The Problem of Clones?

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druckle

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First I need to make it clear that I'm one of those folks who really values innovation in vaping gear. My very strong preference is to purchase those devices which demonstrate a new and clear innovative approach and to purchase them from the folks who did the hard work to create something that makes the vaping experience more convenient or more pleasurable.

Now for the facts. The last five devices I have had on my "lust list" have been basically "unobtanium". I searched for weeks for the opportunity to send my money to the people who created these devices and not one of them was available in anything other than super limited quantities which sold out within hours for each apparently small batch that was manufactured. I was always one of the unlucky people who missed the opportunity to spend my money supporting the people who did the innovation.

All five devices became available as clones within less than two months from their original introduction and were available in any quantity that one wished to purchase. Something is seriously wrong with this picture. Why would someone with a great idea and a great product, which has attracted the attention of a world wide vaping community, refuse to exploit his innovation by making it available for sale to the many folks who want to purchase it? The only answer I can come up with is that there's a lot of risk aversion going on. I believe money is always available to exploit a good idea if one has the guts to take the risk and do the hard work to find it. Lots of us who wish to support the "real thing" are left with no choice but to turn to those who have the guts to take the risk, meaning we have no choice but to buy the clones. This is a very sad situation.
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As much as I try to avoid clones I've had no choice. I want to raise a ton of hell blaming the cloners for exploiting the good ideas of others. I really do. Unfortunately I'm left waiting (not so patiently) for the next person with a great idea who actually wants to succeed and takes the risk necessary to do it.
 

autobiogphnation

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I don't think it's a matter of "risk" but rather costs/time. Some of the original creators are hand making these devices themselves and may not have the ability to mass produce on the scale that China can. At the same time too, there is a cost factor to any manufacturing process. perhaps they can only afford to make small quantities.
 

Hawaiian Nate

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In just a few minutes there's gonna be quite a few people posting and even posting links as to why you should settle for lower quality authentic mods that sells for $50-$100. I understand where your coming from. I've even had some guy try and direct me to a used authentic... Lol. It's not about the money in my case it's about the availability. #notaclone = #notavailable.
I also see your point on risk taking with making mods/attys, but if your first batch sells out and your second batch sells out then hey, you might wanna exploit your product, double or triple manufacturing and make some money.
 

samcm010

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First I need to make it clear that I'm one of those folks who really values innovation in vaping gear. My very strong preference is to purchase those devices which demonstrate a new and clear innovative approach and to purchase them from the folks who did the hard work to create something that makes the vaping experience more convenient or more pleasurable.

Now for the facts. The last five devices I have had on my "lust list" have been basically "unobtanium". I searched for weeks for the opportunity to send my money to the people who created these devices and not one of them was available in anything other than super limited quantities which sold out within hours for each apparently small batch that was manufactured. I was always one of the unlucky people who missed the opportunity to spend my money supporting the people who did the innovation.

All five devices became available as clones within less than two months from their original introduction and were available in any quantity that one wished to purchase. Something is seriously wrong with this picture. Why would someone with a great idea and a great product, which has attracted the attention of a world wide vaping community, refuse to exploit his innovation by making it available for sale to the many folks who want to purchase it? The only answer I can come up with is that there's a lot of risk aversion going on. I believe money is always available to exploit a good idea if one has the guts to take the risk and do the hard work to find it. Lots of us who wish to support the "real thing" are left with no choice but to turn to those who have the guts to take the risk, meaning we have no choice but to buy the clones. This is a very sad situation.
.
As much as I try to avoid clones I've had no choice. I want to raise a ton of hell blaming the cloners for exploiting the good ideas of others. I really do. Unfortunately I'm left waiting (not so patiently) for the next person with a great idea who actually wants to succeed and takes the risk necessary to do it.
When you get verified on here check out the Classifieds you may just find the mods on your lust list and for less than RRP. Good luck with your search I hope you eventually find what you are looking for.
 

TheJakeBailey

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As much as I try to avoid clones I've had no choice. I want to raise a ton of hell blaming the cloners for exploiting the good ideas of others. I really do. Unfortunately I'm left waiting (not so patiently) for the next person with a great idea who actually wants to succeed and takes the risk necessary to do it.

Really? No choice?

I don't care if you buy a clone or not. It's the constant excuses that drive me up the wall. We all have choices. Nobody put a gun to your head and said "You must purchase this particular mod by 3pm on Friday." If you want to complain about availability, you may have a valid point. But you can't say you "had no choice."
 

dr g

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I don't think it's a matter of "risk" but rather costs/time. Some of the original creators are hand making these devices themselves and may not have the ability to mass produce on the scale that China can. At the same time too, there is a cost factor to any manufacturing process. perhaps they can only afford to make small quantities.

It's both of them. In house production is the lower risk option but costs more and takes longer per unit. Outsourced production requires larger upfront capital and represents larger risk. So that's why they are hard to get and makers aren't necessarily eager to expand.

You always have a choice. The only question is the strength of your convictions. I ain't preaching', but please don't play the "I had no choice" card.

This also. You don't *have* to own any non-essential item, and wants never justify illegal or unethical actions.
 

Hawaiian Nate

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It's both of them. In house production is the lower risk option but costs more and takes longer per unit. Outsourced production requires larger upfront capital and represents larger risk. So that's why they are hard to get and makers aren't necessarily eager to expand.

I understand this for smaller operations but even so, if every batch you come out with sells out within hours of listing, wouldn't you believe that it's time to take the leap and expand the business? I assume that some mod makers don't do this because they want their mod to be "mystic-like". I'd rather make more money but that's just my opinion.
 

druckle

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To me it's a simple matter of supply and demand. If the demand is huge the market will always drift to those who choose to supply. I'm not sure what mention of illegality relates to. i there is no patentability or no effort to patent, or no registered trademark then I'm not sure what issues there are in law. Personally I think it's unethical to use an originators logo/device name and I would avoid a device that did that although I think that's purely an ethical issue most times and not a legal one.

Moral choice is an entirely separate issue. Hitting on your buddy's girlfriend is not illegal but it's definitely something most of us don't want to do. Buying a clone might be a little like that but if there were no other girl available in the world with her qualities then it might be a little more understandable albeit potentially dangerous. :)
 
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