriptions of Flavors West DIY flavors if you haven't already. A whole lot of diacytal free goodies that have a reputation for having diacytal in them. I added 4 flavors to my collection from there plus 4 always have on hands to test them out. What I read was you can use a lot of the flavoring and still not mess up...or something similar but anyway...they might be worth you trying if you want non diacytal added

Just looked at my flavors today.

First off, my danish has the white powder in it too. I'm guessing all you guys with white powder refrigerated it like I did? In Tao's Co-op thread, he didn't say this one required refrigeration. I'm guessing some compound in it has a steep solubility/temperature curve. Basically, as you cool it down, something's dropping out of solution. Try letting it warm back up to room temp, or even heat it slightly, and shake it a bunch. Good chance it goes back into solution.

I've tried by nose to identify the flavors with diacetyl in em....I think these all do:
Butterscotch
English Toffee
Vanilla
Caramel
Bavarian Cream
Malt
Kona Cream
Caramel Cream

Sad that the malt seems to be buttery - sounds like it's getting rave reviews here, but I'm afraid of diacetyl...I might be wrong though, I keep sniffing them.

Haven't had time to mix/vape anything yet...

 

[Manimal3497]

Just looked at my flavors today.

First off, my danish has the white powder in it too. I'm guessing all you guys with white powder refrigerated it like I did? In Tao's Co-op thread, he didn't say this one required refrigeration. I'm guessing some compound in it has a steep solubility/temperature curve. Basically, as you cool it down, something's dropping out of solution. Try letting it warm back up to room temp, or even heat it slightly, and shake it a bunch. Good chance it goes back into solution.

I've tried by nose to identify the flavors with diacetyl in em....I think these all do:
Butterscotch
English Toffee
Vanilla
Caramel
Bavarian Cream
Malt
Kona Cream
Caramel Cream

Sad that the malt seems to be buttery - sounds like it's getting rave reviews here, but I'm afraid of diacetyl...I might be wrong though, I keep sniffing them.

Haven't had time to mix/vape anything yet...

Not cause of refrigeration. I left all mine out and my danish did that. Its the only one that has done it so far but it did

 

[Shilo]

Just looked at my flavors today.

First off, my danish has the white powder in it too. I'm guessing all you guys with white powder refrigerated it like I did? In Tao's Co-op thread, he didn't say this one required refrigeration. I'm guessing some compound in it has a steep solubility/temperature curve. Basically, as you cool it down, something's dropping out of solution. Try letting it warm back up to room temp, or even heat it slightly, and shake it a bunch. Good chance it goes back into solution.

I've tried by nose to identify the flavors with diacetyl in em....I think these all do:
Butterscotch
English Toffee
Vanilla
Caramel
Bavarian Cream
Malt
Kona Cream
Caramel Cream

Sad that the malt seems to be buttery - sounds like it's getting rave reviews here, but I'm afraid of diacetyl...I might be wrong though, I keep sniffing them.

Haven't had time to mix/vape anything yet...

All the individual bottles I bought say to refrigerate. I assumed it was because these are natural and may not have preservatives or the same kind of preservatives. Don't know why some would say refrigerate and others not. If what you are saying was the answer then all the refrigerated flavors should have the sediment and for me they do not. For me its just the Cappucino. I don't have the Danish.

 

[beamrider]

How stupid of me to assume that something called "Natures Flavors" wouldn't have friggin diacetyl in it, I wondered what that disgusting smell was in some of the flavors.....>.<

 

[shortyjacobs]

How stupid of me to assume that something called "Natures Flavors" wouldn't have friggin diacetyl in it, I wondered what that disgusting smell was in some of the flavors.....>.<

Diacetyl is a naturally occurring substance in many foods... The reason butter tastes like butter? Diacetyl. Most people don't inhale butter, (or many of the other foods it's in), though. Some people don't care about it in their vape, others do. Personally, I'm worried about it.

 

[Levitas]

Does anyone know which flavors, exactly, contain diacetyl?

Has anyone tried to contact Nature's Flavors and find out? I wasn't going to say anything, because this could be from a number of things, but, recently, with my RY4 blend (that I recently started adding Caramel Cream from NF), I find myself becoming short of breath. This is after chain vaping for a while, but still, I do not know if this is attributed to the flavoring, or some other reasoning.

I would sure hate to have to omit Malt from that blend, but in all reality, I can live without the rest.

On a completely unrelated note, I might have some NF flavors up for trade


(I also just purchased 1 or 2 more NF flavors from High Desert if no one has a list of flavorings that contains diacetyl, I'll contact them tomorrow and find out.)

