Overheating E-Liquid May Produce Formaldehyde

[db13berry]

Ya know, it has been found that our ground beef contains ammonia and formaldehyde. This came out I believe in 2012.

And I still see ground beef being sold in every grocery store across the nation....

Sent from my couch using Tapatalk.

 

[Nate760]

All I know is this article freaked out my girlfriend enough to make her ask me to smoke my ecigarette near an open window with an air filter on. Which pretty much defeats much of the convenience of vaping for me. I know it's safer than smoking, but it's difficult to convince someone that the secondhand vapor is harmless when articles like this run on the front page of the times.

You may want to explain to her that her reaction entails exactly the type of irrational hysteria these articles are trying to create, and that there is a large and ever-increasing body of scientific evidence from credible, independent, unaffiliated researchers indicating that e-cig vapor poses no possible threat to anyone.

 

[Rossum]

All I know is this article freaked out my girlfriend enough to make her ask me to smoke my ecigarette near an open window with an air filter on.

Dump her -- while you still can. If she's like that now as your girlfriend, just imagine what she'll turn into if you marry her and have children with her.

 

[jakart]

Dump her -- while you still can. If she's like that now as your girlfriend, just imagine what she'll turn into if you marry her and have children with her.

Lol it's ok I don't have to dump her we can just have a conversation about it. The article is intended to be scary, that's what annoys me about it because it is based on so little factual evidence. I understand her reaction... honestly the article freaks me out a little too. I'm just hoping I can calm her down (I usually can.)

 

[etchie]

The levels are so low, that when they looked at the amount that was being produced, it turned out half of that amount was naturally being produced by human breath. I don't remember though, if that was a study done with more powerful mods or with cigalikes.

 

[DaveP]

More from the Drexel study which showed formaldehyde detection in their ecig study to be around .002ppm to .008ppm with a safety factor of 20 to 40 compared to EPA limits.

There is no serious concern about the contaminants such as volatile organic compounds (formaldehyde, acrolein, etc.) in the liquid or produced by heating. While these contaminants are present, they have been detected at problematic levels only in a few studies that apparently were based on unrealistic levels of heating.

It was judged that the simplest form of publication bias – disappearance of an entire formal study from the available literature – was unlikely given the exhaustive search strategy and the contested nature of the research question. It is clearly the case that only a portion of all industry technical reports were available for public access, so it is possible that those with more problematic results were systematically suppressed, though there is no evidence to support this speculation. No formal attempt was made to ascertain publication bias in situ though it is apparent that anomalous results do gain prominence in typical reviews of the literature: diethylene glycol[43,44] detected at non-dangerous levels (see details below) in one test of 18 of early-technology products by FDA[22] and one outlier in measurement of formaldehyde content of exhaled air [4] and aldehydes in aerosol generated from one e-cigarette in Japan[37]. It must be emphasized that the alarmist report of aldehydes in experiments presented in [37] is based on the concentration in generated aerosol rather than air inhaled by the vaper over prolonged period of time (since vapers do not inhale only aerosol). Thus, results reported in [37] cannot be the basis of any claims about health risk, a fallacy committed both by the authors themselves and commentators on this work

It looks like materials found in homes can far exceed ecigs for formaldehyde production.

From the EPA's own study.
http://www.epa.gov/ttn/atw/hlthef/formalde.html

The highest levels of airborne formaldehyde have been detected in indoor air, where it is released from various consumer products such as building materials and home furnishings. One survey reported formaldehyde levels ranging from 0.10 to 3.68 parts per million (ppm) in homes. Higher levels have been found in new manufactured or mobile homes than in older conventional homes. (1)

 

[Uma]

A little bit more digging. (I just saw somebody asking dr. F about it, forgive if it's already been posted).

"Not bull..... Formaldehyde levels were 13-800 times lower than cigarettes at 3.2 and 4 volts, but became almost equal to cigarettes at 4.8 volts (using a top-coil atomizer)." X Dr. F.

