One step closer to FDA regulation?

[rico942]

Maybe I'm getting a bit less tolerant of posturing and power games as I get older, but this business of trying to make me feel responsible for some else's misfortune is just complete nonsense. And to further imply that my behavior or preference in products somehow endangers the children of others is just beyond belief, not even worthy of response ...

However, as has been detailed here, the "protect the children" strategy still works well with the general public, its the ultimate discussion-killer, and draws lines that no one will cross without risk of villification ...

That being said, I really do think I would prefer a well-established black market for nic juice from overseas sources, rather than an obscene tax rate on domestic juices ...

It shames all of us when the officials that we elected roll over for a strident and fanatical minority and enact yet more restrictive laws that invade privacy and make "criminals" out of everyday citizens ...

 

[grandmato5]

Do they have children?
Do they have loved ones that died from cancer?

We need to find out who is supporting the ANTZ agenda in the real world.
I can only hope it isn't everyone.

OK, I'll describe a few I know.

Female 30 yrs old, previously worked for Smoke Free Now. Childcare program supervisor now. New mother.

60 yr old mother and grandmother. Smoked many years ago but quit about 20 yrs ago. IF the FDA says something it "must be true" mentality.

Female elementary school Principal. Also a mother.

60 yr old woman, mother and grandmother. Never smoked, did have a father that died from lung cancer.

90 yr old male, Smoked for many yrs before quitting 30 yrs ago. Has had throat and bladder cancer. Father, grandfather, great grandfather

38 yr old male, father, never smoked, no one close to him dying from cancer.

I could type forever as the list of those I know that support the ANTZ agenda is endless in my world.

 

[BigBen2k]

I'd have to disagree...

Banning flavorings may go a long way towards making vaping ineffective for new vapers.
And new vapers, for the most part, aren't going to be making their own juices.

Banning flavorings is one of many arrows in their quiver.
And we need to fight against that as hard as we fight against anything.

Good grief... The FDA is only in the business of tobacco flavors, because these additives are oxidized (burned).

They are not burned in an e-cig, and there are already MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for everything; the FDA has no authority over e-cig flavors, and they never will.

The FDA has tried to regulate nicotine in e-cigs, and so far have failed. The only way this would change, is if some juice vendors messed up, and sold different nic levels than advertised, and several got really hurt (or died) as a result.

All I can say is that we keep putting them in power. The liberal dems are the worst; it's well known that the majority of this power grab is theirs. But, the republicans are right behind them. Kick out the dems, and the pubs will be right behind to fill the gap and exercise their power. A true change is needed...

The reason the FDA isn't doing what they're supposed to be doing, is because it's been run over by corporate interests; you can figure out which party represents those corporate interests. The tobacco industry is a massive lobbyist.

 

[dr g]

They are not burned in an e-cig, and there are already MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) for everything; the FDA has no authority over e-cig flavors, and they never will.

Uh, the "F" in FDA stands for Food ... and ecig flavors are food flavorings. They absolutely have authority over those flavors, though the likelihood of them restricting the public availability of food flavors because of ejuice is IMO slim.

 

[patkin]

The point has gone off track. The FDA wants flavorings in all tobacco products prohibited because the flavors attract teens. So far that means all smokes and chews. The OP is "One Step Closer......." to ecigs. Its all BS. Last year, picking up my disposable cig filters, I bought some flavoring... think it was Tasty something... you just put a few drops of it right on the cig paper and let it dry.

 

[BigBen2k]

Ah but see, they're "flavors", before they are "food"; that's the rub.

As a "food" they're only subject to hygienic handling. Last I checked, juice manufacturers don't have "FDA certified" labs, but they've certainly received proper handling procedures from the FDA.

 

[Butters78]

FDA = the F'in ......... Alliance

 

[Glen Snyder]

Wow....a jump to a conclusion wrapped in a stereotype wrapped in an enigma of unknown future regulation.

Of all the e-cig regulation I worry about, the flavoring thing is the least of them. Meh. I buy my own flavoring and make my own juice anyway. Banning FLAVORING in e-juice is futile. And largely irrelevant.

I'll bet they tax the cigars....meh.

Yeah, grape cigars are sooo made for adult cigar smokers. C'mon, everyone in line behind Johnny 18 at the convenience store/gas station knows what he is doing with that grape cigar he's buying INCLUDING the politicians and FDA. btw, he didn't need an ID to buy the extra added ingredient

 

[Glen Snyder]

So who are these people that are "easily swayed" by that card?

