Panic attacks three weeks after quitting advice please.

[Silent Scream]

Hi again

At 24 mg that's a lot of liquid to go through in one day. That may very well be the underlying cause of what's going on here. Over two years in I still use 24 mg stuff, but if I get up into the 3+ ml per day range that makes me feel "punchy" too - like caffeine jitters - and can trigger palpitations even.

You may want to take a read through here, but don't scare yourself either => http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/health-safety-e-smoking/3305-list-symptoms-when-quitting-tobacco-changing-ecigarette.html

We will fix you as best we can. But as always the standard disclaimer applies: If you believe you have a serious medical problem going on get thee to a health care professional.

Thanks Rick,

I've seen that list before none of it explains my current situation. I think I'm going to have to work on reducing the nic but as I said above, when I reduce nic level I vape more. I'll just have to control it.

Weird thing is I had no problems at all for the first three weeks no matter how high or low nic intake was in my liquids. Maybe it all mounts up? I don't know.

I have to fight this, I absolutely won't go back to cigarettes I'll feel a complete failure.

Having said that, if I have another night like last night I'll have to see my doctor. I really don't know if I can do that again. I felt like I was going to die

 

[belsenj]

I got anxiety quite bad during my first 4 weeks after quitting analogs. I do get anxiety once in a while all by myself, but after quitting, I was really having the jitters and anxiety pretty bad. But.... it did pass by the end of week 4.

Up until that time, I was doing 24nic as much as I wanted because I knew I could pick up at any time (I didn't want that).

So, for me...it passed. I then was able to go to 18nic by week 6 I think.

 

[retrox]

My panic attacks started at almost precisely six weeks after quitting cigs and lasted around a week more. I had maybe six or seven in total, moderate to severe. First one was in a Target store, completely unexpected. One minute I'm looking at cookies, the next I'm nauseous, my heart is racing, my vision is swimming, and I'm convinced I'm having a stroke or something. Had to sit down in housewares with my head between my knees for a few minutes until it passed. My girlfriend thought we should go to the ER, but I refused.

The attacks persisted throughout the following week, mostly striking while I was at work. I have a fairly stressful job to begin with, but it's never been the type of stress I felt like I couldn't manage (I've been employed there for 8+ years and have pretty much seen it all). All of a sudden, it was like the slightest thing would set me off. I'd get woozy, everything tilting around me like crazy, heartbeat out of control, and it was so bad a couple of times that I had to lie down on the floor until it passed. I decided to make an appointment with my doctor.

After listening to my symptoms, though, one of my co-workers identified what was happening to me as panic attacks. He used to have a condition that caused them, and made no bones about his certainty that this was exactly what was happening to me. He asked me, "What has changed in your life in the last few weeks?" Well, that was obvious. Once I'd pegged it for what it was, I never had another attack. I'm not saying this is what is happening to you, I'm only relating my experience. I'm 42 years old and have never in my entire life had issues with panic attacks until I quit smoking.

When you feel one coming on, close your eyes, relax with a few deep breaths, and remind yourself that what's happening is harmless and will pass as quickly as it came. Your system is purging.

 

[Rickajho]

Huh. I was wondering why I have put on 20 lbs the last six months when I'm not eating/snacking any differently. I thought I wouldn't gain weight this time like I did all the other times I quit and did food as a replacement. Thanks, I'm gonna look into this further.

ETA: I am and always have been a total couch potato. Guess now that I actually have the energy to do so, I should start exercising. Ugh.

See here (among others) => Smoking and hormones in health and endocrin... [Eur J Endocrinol. 2005] - PubMed - NCBI

It's bad enough what smoking does to your hormonal systems over decades of smoking, but for a select few pulling the plug on the suppression can produce some really wacky medical results.

ETA: I'm trying to find the durned report that covers this specific issue. It's come up before on ECF.

What it comes down to is a person can have an underlying endocrine disorder that is kept suppressed by the effects of smoking. When you take smoking out of the equation and the hormonal system is no longer being held in check, the genie pops out of the bottle and the underlying hormonal disorder reveals itself.

That would be my concern about what may be going on with the OP. If dropping the nic level to 12 mg doesn't change anything don't go screwing around with WTA to try and correct it. Get to an MD and get checked out soon.

 

[smokinMelissa]

SS, I'm so sorry you're experiencing the panic attacks. I've had a history with them myself and I know how much they suck.

During my transition from smoking to vaping, i had a lot of trouble too and kept going back to the cigs for a cpl weeks, returned to vaping a week, then back on the cigs... I just couldn't seem to break the cycle. At the time I was using 24 mg liquids and someone suggested I try stronger nic liquids.... Now i'm not recommending it, just sharing what worked for me. I started using 40 mg. YES, 4-0! Using that strong of nic gave me nic buzzes and sleeping issues initially but i slowed down my chain vaping and I suppose my body adjusted to the higher levels but the important thing for me was that I didn't pick up another cig.

