New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers

[2legsshrt]

Yep, me too. I have three mods in my regular rotation. One has never had anything but unflavored in it. I use it pretty much exclusively when I'm out and about or at my office. The other two have unflavored in the bottle as well, but get flavored juice dripped in from the top on an "as needed" basis. Flavored juice lasts me just about forever that way. coils & wicks last a long time too.

Not me I use 5 different flavors for my daily vape and another on my nightstand mod, but that one I have a Kabuki on so I can just change the head. But like I said the flavoring I use at 1% then when I fill up my tanks I fill them half way with my flavored mix and the other half with unflavored. Coils last a long time except on one that I use a custardy juice, that one is lucky to make it 10 days. I have 5 new flavors coming from Adore, thought I would give them a try before I buy any of their concentrates.

 

[mikepetro]

Yep they are pretty tight with their prices. I have gotten all mine from Varitube for a good reason. They never really have sales always charge the MSRP but they are the N. American service center for YiHi and always have been. They will either fix it or replace it for the entire warranty period and I've even seen them do it beyond, so it gives you a sense of security when you are putting out the big bucks, and they are always there to help. They even had Perry, I think he is one of the owners there introduce their first TC mod the M at Las Vegas that year. They have made so much improvement over the years. I just got a G class and want to go with one more the Qmini which tested out exactly the same as the G. They have intensified their efforts on nearly perfect TC for SS316L. I have 4 DNA's also and there is not a thing wrong with them. If there is you can change it which is one of the things I really like about them. For me since I only use SS316L on TC and I've used TC since they first introduced it on the M and the improvements with both have been amazing. I really like the build quality on the SX's and the DNA's I have are really good also but you have to watch out who makes them. Anybody can throw a DNA chip in their mod but not all of them are so good. But there are some dandies out there.
Mike you sure are thorough on your testing. It's really great to see that. I know it is probably impossible to test but my wife uses the Nautilus with the BVC, I've always wondered if they get hot enough to reach the danger zone. I assume they would since they are Kanthal I believe and straight power. Heck you might have already covered that but I missed it. MikeE told me there was 200 posts on this thread I figured no prob, then I got here and it was 200 pages so I haven't read all. Not even close.

• Actual temperatures inside a Nautilus
  • Stock 1.8ohm coil measures over 500f at 9.5W

 

[awsum140]

I use five flavors in my various mods. Three of them are low percentage, single flavor, mixes and the other two have some low amounts of "gunky" flavorings in tem. I did track how long it took to get a coil really gunked with the gunky flavors and it was almost 400ml. I never go that long with them, that was an experiment. Generally speaking I'm getting 200-300ml through a coil before I notice enough gunk to warrant a rebuild. At my rate of liquid consumption, that means I rebuild less than once a month.

The Mrs. uses a liquid that does gunk fairly heavily, especially compared to what I use. I rebuild her stuff on a monthly basis, she doesn't vape as much as I do. In fact I track when I last rebuilt all of our mods (let's all say OCD together) and will grab hers for a rebuild even if she doesn't say anything. When she retires, I'll cut that down to every two weeks.

 

[mikepetro]

OK, I did my homework and I think this is the most appropriate meter to do what we are trying to do that doesnt get into 4+ figures. So I ordered it.

Extech FM200 Handheld Formaldehyde (CH2O or HCHO) Meter with Detachable Probe- at the Test Equipment Depot

Now, this will only give crude measurements as opposed to the HPLC grade instrumentation used in a well funded scientific lab. It may well even be a total bust, but I believe it will tell us enough to understand if there really is anything to this temp/formaldehyde issue. If I can measure appreciable and repeatable differences between a 2mg/ml 100%VG sample at 400f vs 500f then we know there is something to the Wang study. I would then attempt to get more granular with intervals and ratios in between.

I will develop a solid test protocol suitable to vaping using my own gear. At least at first, this isnt going to be a "test every device out there" thing. I am only testing to see if Temp makes an appreciable difference. One can then extrapolate the device specific temperature testing I have done. I will actually vape each data set to ensure it is something that someone would actually vape.

