TC beyond Ni200: Nickel Purity, Dicodes; Ti, SS, Resistherm NiFe30; Coefficient of Resistance
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How do you decide between 2 wires that have almost identical flavor and vapor, I'm speaking of NiFe48 and Ti. I don't think I could tell the difference in a blind test of it. Weird one time I think I like the Ti others the NiFe. Very hard to tell. Will try the 2 more tomorrow.
At this point I have 5 different wire types to choose from: Ni200, Ti1, NiFe48, Nothal and SS430.
Personally, I've hit a "lazy point" and have gone so far as stuff Silika rope as wick in some of my latest builds. While cleaning one of my SS430 builds I left the wick in to see how it would handle having the coil glowing like a little heater - it had some black marks on it afterwards - silly thing is that the rope is easily removed and reinserted - I'll do that next time.
- Personally I like Ni200, its easy to work with and the gauges it almost forces you to use fall into the wire sizes I like. However for me it is one wick per coil. Very easy to hand wind non-contact coils.
- Ti1 offers a better resistance and decent TCR, the stuff I have is rather "springy" which is more difficult to work with. In my larger diameter wire builds rewicking is fairly easy. I've used Ti to rebuild Aspire BDC/BVC coil heads with some success. I use a screw to wind on or build contact coils and tweak with ceramic tweezers. IMHO some folks get way to excited about the oxides.
- The German NiFe48 is decent enough. Easy as Ni200 to work with but has higher resistance almost like Ti1 (and stiff like Ti1). I've let the coils I've built glow like little heaters. Easy to create non-contact coils. I've rewicked 26AWG build without any issues.
- Nothal - this stuff damaged my cutters. Hard as heck. Springy. I wound up one test coil and gave up on it. I did heat it up to glowing like a little heater. Still rock hard after abuse with torch and dry firing. (others did go on and actually use this type of wire with some success)
- SS430, for those of us that got in on the 'special' this was dirt cheap. 28AWG fits into the wire sizes I like to use and while not as stiff and hard as Nothal I use a screw for spaced coils and a coiler for contact coils. The coil ID will seemingly always grow when you let go of the winding. I've rewicked the 28AWG without deforming the coil. No issues with dry burning to glowing like a little heater.
Personally, I've hit a "lazy point" and have gone so far as stuff Silika rope as wick in some of my latest builds. While cleaning one of my SS430 builds I left the wick in to see how it would handle having the coil glowing like a little heater - it had some black marks on it afterwards - silly thing is that the rope is easily removed and reinserted - I'll do that next time.
Yes your right George
It was way past my beauty sleep time last night and as you guys can see I need it
I have done some digging today and with the same mass coils the lower ohm running buck will have longer battery life
How much will depend on the %efficiency of the board an as we know they don't exceed 90%
My mistake originally saying the higher ohm that would be boosting
To elaborate for those interested
In both modes [buck/boost] there will be heat loss [energy/power]
But to boost there is more work done and its not just component heat loss but also dissipation of power
The points of power loss [or shall we say wasted power] are powering the gates, switching transistors and gate capacitances when discharged
put a new build in my goblin mini. dual 26g nife48 2.4mm 6.5 wrap maybe? resistance settled at .121. 1 second preheat time, 100 watt preheat, punch set to 7. so far, this has been the most stable nife build to date.
on my vt200.
can someone tell me what the tick box marked "charge" under the battery section in DM is? 9.959wh's? is that how many wh's my device used, or how many wh's my battery took? or the remaining wh's of my battery?
can someone tell me what the tick box marked "charge" under the battery section in DM is? 9.959wh's? is that how many wh's my device used, or how many wh's my battery took? or the remaining wh's of my battery?
I think your actually right here assuming that both builds were operated with the same power level. The higher resistance build would force a single battery mod into boost and generate more wasted energy.
However I question why a user would want to drive a high ohm build at the same power level as the subohm build. With the right high ohm build the power needed can be just a fraction of what the subohm build requires for the same/similar vapor production.
Follow up to this post. Been vaping on the music wire since first post and all is well, have not had to rebuild. But today the iron binding wire arrived.
