Overheating E-Liquid May Produce Formaldehyde

[mooreted]

Since this is a NY Times article I'm taking it with a grain of salt, but I will continue looking into is as I don't know how PG or VG reacts when overheated. At least this article makes some concessions that PV's are safer than cigarettes.

www. nytimes .com/2014/05/04/business/some-e-cigarettes-deliver-a-puff-of-carcinogens.html

 

[guambred]

Interesting, I would wonder though at the true levels produced, or if this is just more fear mongering akin to the antifreeze found in the 2009 FDA study.

 

[DaveP]

The Drexel study is at the moment the best paper I know of for results of the chemicals contained in ecig vapor and the overall assessment of ecigs overall. They found that acrolein and formaldehyde are far below safe limits for humans. Both are only produced when the coil is heated to a high temperature level. I only see that as a problem with high wattage vaping, although both are acrid and more likely produced with a dry coil from wicking issues. My hope would be that you'd know it when it starts and fix the problem by refilling or tossing a carto when the acrid taste begins to be senses.

It's a pretty long document but you can search it and find what you need easily.

http://publichealth.drexel.edu/~/media/files/publichealth/ms08.pdf

From the Drexel study. TLV is Threshold Limit Values.

Predicted exposures to acrolein and formaldehyde are typically <5% TLV.

Monitoring upper airway irritation of vapers and experiences of unpleasant smell would also provide early warning of exposure to compounds like acrolein because of known immediate effects of elevated exposures (http://www.atsdr.cdc.gov/toxprofiles/tp124-c3.pdf; accessed July 11, 2013). However, it is questionable how much concern should be associated with observed concentrations of acrolein and formaldehyde in the aerosol. Given highly variable assessments, closer scrutiny is probably warranted to understand sources of this variability, although there is no need at present to be alarmed about exceeding even the occupational exposure limits, since occurrence of occasional high values is accounted for in established TLVs. An important clue towards a productive direction for such work is the results reported in [39,40] that convincingly demonstrate how heating the liquid to high temperatures generates compounds like acrolein and formaldehyde in the aerosol. A better understanding about the sources of TSNA in the aerosol may be of some interest as well, but all results to date consistently indicate quantities that are of no more concern than TSNA in smokeless tobacco products. Exposures to nicotine from electronic cigarettes is not expected to exceed that from smoking due to self-titration[11]; it is only a concern when a vaper does not intend to consume nicotine, a situation that can arise from incorrect labeling of liquids

(I'm just passing on information I've read)

 

[Cloud Junky]

I think these are the statements from anti-vaping community onboard with the FDA. Something like that would be a question when hearings begin to limit and ban vaping. Reason why I believe that it is a low blow is because formaldehyde causes cancer.

"formaldehyde, also called methanal (formulated HCHO), an organic compound, the simplest of the aldehydes, used in large amounts in a variety of chemical manufacturing processes. It is produced principally by the vapour-phase oxidation of methanol and is commonly sold as formalin, a 37 percent aqueous solution. Formalin may be dehydrated to trioxane, a crystalline trimer, or to an amorphous polymer, paraformaldehyde, which is a convenient source of gaseous formaldehyde.

Formaldehyde and ammonia yield methenamine, or hexamethylenetetramine, which is used as a urinary antiseptic. Nitration of methenamine gives the explosive cyclonite, or RDX. Formaldehyde and acetaldehyde react in the presence of calcium hydroxide to give pentaerythritol, the tetranitrate of which is the explosive PETN. Large quantities of formaldehyde are used in the manufacture of urea–formaldehyde, phenol–formaldehyde, and acetal resins. The reaction of formaldehyde with proteins leads to its use in the tanning industry and in treating various vegetable proteins to render them fibrous. The reactivity with proteins is also the basis for the use of formaldehyde as a disinfectant, an embalming agent, and a soil sterilant.

Pure formaldehyde is a colourless, flammable gas with a strong pungent odour. It is extremely irritating to the mucous membranes and is associated with certain types of cancer in humans and other animals. Formaldehyde is classified as a human carcinogen (cancer-causing substance)."

Reference: formaldehyde (chemical compound) -- Encyclopedia Britannica

 

[Uma]

Unless one is using a 50 watt vaporizer that is meant for other purposes, I don't see how a 20 or 30 watt can heat it up that hot. They are also talking volts. A 4.8 volt with a what, 1.2 atty? Lol, their science is so far out of reach with reality it's not even funny. Like the commenters said, this sounds like a ploy to get rid of the cigalikes competition because more Vapers use advanced gear than beginners gear. Herzog's billion dollar report stirred this "science" article into being.
If I remember correctly, Dr. Farsalinos already experimented with various volts. I would go by whatever he says, he's honest and he knows we only want the truths & solutions.