 

[-Mimi-]

I had TOTALLY forgotten about diacetyl because most suppliers have removed diacetyl and those with acetoin are noted. NF buttery, creamy, and caramel flavors does contain "trace" amounts of diacetyl. Clouds of Vapor uses NF in his juices and even notes the small diacetyl amounts on his product description. He had talked to the chemists at NF and they confirmed it for him. I read it on ecf somewhere. So much for using these. *sigh*

 

[ToweKnee]

I actually didn't refrigerate mine didn't know we had to but mine been fine. I put them in a pantry top shelf that's on the corner of the basement. Its pretty cool in there though.

 

[shortyjacobs]

I didn't mean to kick off a diacetyl rampage here. Sorry guys. By the way, tao did mention that there was a diacetyl in these flavors in his co op for those of you bought it from there, and we did have a bit of a discussion in that thread.

I believe in the coop thread someone did contact nature's flavors, but while they confirmed that some flavors did contain diacetyl, they didn't specify which flavors had diacetyl in them.

 

[taofishdude]

Just looked at my flavors today.

First off, my danish has the white powder in it too. I'm guessing all you guys with white powder refrigerated it like I did? In Tao's Co-op thread, he didn't say this one required refrigeration. I'm guessing some compound in it has a steep solubility/temperature curve. Basically, as you cool it down, something's dropping out of solution. Try letting it warm back up to room temp, or even heat it slightly, and shake it a bunch. Good chance it goes back into solution.

I've tried by nose to identify the flavors with diacetyl in em....I think these all do:
Butterscotch
English Toffee
Vanilla
Caramel
Bavarian Cream
Malt
Kona Cream
Caramel Cream

Sad that the malt seems to be buttery - sounds like it's getting rave reviews here, but I'm afraid of diacetyl...I might be wrong though, I keep sniffing them.

Haven't had time to mix/vape anything yet...

the danish came with the white sediment in it, i made sure to shake it up before i dispensed. I haven't tried it yet. I agree with the malt smelling "buttery", i was concerned about that one as well. I contacted NF about diacetyl before I ordered for the CoOp, but they never responded to my ticket. Hopefully they will disclose which ones contain diacetyl when they get their e-cig branch up and running.

 

[Koman]

I didn't mean to kick off a diacetyl rampage here. Sorry guys. By the way, tao did mention that there was a diacetyl in these flavors in his co op for those of you bought it from there, and we did have a bit of a discussion in that thread.

I believe in the coop thread someone did contact nature's flavors, but while they confirmed that some flavors did contain diacetyl, they didn't specify which flavors had diacetyl in them.

Would also like to know which flavors those are!

 

[Levitas]

So, I called NF, and the lady told me that they don't disclose that information over the phone After a little more prodding, she told me that the person who would normally answer those types of questions wasn't in the office at the moment, and she took my name and number. Also, she gave me the email address, and I wrote them as well.

Hopefully before the end of the day is out, I'll have an answer about this diacetyl situation. More on this.... later.

 

[flintlock62]

Right, and just because it's "natural" doesn't necessarily mean it's safe.

A natural flavoring is going to be a chemical substance.

 

[Hoosier]

I thought it was common knowledge that diacetyl naturally occurs in milk and fermentation? Seems reasonable to assume that natural flavorings that come from breads, beer, wine and/or anything made with butter is going to contain it. Even PGA could have trace amounts.

So, I'll go out on a limb here and say the official word should say that the flavorings, that come from what I outlined, will have diacetyl. (Most likely it is distilled and filtered out of PGA to the point it would be extremely difficult to detect, let alone measure.)

 

[BakuPeg]

Right, and just because it's "natural" doesn't necessarily mean it's safe.

Just `cause its natural doesn't mean its un-safe.

Remember, living is ultimately fatal.

I know we all want our vape to be 110% safe, give us un-ending life, unicorns, dragons, kittens and puppy dogs. If this is so why do we add nicotine to it? OHH "Harm Reduction.." yes, and all of us on this earth (at least I am) thankful for the wonderful vape. Just guess all the Cig death and road rage vaping has prevented. Remember the Yin/Yang? A bit of white in the black, and a bit of black in the white? Its all about balance. You can't survive in a sterile world.

and I am not saying don't be concerned about diacetyl. I'm just saying to take everything in perspective. I doubt we're going to fall over dead b/c we added 4% of malt to a net tobacco mix b/c it has traces of diacetyl in it. A trace of a Trace..