Here are the results of the .016 (~26 gauge) iron wire:
This is the wire:
It is available in many places and it comes in many sizes:
With a TCR of .005 that yields 83% sensitivity in the vaping range.
It is a lot easier to work with than the music wire or NI200 and doesn't cut as easy as the NI200 but easier than the music wire. Used a simple coil jig to wind the coil.
Clean with alcohol first then pulse at 360F before wicking yields very little smoke and no first puff foul taste.
Here are the csv contents:
"Temperature (degF)","Electrical Resistivity"
75,0.242
192,0.333
246,0.36
300,0.396
346,0.435
396,0.473
454,0.525
HTH
Here are the results of the .016 (~26 gauge) iron wire:
This is the wire:
It is available in many places and it comes in many sizes:
With a TCR of .005 that yields 83% sensitivity in the vaping range.
It is a lot easier to work with than the music wire or NI200 and doesn't cut as easy as the NI200 but easier than the music wire. Used a simple coil jig to wind the coil.
Clean with alcohol first then pulse at 360F before wicking yields very little smoke and no first puff foul taste.
Here are the csv contents:
"Temperature (degF)","Electrical Resistivity"
75,0.242
192,0.333
246,0.36
300,0.396
346,0.435
396,0.473
454,0.525
HTH
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So if I was to dry burn my Ti a little to get the gunk off what do you think would be a safe power in power mode on my SXM. I'm sure it won't work in TC mode because it will kick out the Dry Coil message.
on my yihi board devices i take it out of joule mode and set the wattage between 9-11 watts, then cup my hand over the coil while pulsing (to make it darker, to shade the coil from any light source to better see when it starts to glow) watching for no more than a dark red. i let it cool then strum to get off the crustys or if its a new coil, strum to make sure she's heating evenly. thats my process. spaced or contact, i always pulse to burn off any impurities i.e. machining oils, boogers, skin cells whatever. makes for a more stable coil IMO.
that's such a small change in resistance, that has to be janky as hell for temp controlling. is it even worth it? what's it look like in device monitor while you're vaping it? is the temp all over the place? can you post a screen shot of device mon while vaping this wire? if it actually works, i'll get a spool of 26g. im guessing it's super cheap for.
Isn't that a rather large change in resistance, all things considered? Nickel is like .006 or something, and SS430 is down in the .00138 range, from what I remember. It definitely checks the TCR box, just remains to see what it's like from a material safety standpoint.
???? Its a big change in R surely?!?! 0.005 is higher tcr than NiFe48...
Well, no it is not more janky or more all over the place than Ni200, neither was the music wire.
Here is Ni200 14 spaced wraps, 3.5mm coil:
Here is the iron wire 12 wraps, 3.5mm coil:
Both the music wire and iron wire vape fantastic just like Ni200 does.
Once the thermocouple, the actual test measurement device used to measure temperature for these tests ramped up, it never varied more than 1 degree.
The live monitor of resistance was the measuring device for resistance in these tests and both appeared to me to look similar to Ni200. Guess which one is which:
The iron and music wire both have more resistance per length than Ni200 (Ness engineering data) and greater temperature sensitivity in the vaping range a.k.a higher TCR (data from Steam Engine) than some:
SS304 20 %
SS316/L 17 %
SS430 28%
Ti 1 59%
Ti 2 57%
NiFe30 (Resistherm) 64%
NiFe30 (Stealthvape) 72%
NiFe (Reactorwire) 62%
Invar 24%
Nifethal70 73%
Nifethal52 62%
My tests showed:
Music wire 70%
This iron binding wire...83%
Ni200 (curve) being 100% and Ni200 (linear) being 79% according to steam engine.
Nickel DH shows more sensitivity in the vaping range than NI200 (curve) at 114% according to steam engine.