 

[Uma]

<snip>]

Formaldehyde is exhaled from every body on earth. The more people gathered, the higher the level. Should we ban gatherings?
In fact, if I remember correctly, Vapers exhale LESS natural toxins than non Vapers. We should ban all non Vapers if you ask me.

 

[DaveP]

The studies I've read report acrolein production occurring around 500F. The average coil wrapped around a wet wick runs in the 200F range. The Drexel study talks about high temps and acrolein/formaldehyde production not really being an issue due to the normally lower temps involved in vaping.

It's a good reason not to inhale when you dry burn a coil. Do it under an oven exhaust hood.

 

[catilley1092]

I have to agree with Cloud Junky on this matter, just more propaganda fed to the public.

The worst thing that I've noticed with overheating is that it will scorch & discolor some, which may lead to a unpleasant or strong taste. So does burned hot dogs/hamburgers if overcooked on the grill. Are those bad for my health also?

What I've done to reduce this, is upped the ohms on my coils, both my ego style & Astro clone runs much cooler with 2.5 vs 1.8 ohm coils. This was actually unintentionally discovered, I had a lot of flooding with cheaper generic coils & switched to Genuine KangerTech ones, which did stop the leaking & flooding.

I had no idea that the devices would run cooler because of this, as a result, when I top off, there is much less darker e-juice falling down into the new, compared to before the coil switch. Meaning less burning & likely longer useful battery life, as heat is a battery killer.

Cat

 

[jakart]

All I know is this article freaked out my girlfriend enough to make her ask me to smoke my ecigarette near an open window with an air filter on. Which pretty much defeats much of the convenience of vaping for me. I know it's safer than smoking, but it's difficult to convince someone that the secondhand vapor is harmless when articles like this run on the front page of the times.

 

[Dominique Hoogduin]

well.. vw/vv devices can be outfitted with heat protection so the coils dont get too hot (turn off the coils at set intervals before stuff gets too hot). Dunno if it would work but offcourse they didnt test this.

 

[DrMA]

We all are well aware that pulling dry hits is extremely nasty and quite likely produces toxic compounds, even smoke. I can't find the actual research article, but I bet they used the Pruebot testing method, where an air pump simulates a vaper, and the good Dr. keeps the button pressed until the coil glows red.

 

[AmandaD]

All I know is this article freaked out my girlfriend enough to make her ask me to smoke my ecigarette near an open window with an air filter on. Which pretty much defeats much of the convenience of vaping for me. I know it's safer than smoking, but it's difficult to convince someone that the secondhand vapor is harmless when articles like this run on the front page of the times.

Show her the Drexel study....

 

[mooreted]

Interesting, I would wonder though at the true levels produced, or if this is just more fear mongering akin to the antifreeze found in the 2009 FDA study.

That's the problem with this reporter's stories: What what tested, how was it tested, at what temperature was the change noticed, what levels of formaldehyde was observed, etc.

Still, it doesn't mean it's not a good study, just a bad reporter.

 

[mooreted]

Liked for the Linux Mint logo.

Unfortunately, this so-called "journalist" is a really poor one.

 

[Steamix]

Quote He said NJoy had significantly lower levels of formaldehyde than regular cigarettes. Unquote

Nice one.

Talking e-cigs all the time, then mentioning a profucts name in connection with 'cigarettes'.

Not e-cigarettes.

Have to admit it, elegantly done. Almost slipped it under my door.

Almost.

As I have my suspicions now as to who is buttering the author's bread, that rag just joined the ranks of my long list of 'dubious sources'...

 

[mooreted]

Here is his Twitter page:

twitter. com/mrichtel

All of the stories I looked at were sensational crap. I don't care if he has a Pulitzer and a masters degree; everything he writes is crap. He even uses the term "Vapor Madness" in one tweet.

 

[mooreted]

And Facebook page:

www.facebook.com/MattRichtel

 

[ruet]

Like Aspartame?

snopes.com: Aspartame -- Sweet Poison?

Oh wait, Aspartame doesn't need to be overheated.

 

[stevegmu]

How hot does e-liquid get via sub ohm coils at 30 watts?

 

[madpiano]

Your girlfriend hopefully doesn't paint her nails? Most nailpolishes have formaldehyde in them.... There was a big scare story about it in the late 80s. But the amount of exposure is so low, it was deemed negligible. It does have a pungent smell, even in small amounts.
I have at times absentmindedly vaped and hit a dry coil. Scratchy, burny feeling. Not nice. But of course we don't do this all the time. I bet the amounts of either chemical are much higher in every drag of a cigarette.

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