That's what I'd like to know. I only here about those people and don't know any personally. I have come across some folks on local internet forums that subscribe to the "It takes a village" theory, but none of them are friends of mine.

If I had to guess who those people are I'd say the ones that go along with banning porn or bike night or anything else they don't participate in (openly that is)

 

[bluecat]

I've seen too many new vapers go back to smoking because the flavors they were initially exposed to weren't good.
Sure, providing access to really good tobacco flavors would help, and I hope that trend continues.

But providing access to really good cafe mocha, banana nut bread, or lemon pound cake will kill all desire for cigarettes.
This is something that anecdotal evidence and various polls on this forum have shown us.


As for me, I'm still all about the tobacco flavors.
But I don't count myself in the majority.

Agree mate. Have some home brewed cigar going now. Everything I vape has a tobacco base or flavoring. When I first started I scoured ecf for info. Basically bought recommendations. I didn't like them but I wanted to quit the cigs. I hated cig taste more. I enjoyed smoking. I still enjoy a cigar every week or two.

Taste alone won't get some to quit, I guess was my point. At least not me. For the record, I am not against smoking. I feel people have that right as well.

 

[DC2]

I could type forever as the list of those I know that support the ANTZ agenda is endless in my world.

Oh God, that must suck so bad.
I'm sorry.


I have no ANTZ in my world.
At least none that I know of at this time.

But if I did, they would know enough to keep their mouths shut around me.

 

[DC2]

Good grief... The FDA is only in the business of tobacco flavors, because these additives are oxidized (burned).

You're being sarcastic, right?

 

[BigBen2k]

You're being sarcastic, right?

No, but I did miss another important factor; tobacco kills! It's a hazard to public health.

But the point about the additives, is correct. If the additives didn't change in nature when consumed, then the FDA couldn't touch them; none of the flavors change, chemically, when we vape.

The FDA is pretty screwed here, trying to stop e-cigs; they can't regulate nicotine as a drug, because if they did, they'd effectively restrict potatoes, eggplant, etc ... and you don't want to mess with the potato growers!

No one has died from using an e-cig.

 

[belsenj]

Well, the FDA can't ban the use of flavors because they are used in restaurants and bakeries, etc all over the world. There's big $ in flavor companies, so that's not going anywhere.

Will they go after flavored tobacco products(which includes e-cigs)? Sure they will. I suggest that any e-cig companies might want to change their name to Bakery. LOL. The Vape Bake Anyway, we will still be able to get our flavors, but one might just have to mix them themselves.

I am sure they are watching this thread (cough cough NSA) so I will add that they are going after the wrong ingredient.

 

[DC2]

No, but I did miss another important factor; tobacco kills!

I would have sworn you were being sarcastic.


The FDA went after flavors in tobacco because it helps everyone.
It helps Big Pharma, it helps Big Tobacco, and it makes the Puritans happy.

And the FDA will almost certainly go after flavors in electronic cigarette juice because it helps everyone.
It helps Big Pharma, and it sort of helps Big Tobacco in a way as well.

And because, of course, it makes the Puritan groups happy and makes the politicians look good to the "protect the children" crowd.

 

[AttyPops]

That's probably correct. However, since we haven't seen any verbiage yet, it's also conjecture. So we're preaching to the choir again.

I'd rather they taxed the dang little cigars , but that's me. As to restricting flavorings...I'm exhausted just arguing about it. They sure have a way of wearing people down.

The whole thing with the ANTZ and e-juice is just....so factually wrong.

 

[Abbell]

I actually found this article more interesting...

I could quote most of it for comment.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/08/18/health/in-all-flavors-cigars-draw-in-young-smokers.html?ref=health&_r=0

One thing we need to make perfectly clear when dealing with these idiots in charge. Vaping is not tobacco. In fact with a few exceptions most e liquids contain no tobacco at all. The problem is that they do contain flavors, but so do all liqueurs and most alcoholic beverages. This will become a slippery slope fast.

 

[Abbell]

The other issue is what we can do that other forms of nicotine users cannot, for the most part, is reduce the nicotine content to zero. So what is the law if I am vaping a no-nic flavor? Is that illegal? Why precisely?

 

[DC2]

One thing we need to make perfectly clear when dealing with these idiots in charge. Vaping is not tobacco. In fact with a few exceptions most e liquids contain no tobacco at all. The problem is that they do contain flavors, but so do all liqueurs and most alcoholic beverages. This will become a slippery slope fast.

In regards to flavors and slippery slopes, just imagine when they start really going after obesity.

 

[belsenj]

Like i stated, they won't go after flavors by themselves. Only the flavored tobacco/juice.