 

[ToweKnee]

Well I think its more about having the information so that people can make their own decisions. Its not going to bother me much and its not going to stop me from using the Malt. I have done much worse things to my body in the past 40 some years. A little diacetyl is nothing compared to that lol. Though we should have which flavors contain said chemical so that people know. Then its up to them. The only huge complaint I have is that taste I cant figure out. Not sure if I didn't evaporate the alcohol enough or not but that certain taste does bother me. Its not that obvious in the Malt though but it is in the creams.

 

[BakuPeg]

I've tasted the malt in one of my NET's (I couldn't resist, mmmmm), I mixed a little Caramel Creme and more of the Malt. I didn't detect the flavor you're referring to (yet). It may be my husband (who is the actual person who vapes) needs to chime in as he will tell me if a batch tastes bad and its designed to the back shelf or just poured out. I mixed them all low `cause I didn't want to drown out the tobacco base. Maybe its just not strong enough to detect. I wanted the non-tobacco to be more of a subtle taste.

I mixed the gooey butter cake one with one of my NET's but he hasn't tried it yet. Now all this talk about off flavors I am nervous.

I worked 2 months perfecting my NET's. I don't want to waste them!
Looks like I'm going to dig out all my recycled WL vials.

 

[WallyO]

I've tasted the malt in one of my NET's (I couldn't resist, mmmmm), I mixed a little Caramel Creme and more of the Malt. I didn't detect the flavor you're referring to (yet). It may be my husband (who is the actual person who vapes) needs to chime in as he will tell me if a batch tastes bad and its designed to the back shelf or just poured out. I mixed them all low `cause I didn't want to drown out the tobacco base. Maybe its just not strong enough to detect. I wanted the non-tobacco to be more of a subtle taste.
I mixed the gooey butter cake one with one of my NET's but he hasn't tried it yet. Now all this talk about off flavors I am nervous.

I worked 2 months perfecting my NET's. I don't want to waste them!
Looks like I'm going to dig out all my recycled WL vials.

What percentage do you mix your NET's at. I have some ordered and should have by the end of the week. I'm thinking 15% to start. In the ballpark?

 

[Levitas]

and I am not saying don't be concerned about diacetyl. I'm just saying to take everything in perspective. I doubt we're going to fall over dead b/c we added 4% of malt to a net tobacco mix b/c it has traces of diacetyl in it. A trace of a Trace..

That's what I'm trying to figure out. If there is trace amount, relatively significant amount, or none. The repercussions of using said ingredient are devastating, even when put into a smaller perspective (trace within a trace).

I wouldn't just write it off though. Inhaling diacetyl can cause serious damage to the lungs, as I'm sure you're aware. Not to pave the path of alarm or anything. We knew that cigarettes will inevitably cause cancer, but still, we smoked. But here we all are, vaping to reduce the harm of using nicotine.

Personally, I didn't quit smoking to avoid cancer only to gain bronchiolitis obliterans from inhaling butter




Source (if any are interested): Respiratory Toxicologic Pathology of Inhaled Diacetyl in Sprague-Dawley Rats and: Bronchiolitis Obliterans - National Jewish Health

 

[Faylool]

My taste buds are back again....they were really on and off with tooth extraction, sinus stuff. Tooth is finally getting better. Or non tooth. What a drag. But I thought I had vaped up all my complicated mix of berries, Bavarian Creme, coconut, malty but found the extra I dumped in a little bottle on the side. So it did get to steep and it did get more berry too. Happy accident I call it. I sure liked it and now I have a few more MLs to enjoy. That MIT be it too since I didn't write anything down ( like Hoosier says and I agreed oh yeah, that's easy enuff...write it down make a million bucks ha ha) well anyway. With my slap dash way of doing things I have found the NF flavors very forgiving. This is a big plus to me. I'm not sensitive to diacytal unless it's in bakery and then I'm just sensitive to the off taste of it, not my lungs. What my pont is, and it's no biggy either way, does all this diacytal business mean we won't be doing anymore co op every month? I'm getting along with most the flavors and doing pretty good. Flavors West is supposed have the forgiving kind of flavors I'm talking about. You know like if you use a half drop too much you messed up the whole thing. I'm still in if there will be interest...but it's not a big deal. Oh and Natures West lowered price and they report diacytal free on a bunch of flavors that often had it in them around the flavor places. I already posted that....except about the price decrease. And shipping is way low. Very reasonable But I haven to ten in he mail yet and won't know more for quite awhile . Just reporting