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Nic Base Storage: Freezer vs. Room Temp Experiment

Discussion in 'DIY E-Liquid' started by Rossum, Mar 5, 2017.

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  1. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    SE PA
    Breathing any gas, or mixture of gases, that doesn't contain oxygen will kill you. But this is not a function of the density of the gas(es). ;)
     
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  2. Burnie

    Burnie The Bug Man Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Jul 1, 2009
    Sunny Florida
    Inside the rollers is 3", center to center is about 3.75". The tumbler cylinders are around 4" deep and 4" in diameter on the inside of them. The motor turns real slow for tumbling rocks. It makes a bit of noise when tumbling rocks, so it is on the work bench in the garage. They are not cheap, so be prepared for sticker shock. :facepalm:

    https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BUUT5K/ref=dp_cerb_1
     
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  3. sofarsogood

    sofarsogood Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2014
    Now that I see how it's geared I'm sure I'll make one. The trick is use a small diameter roller and large diameter drive wheel to get the slow speed. A smaller motor should be sufficient. Rolling a bottle of liquid would create very lilttle resistance compared to rocks.
     
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  4. coldgin96

    coldgin96 MADE IN U.S.A. Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Nitrogen displaces oxygen, hence purging bottles to remove oxygen which degrades many products nitrogen doesn't. :2c:
     
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  5. sofarsogood

    sofarsogood Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2014
    It needs to be mentioned that both nitorgen and argon are inert. The advantage of argon is it's heaviier than air
     
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  6. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    SE PA
    I'm going to go all pedantic here.

    Technically, nitrogen isn't "inert". If it were, it would not readily form compounds at all, and we'd have no nicotine, or amino acids, or numerous other compounds that are essential to life.

    To be truly "inert" an element's atoms have to have the last electron shell completely full, which is the case only for the stuff in the right-most column of the periodic table, i.e. helium, neon, argon, krypton, xenon, and radon.

    However, nitrogen is a great deal less reactive than oxygen because it forms a very strong triple bond with itself, which generally has to be broken before it will combine with anything else.

    That said, the N2 molecule is close enough to inert for our purposes. As already mentioned, the chief advantage of argon over nitrogen for what we're discussing here is argon's greater density.
     
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  7. kas122461

    kas122461 Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Jun 15, 2013
    Indiana, USA
    When I purged my bottles with Argon, I made a Plexiglass Box to do my purge in. I was going to use an acrylic fish tank, but they were too expensive, when I was just going to drill a hole in it. I put all my bottles in it and a tall jar with a candle on top, when the candle went out, I knew I could cap them. I don't think this would work with nitrogen though, the box would have to be closed, with those glove hole things, I think.

    KAS
     
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  8. sonicbomb

    sonicbomb Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Feb 17, 2015
    1187 Hunterwasser
    You had me at inert...
    [​IMG]
     
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  9. ChelsB

    ChelsB Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 12, 2016
    California
    Here’s the response from MFS that I received after sending them that picture of that dark bottle of nicotine
    [​IMG]
    ETA: they’re replacing the nic
     
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  10. Rossum

    Rossum Surly Curmudgeon Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 14, 2013
    SE PA
    I believe it won't have a material effect on the strength.

    However, I'm skeptical that it won't affect the taste. Of course taste is subjective, plus there's the question of discernibility, which will be affected by things like nic strength and amount & type of flavoring used in the juice you're making. My personal experience with relatively potent (15mg/ml) and mostly unflavored juice says that the difference between fresh, clear/colorless nic and nic that has darkened noticeably is readily apparent.
     
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  11. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    Prefacing with the fact that taste is totally subjective; I had a bottle turn dark in that manner on me one time because I left it out for a long period of time. I was vaping 18mg then and I can tell you that, to me, that nic. was nasty. Aside from an intense peppery flavor it also tasted like what I can best be described as "musty". I did not like it at all.
     
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  12. ChelsB

    ChelsB Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 12, 2016
    California
    They requested I look at the second liter in that order. I didn’t even have to open it to see it had darkened! And that’s in an opaque bottle! Wow!! At least they’re making things right, which is a lot more than other vape companies I’ve ordered from!
     
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  13. Capt.shay

    Capt.shay Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 10, 2013
    W. Ma. U.S.A.
    Frankly, I think they are going above and beyond for you. Every time I have left Nic. out for over a month or two it starts to darken, the longer the darker. This is what nic. does in a relatively warm environment and you really can't expect anything else unless you cold store it. I wouldn't normally expect a company to replace it for you after this amount of time stored at room temp. It is indeed very nice of them to do so.
     
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  14. stols001

    stols001 Mistress of the Dark Nicotinic Arts Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    May 30, 2017
    Tucson, AZ
    I think that's great customer service too, ChelsB. Very nice of them to replace it, chuck it in the freezer when it comes, yeah?

    Anna
     
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  15. ChelsB

    ChelsB Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 12, 2016
    California
    Yep! That’s the plan!
     
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  16. Eskie

    Eskie ECF Guru Verified Member ECF Veteran

    May 6, 2016
    NY
    Remember, extremes are always going to get you one way or another. Breathing 100% nitrogen will kill you pretty fast. But so will 100% oxygen, it will just take longer.
     
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  17. sofarsogood

    sofarsogood Vaping Master ECF Veteran

    Oct 12, 2014
    I had a milestone today, mentioned in another thread. I opened and divided my first long term storage bottle of nic and divided it into 4 250 ml bottles. It came from MFS and was in the freezer in an amber glass bottle, untouched, for exactly 2 years. It was almost crystal clear. I think there was no observable change from 2 years ago. I won't be trying it in a mix for a month, the next time I'll be mixing for myself.

    I'm confident it was well mixed. There was decent enough head space in the bottle. I rotated it by hand, end over end, in half a dozen sessions for the few weeks before the split.

    The next time I'll need to do this will be in about 2 years. I'm going to try to remember to chill the 250 ml bottles in the freezer before filling and have all the packing materials at hand. I couldn't pour directly from the 1 liter bottles to the smaller ones because the necks were too small and the 1 liter bottle too full. The solution was to pour from an erlenmeyer flask which is designed for easy filling and pouring.
     
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  18. ChelsB

    ChelsB Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 12, 2016
    California
    Got the new nic in hand! Nice and clear!
    I know I've asked this before but does everyone wash their storage bottles before use? I always do, but it seems unnecessary since it's brand new....?
     
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  19. Letitia

    Letitia Therion/Nano Junkie ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Apr 2, 2017
    West Frankfort, IL
    I should, but don't.
     
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  20. ChelsB

    ChelsB Vaping Master Verified Member ECF Veteran

    Supporting member
    Dec 12, 2016
    California
    I wonder if anyone has actually had a bad experience with NOT washing before using? Or if it's more of a personal preference and doesn't really matter...
     
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