Your question though reminds me that I did have some major anxiety issues for probably a month or so but I attributed them to other things happening in my life instead of pointing a finger at vaping. But the WTA isn't something I'm familiar with and found this interesting blog on the subject. I see a mirror to some of the same things I experienced when i moved to 100% vaping.

Anyway, I thought I'd post the blog link here just in case someone else recognizes similarities to their personal experience with quitting cigs. I've made it past the horror points and I'm not tempted by WTA today but if I had known about it then...

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/dvap/642-madame-psychosis-summary-pt-1.html

 

[DaveP]

I'm not in the medical field and I'm just passing on the results of my personal searches. The link below satisfied my curiosity about why I got so jumpy when i tried to quit cold turkey. I'd sit around after eating in a restaurant and tear up soda straw wrappers, make paper footballs, and find it hard to sit still. OTOH, after vaping for a while and then quitting smoking, there was nothing ... no side effects and no nervousness. The key was that I quit on a long downward slide into being a non-smoker.

You might want to consider not quitting cold turkey. I started my quit smoking journey by vaping and still having a couple of cigs with coffee in the morning and one after each meal. If I felt I needed it, I'd have one before bed. Do that for a while and then you can quit those last few with no side effects. Cold Turkey can be a shock for some people. Taper off and things will probably be much easier.

MAOI is one of the things found in tobacco that gave us that calm feeling. When you were not able to smoke and finally got out to the break area you lit up and huffed a few times and then calm washed over you. That was MAOIs at work. Monoamine Oxidase Inhibitors prevent the break down of Dopamine in the brain and tend to make us more calm. The result is that a smoker has more Dopamine in their brain at any given time than a non-smoker. The link below will explain it. When you vape, you get nicotine, but you lose the MAOI component.

All About Nicotine | this is your brain on drugs

 

[Silent Scream]

My panic attacks started at almost precisely six weeks after quitting cigs and lasted around a week more. I had maybe six or seven in total, moderate to severe. First one was in a Target store, completely unexpected. One minute I'm looking at cookies, the next I'm nauseous, my heart is racing, my vision is swimming, and I'm convinced I'm having a stroke or something. Had to sit down in housewares with my head between my knees for a few minutes until it passed. My girlfriend thought we should go to the ER, but I refused.

The attacks persisted throughout the following week, mostly striking while I was at work. I have a fairly stressful job to begin with, but it's never been the type of stress I felt like I couldn't manage (I've been employed there for 8+ years and have pretty much seen it all). All of a sudden, it was like the slightest thing would set me off. I'd get woozy, everything tilting around me like crazy, heartbeat out of control, and it was so bad a couple of times that I had to lie down on the floor until it passed. I decided to make an appointment with my doctor.

After listening to my symptoms, though, one of my co-workers identified what was happening to me as panic attacks. He used to have a condition that caused them, and made no bones about his certainty that this was exactly what was happening to me. He asked me, "What has changed in your life in the last few weeks?" Well, that was obvious. Once I'd pegged it for what it was, I never had another attack. I'm not saying this is what is happening to you, I'm only relating my experience. I'm 42 years old and have never in my entire life had issues with panic attacks until I quit smoking.

When you feel one coming on, close your eyes, relax with a few deep breaths, and remind yourself that what's happening is harmless and will pass as quickly as it came. Your system is purging.

What you're talking about sounds close to what I felt last night. I was convinced I was coming down with a heart attack or stroke or something and that made me even more anxious.

Mine is always in the background though and gets worse sometimes and others isn't there at all.

I'm going to see how I feel tomorrow. If I don't have another nightmare from hell night tonight I'll just ride the wave. Otherwise I'll have to see someone. Scariest night of my life last night.

 

[Silent Scream]

I started using 40 mg. YES, 4-0! Using that strong of nic gave me nic buzzes and sleeping issues initially but i slowed down my chain vaping and I suppose my body adjusted to the higher levels but the important thing for me was that I didn't pick up another cig.



http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/blogs/dvap/642-madame-psychosis-summary-pt-1.html

Thanks for the link Melissa but it's funny you should mention the high nic keeping you off cigs. That's the reason I started on 24mg. But even at my worst low (last night) it never even occurred to me to go get a cigarette. I much prefer vaping now I've got used to it. That's why I am dreading the idea of rushing to a cig to 'normalise' myself again. I absolutely can't let that happen.