I paid $370 for it. Several of you offered to pitch in, if you are still interested please PM me and I will give you a PP address to use. I thought about a GoFundMe campaign but they get almost 10% of each donation, not worth it for this small of a project IMHO. And please remember, I am not guaranteeing reliable results, although I do believe this instrument and a decent protocol will get us as close as we can get without the resources of a full lab.

And yes @Rossum I will toss in a genuine tobacco cigarette sample (ewwww). I probably wont do a cigar though, I would be too tempted to actually smoke it.

OK folks, you threw out the gauntlet, I stepped up, now its your turn!.

I might know someone who can get it.

But I haven't talked to them in a Long Time.

If you can get this I would be grateful. I suspect much of it is not truly applicable to vaping, but I would love to study it, if nothing else it will give me a view into the mindset they use. They really need to come up with a similar ISO standard for testing vape products.

 

[Rossum]

I paid $370 for it. Several of you offered to pitch in, if you are still interested please PM me and I will give you a PP address to use.

PM Sent.

And yes @Rossum I will toss in a genuine tobacco cigarette sample (ewwww). I probably wont do a cigar though, I would be too tempted to actually smoke it.

I never cared for cigars at all. Next time I'm in the neighborhood, I'll be glad to take one for the team in terms of some number of puffs on a cigar.

 

[zoiDman]

...

I paid $370 for it. Several of you offered to pitch in, if you are still interested please PM me and I will give you a PP address to use. ...

PM Sent.

 

[Rossum]

PP Sent.

 

[stols001]

PM to Mikepetro.

Anna

 

[awsum140]

Looks like a decent meter, Mike. I'm assuming, and we know what that can do, that there's an input port and output port on the probe. That'll make it relatively easy to do "real world" tests of both inhale and exhale.

 

[mikepetro]

Looks like a decent meter, Mike. I'm assuming, and we know what that can do, that there's an input port and output port on the probe. That'll make it relatively easy to do "real world" tests of both inhale and exhale.

Yes, both ports exist, a fan pulls from the IN and pushes it to the OUT, so you wouldnt get inhale and exhale simultaneous, but two separate tests should do the trick.
Hadnt really thought of "absorption", but thats a good idea.

My initial plan is to do Clinton hits to see what is available to be inhaled.
Doing an exhale hit would be interesting.

 

[ZCAR1]

Rather than spending the rest of the afternoon trying to find out, how do I send a Private Message?

 

[mikepetro]

Rather than spending the rest of the afternoon trying to find out, how do I send a Private Message?

Sent you a PM.

To start one, click the members Avatar and then click the link circled.

 

[ZCAR1]

Mike, I think I clicked on that link. Not sure where it went, but I do see your msg in my inbox.

 

[ZCAR1]

PayPal sent.

 

[awsum140]

The virtual check is in the ethereal mail, Mike.

 

[Eskie]

Very cool idea. Do you have a tracking number yet?

 

[awsum140]

Delivery was so fast the tracking number expired before I could check it.

 

[mikepetro]

Very cool idea. Do you have a tracking number yet?

No, but I expect it next week. Do be aware, next weekend I will be out of town in pursuit of a different passion.....

 

[philbh]

I'm no scientist, but I like what I see here:
Vaping has less than 1% the cancer risk of tobacco smoke [new study] - Vaping360

 

[zoiDman]

I'm no scientist, but I like what I see here:
Vaping has less than 1% the cancer risk of tobacco smoke [new study] - Vaping360

Yeah... Under certain circumstances, the Reduction in potential Carcinogens is pretty Dramatic.

Conclusion: Optimal combinations of device settings, liquid formulation and vaping behaviour normally result in e-cigarette emissions with much less carcinogenic potency than tobacco smoke, notwithstanding there are circumstances in which the cancer risks of e-cigarette emissions can escalate, sometimes substantially. These circumstances are usually avoidable when the causes are known.

Comparing the cancer potencies of emissions from vapourised nicotine products including e-cigarettes with those of tobacco smoke | Tobacco Control