No, the change in resistance is not small, it is actually more than Ni200 as shown in the test data. That is because there are two primary components to a materials resistance. The resistivity of the material and the TCR. A higher TCR yields more resistance change over the same temperature change. A higher resistivity yields more resistance change over the same TCR. The resistivity of 18-8 Stainless Steel is 10 times higher than Nickel yet it's TCR is 6 times worse. The end result is the resistance changes more over the same temperature range with 18-8 than with Nickel, coil for coil. So if a Nickel coil base resistance is .1 ohms, the same dimension and wrap coil with 18-8 will be 1 ohms. The Nickel will change resistance by .06 ohms over 100C where the 18-8 will change by .1ohms. In other words, it changes resistance more.
I use the same method of sensitivity calculation as steam engine, a straight ratio. So, the tested TCR of iron divided by the Ness data TCR of nickel i.e. .005/.006 = 83%. But that doesn't tell the whole story. The resistivity of iron is 1.4 times that of nickel. Using the resistivity from Ness and the TCR equation again, a coil of the same dimensions and wraps of nickel is .1 ohms, of iron is .14 ohms, a delta-T of 100C yields .07 ohms change for iron and .06 ohms change for nickel. So actually, the iron resistance change is greater than the nickel resistance change given the same coil and temperature change - 116%.
The only reason I am looking into this is I am tired of attys that have binding posts (ala Billow, velocity) that cut the soft nickel wire, well they don't the music wire and not easily with this iron binding wire. But on screw head posts (ala Kayfun styles), I still use NI200. And yes the iron wire and music wire is inexpensive and widely available. But, it will rust. I just don't care.
I am not advising anyone to buy iron or music wire, or anything else. I have no stock or interest in any company, wire or otherwise. I'm just sharing what I have found. I will continue to use the iron and the music wire on those particularly nasty cut my wire attys until the first time it gives me reason not to, i.e. a bad vape experience.
HTH
Note: The so called iron wire does have a bit of spring to it, but it is still flexible, similar to Kanthal. Unlike the music wire which is full on spring high carbon steel and needs hardened cutters. Since using the DNA200, I have noticed a difference in vape between two different NI200 spools of 28 gauge, one from Lightning Vape the other from Master Of Clouds. I never noticed a difference in vape on the DNA40.
BTW, screens I am using ATM:
(just in case for no wire on hand. yet
(just in case for no wire on hand. yet
inspired by @balazsk but ended up using Ni profile here and gonna rename eventually for the TFR<=2.8X required for safe Ti oxidation looks doable in Ni mode where the max TFR=2.7
dont like, gonna rename too.
Some more work has yet to be done including TCR versions of the above. Unfortunately, I have managed not to save the working file when finished, so most of the layers are lost and I will need to start almost the whole lot again.
Some more work has yet to be done including TCR versions of the above. Unfortunately, I have managed not to save the working file when finished, so most of the layers are lost and I will need to start almost the whole lot again.
Yeah typo, corrected.
To upload into the DNA200 via Escribe software. Simply copy and paste into notepad and save as yourfilename.csv. Connect DNA200 to PC via USB, open Escribe, select coil material: custom, click on load csv, select the file you created, then click on upload settings to device.
The DNA200 will now have new data based on the comma separated values (.csv). The reward is a more accurate temperature limiting for the wire material. For example with the default Ni200 data loaded from the factory and using music wire, I had to reduce the vape temperature setting manually to get the same vape experience. Once the csv file is loaded, my tests show the vape temperature to be within 1 degree of set temperature.
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I don't really see any direct connection between ohms and vapour production on a regulated device for it is the wattage that produce the heat needed for vaporization.
and P[W=J/s]=V*I[V*A]
For R=V/I, I read it that on a regulated device the only difference between the difference ohm built is V-I ratio
Example:
1.,
P=10W
R=1ohm
Then:
P=V*I=V^2/R -> V=sqrt(p*R)=sqrt10=~3.16V and I=3.16A
2.,
P=10W
R=0.1ohm
Then:
P=V*I=V^2/R -> V=sqrt(p*R)=sqrt1=1V and I=10A
So, on the business end (output) it is all the same.
The input end is another question. It depends on the device and the power supply and their efficiency/discharge rating discussed above.
But even if we assume that the less work needed to convert the input to output the less loss we will see, any loss difference would still be far from yielding result as substantial as you described.
But that is just reading of the story
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