 

[DaveP]

Thanks for the link Melissa but it's funny you should mention the high nic keeping you off cigs. That's the reason I started on 24mg. But even at my worst low (last night) it never even occurred to me to go get a cigarette. I much prefer vaping now I've got used to it. That's why I am dreading the idea of rushing to a cig to 'normalise' myself again. I absolutely can't let that happen.

Lots of people have various experiences with quitting smoking. Many if not most of the successful vapers who quit smoking for good do so by vaping and still smoking a few every day. Most any thread you read will have that advice as part of the success story. Cold Turkey quitting puts you in a frame of mind where you still want a cig, but can't have it. Allowing yourself one here and there is good therapy. Don't think of it as "going back to a habit". Think of it as tapering down to zero without the stress. Vaping will eventually make you forget to smoke at various periods during the day. Then, you can cut out the one you always smoked at that time. Eventually, you will reach zero at your own pace.

I started at 24mg and I'm down to 12mg. That has been a 3 1/2 year period. I smoked a few here and there during the first two years. It was when I decided to cut those out that I discovered I could have quit those last few any time I wanted to. I just started reducing my nic a few months ago. I should have done that sooner, too.

 

[angstless]

Thanks for the replies everyone. Yes Thunder I'm in the UK. I can't see a doctor at short notice because I'm staying at my partner's place at the moment which is a long way from my own place and you can't see a local doctor it has to be your own.

I'm kind of hoping it will just pass. It's been a couple of days now.

If you lived in America..not matter where you lived or whom you lived with...YOU COULD NOT GET MENTAL HEALTH..unless you have some sort of VERY EXPENSIVE Insurance...

 

[LucentShadow]

Thanks again for the replies. I feel I should explain something. I have tried a few times to lower my nic and starter vaping 18mg during the day. The thing is, I find myself chain vaping at that level where with 24 I can stop for a while, kind of like when I was smoking cigarettes. At 12 ml I would probably be vaping non stop lol.

My point is, if lowering nic level means you vape more surely you end up with the same nicotine intake in the end?

This is one of the reasons that I suggested considering WTA e-liquid. I would not suggest it to everyone, as it may represent lessening one's harm reduction for some, over just using nicotine. But, if you find that only high levels of nicotine are 'working' for you, you may already be lessening your harm reduction.

I've seen people that use more nic. It's different for everyone. Many find that WTA of the same concentration as their nicotine liquid is far more satisfying, prompting them to use less, and they feel more calm and focused in doing so.

It may not be related to the switch to e-cigs at all, but I'd say that chances are that it is. It may pass on it's own, but it may not. None of us can say with any certainty what is wrong. Doctors may be able to easily tell you, but they may also not. It is worth getting checked out if it begins to concern you greatly.

I know that stopping smoking and doing only nicotine replacement makes me suffer mentally in some subtle ways, even after many months. Things like snus work to keep me off smoking, but I don't like snus much. WTA is a great solution for me. It's more expensive than most e-liquids, though some can use it only to supplement their normal e-liquid use, as necessary.

 

[Silent Scream]

Cold Turkey quitting puts you in a frame of mind where you still want a cig, but can't have it. .

But that's just it. I'm not in a situation where I think I really need a cig and can't have one. I have no desire to have one at all. If I did, it would be to give me what I'm missing from cigs that I don't get from vaping and I can't even guarantee it would work because I was fine for three weeks.

I don't want a cigarette, if I took one it would be for 'medicinal' purposes how ironic would that be.

 

[LucentShadow]

But that's just it. I'm not in a situation where I think I really need a cig and can't have one. I have no desire to have one at all. If I did, it would be to give me what I'm missing from cigs that I don't get from vaping and I can't even guarantee it would work because I was fine for three weeks.

I don't want a cigarette, if I took one it would be for 'medicinal' purposes how ironic would that be.

If you have no desire for cigs anymore, that's a good thing. I would not suggest smoking for medicinal purposes, though. There are other alternatives such as snus and dissolvable tobacco, as well as many supplements that are not tobacco products that could possibly help, if it does not pass.

 

[Silent Scream]

This is one of the reasons that I suggested considering WTA e-liquid. I would not suggest it to everyone, as it may represent lessening one's harm reduction for some, over just using nicotine. But, if you find that only high levels of nicotine are 'working' for you, you may already be lessening your harm reduction.

I've seen people that use more nic. It's different for everyone. Many find that WTA of the same concentration as their nicotine liquid is far more satisfying, prompting them to use less, and they feel more calm and focused in doing so.

It may not be related to the switch to e-cigs at all, but I'd say that chances are that it is. It may pass on it's own, but it may not. None of us can say with any certainty what is wrong. Doctors may be able to easily tell you, but they may also not. It is worth getting checked out if it begins to concern you greatly.