Formaldehyde levels
Indoor Air Quality: Learn about VOCs and Formaldehyde - Green Building Supply

Typical standards or limits of formaldehyde emissions:

World Health Organization: Below 0.10 ppm
European E1 Standard: Below 0.10 ppm
US Dept of Labor (OSHA) permissible exposure level (PEL) .75 ppm (8 hour time weighted average (TWA)
OSHA Hazard Communication Standard: Hazard warning labels on any manufactured product that may emit 0.10 ppm or greater
GreenGuard® Environmental Institute Certification: Below 0.05 ppm
State of California: Below 0.05 ppm

Foods known to contain naturally-occurring formaldehyde
in mg./kg
Apple 6.3 – 22.3
Apricot 9.5
Banana 16.3
Bulb vegetables (e.g. onion) 11
Cabbage 5.3
Carrot 6.7-10
Cucumber 2.3 -3.7
Pear 38.7 - 60
Potato 19.5
Spinach 3.3 – 7.3
Tomato 5.7 13.3
Watermelon 9.2
Shiitake mushroom dried 100-406
Beef 4.6
Pig 5.8-20
Sheep 8
Poultry 2.5-5.7
Processed meats (incl ham & sausage) < 20.7
Goat's Milk 1
Cow's Milk < 3.3
Cheese < 3.3
Cod 4.6 -34
Shrimp 1-2.4
Squid 1.8
Alcoholic beverage .02-3.8
Soft drinks 8.7
Brewed coffee 3.4-4.5
Instant coffee 10-16
Syrup <1-1.54
Sources:

F levels by who
http://www.euro.who.int/__data/assets/pdf_file/0014/123062/AQG2ndEd_5_8Formaldehyde.pdf

F in cig smoke
Formaldehyde exposures from tobacco smoke: a review.

Reports of formaldehyde levels in mainstream, sidestream, and environmental tobacco smoke from nine studies are reviewed. Considerable disparity exists between formaldehyde production rates determined from mainstream-sidestream studies and those reporting levels in environmental tobacco smoke. Tobacco smoke does not appear to increase vapor-phase formaldehyde levels significantly in indoor environments, but formaldehyde exposure in mainstream smoke may pose a risk of upper respiratory system cancer and increase the risk of cancer in smokers.

Forces international & Chris Snowdon's blog discuss how the EPA changed the acceptable levels in order to make cig smoke unacceptable.

 

[rothenbj]

How hot does e-liquid get via sub ohm coils at 30 watts?

Is that question referring to before or after the battery goes thermal?

 

[Rossum]

A little bit more digging. (I just saw somebody asking dr. F about it, forgive if it's already been posted).

"Not bull..... Formaldehyde levels were 13-800 times lower than cigarettes at 3.2 and 4 volts, but became almost equal to cigarettes at 4.8 volts (using a top-coil atomizer)." X Dr. F.

I'm still convinced that voltage not the right thing to have on the X axis of your chart when you look for formaldehyde production. I expect wire temperature is what you really want there, and that of course is a function of far more than just voltage; it also depends on coil geometry, and the ability of your wicking to keep the wire wet.

Another interesting thing to study would be the correlation (if any) between formaldehyde levels in vapor and the onset of a "burnt" or "dry hit" taste in experienced vapers.

 

[stevegmu]

Is that question referring to before or after the battery goes thermal?

Before. What's going to happen next is a rash of 'kids' sub ohm-ing and getting their face burned up. Then the hammer will come down...

 

[rothenbj]

I'm still convinced that voltage not the right thing to have on the X axis of your chart when you look for formaldehyde production. I expect wire temperature is what you really want there, and that of course is a function of far more than just voltage; it also depends on coil geometry, and the ability of your wicking to keep the wire wet.

Another interesting thing to study would be the correlation (if any) between formaldehyde levels in vapor and the onset of a "burnt" or "dry hit" taste in experienced vapers.