I know that stopping smoking and doing only nicotine replacement makes me suffer mentally in some subtle ways, even after many months. Things like snus work to keep me off smoking, but I don't like snus much. WTA is a great solution for me. It's more expensive than most e-liquids, though some can use it only to supplement their normal e-liquid use, as necessary.

Thanks Lucent I'm not ignoring the WTA option that has been suggested by a few people I just have to find out where I can get it in the UK. I'm on a few UK forums I will ask them. The extra expense is not a problem, I spent a LOT on cigarettes and as has been said so often by so many there's no price you can put on something that keeps you off cigarettes.

My partner is really worried, she has never seen me out of sorts before and we've been together five years. I'm usually very calm and collected. It has to be the switch away from cigs that is doing this to me. I'll fight it, and thank God for places like this with so many wonderful people pitching in to help.

Thanks everyone.

 

[DaveP]

But that's just it. I'm not in a situation where I think I really need a cig and can't have one. I have no desire to have one at all. If I did, it would be to give me what I'm missing from cigs that I don't get from vaping and I can't even guarantee it would work because I was fine for three weeks.

I don't want a cigarette, if I took one it would be for 'medicinal' purposes how ironic would that be.

You may be one who benefits from WTA juices (whole tobacco alkaloids).

 

[Silent Scream]

You may be one who benefits from WTA juices (whole tobacco alkaloids).

I may well be. Thanks Lucent and Dave, if this does not pass WTA will be my next stop. I'm okay with any 'next stop' that isn't cigarettes.

 

[mmsjs5]

Thanks Rick,

I've seen that list before none of it explains my current situation. I think I'm going to have to work on reducing the nic but as I said above, when I reduce nic level I vape more. I'll just have to control it.

Weird thing is I had no problems at all for the first three weeks no matter how high or low nic intake was in my liquids. Maybe it all mounts up? I don't know.

I have to fight this, I absolutely won't go back to cigarettes I'll feel a complete failure.

Having said that, if I have another night like last night I'll have to see my doctor. I really don't know if I can do that again. I felt like I was going to die

When this first started for me, I went to the Dr. and he gave me an Ativan prescription. It worked, but I don't like going to the Dr., so, after awhile, I figured out that 2 extra strength acetaminophen (Tylenol), and 1 - 25mg diphenhydramine (Benadryl) calms that feeling and lets me go to sleep without being startled awake with that feeling. There were nights, though, that I had to take 2 of the diphenhydramine to finally gets some sleep.

I really feel for you, and agree with seeing the Dr. if this doesn't pass, but in the meantime, you may be able to use what I did.

 

[RosaJ]

Are you taking any new medications? Has something happened in your life that would cause you to feel like you're not in control? We're not doctors/psychiatrists so I strongly recommend you see your doctor asap.

It could be so many things such as hormone imbalance and only a medical professional can test and diagnose what is really going on. It may have something to do with quitting smoking, but then again I don't know.

 

[cmdebrecht]

So sorry to hear of your trouble with panic attacks. They are miserable.

Whether or not they are related to quitting smoking may take a while to figure out, and may need to be addressed by a doctor.

Until then, though, there are a few things you could try in an effort to ease your anxiety.

I would avoid caffeine if possible as it is a stimulant like nic. Could be your nervous system is overwhelmed at the moment.

You could keep a tank of lower and higher nic on hand. Maybe if you switch off throughout the day that would help reduce your nic intake, and you won't feel deprived.

Try some valerian root or kava kava capsules. You should be able to find these where you can buy vitamins. You can ask a pharmacist (a chemist in the UK I think).

Essential oils Like lavender are very helpful too. Do a search for anxiety reducing essential oils. I bet because you are in the UK you probably have access to all sorts of teas. You will probably find many that can help ease anxiety.

Hope you are well soon.

 

[Silent Scream]

So sorry to hear of your trouble with panic attacks. They are miserable.

Whether or not they are related to quitting smoking may take a while to figure out, and may need to be addressed by a doctor.

Until then, though, there are a few things you could try in an effort to ease your anxiety.

I would avoid caffeine if possible as it is a stimulant like nic. Could be your nervous system is overwhelmed at the moment.

You could keep a tank of lower and higher nic on hand. Maybe if you switch off throughout the day that would help reduce your nic intake, and you won't feel deprived.

Try some valerian root or kava kava capsules. You should be able to find these where you can buy vitamins. You can ask a pharmacist (a chemist in the UK I think).

Essential oils Like lavender are very helpful too. Do a search for anxiety reducing essential oils. I bet because you are in the UK you probably have access to all sorts of teas. You will probably find many that can help ease anxiety.

Hope you are well soon.

Thanks cmd I'll take note of all that. Natural remedies rule as we all know.

Night everyone and thanks for the support, I really do appreciate it.