I'm not close to being a chemist, but what you've written makes sense. The heat of the coil and the length of time it's heated plus the condition of the wick would seem to play more into the science than voltage.

 

[rothenbj]

Before. What's going to happen next is a rash of 'kids' sub ohm-ing and getting their face burned up. Then the hammer will come down...

Steve, that worries me more than anything about vaping at this point. I read a post about some kid that showed up where the guy worked bragging that he was running at .15 ohms and couldn't understand why his mod was getting hot. Who knows what battery he was using, but even with the best he was still up in the danger zone. However, I bet he was creating clouds.

 

[DaveP]

Current flow (I=E/R) is probably a more revealing measurement of the combination of voltage and resistance in a mod. It's easy to calculate and corresponds with the C rating method of batteries and the safety cutoff algorithms of mods. 6 volts /.5 ohms = 12 amps.

Temperature is probably a better indicator of vaping safety, though.

 

[TomCatt]

New Graphic Illustrates Problems with EPAs Formaldehyde Risk Assessment

 

[DaveP]

New Graphic Illustrates Problems with EPAs Formaldehyde Risk Assessment

Funny how that article refers to the concentrations in PPB (parts per billion) and the Drexel study quotes EPA guidelines in PPM (parts per million). Both refer to Snus as a comparison.

 

[a_e_u]

Formaldehyde release in e-cigarette vapor. The New York Times story explained in detail (Dr Farsalinos)

 

[rothenbj]

New Graphic Illustrates Problems with EPAs Formaldehyde Risk Assessment

That's really a good graphic and shows how out of control some of these Fed Agencies are.

Whether it's volts or current, I try to use the common sense approach. When I vape, I'm not trying to build the biggest cloud or get the biggest warm throat hit. On my Provari or Vamo, it might take 2 or 3 seconds to generate enough heat to vaporize the liquid at 1.5 ohms, for example. On my Nemesis at .65 ohms, I get a very satisfactory vape, for me, in less than a second. I can run my hand thru an open flame fairly quickly and the most I get is perhaps a feeling of the warmth. If I let it rest in the flame for 5 seconds, the results are much different.

I have the same theory on battery issues. If I am vaping and the body of my APV is getting warm, I give it a rest.

 

[NorthOfAtlanta]

That's really a good graphic and shows how out of control some of these Fed Agencies are.

Whether it's volts or current, I try to use the common sense approach. When I vape, I'm not trying to build the biggest cloud or get the biggest warm throat hit. On my Provari or Vamo, it might take 2 or 3 seconds to generate enough heat to vaporize the liquid at 1.5 ohms, for example. On my Nemesis at .65 ohms, I get a very satisfactory vape, for me, in less than a second. I can run my hand thru an open flame fairly quickly and the most I get is perhaps a feeling of the warmth. If I let it rest in the flame for 5 seconds, the results are much different.

I have the same theory on battery issues. If I am vaping and the body of my APV is getting warm, I give it a rest.

This involves common sense and we know that inside the beltway that is uncommon.

 

[2coils]

The researcher "cooked" the top coil clearo, at 4.8 volts. That is really Prue Talbot style. If these studies are not done correctly, the results will be skewed. This does not even have to be intentional. One can not expect a researcher to do a study about a product that they do not know much about. Measuring toxicity levels in e-cigs is not the same as lighting a combustible cigarette. Once a cigarette is lit, it is lit. When considering the variables associated with vaping, there is little room for error, when conducting the tests. All IMHO of course!

 

[skoony]

as stated in other posts formaldehyde is not only formed naturally in our bodies,like gasoline,
it is naturally found in the foods we eat.it is also a by-product of decomposition.
it is one of those things found every where like arsenic that when referred to out of
context scares the begeebers out of people.
if you ever purchase beer on a military base there is a lot of formaldehyde in it
as a preservative as no one knows how long it may be stored in a hot desert warehouse.
as a side note it makes miller high life taste great and you get a very good buzz.(i kid you not)

regards
mike