The Vmod XL 18650 Bottom Feeding Mod from Vapage - Part 2

[ukeman]

wait a minute; i can't tell if that is from the top or bottom....
i don't have my XL with me inside the house...

If you take the alum. casing off, and look right above the bottle collar on the right side of the photo, where it's cut off, right below that is where mine had a crack.QUOTE=MastiffMike;6209634]

[/QUOTE]

 

[MastiffMike]

Mine doesn't have a gap like that, screw the black collar down tighter and it should close up. Their are air holes in the actual collar.

If I screw it down tighter it just bends/warps the metal since the bottom of the cover is all the way down (it's tight against the bottom plate). It's interesting though because ALL of my VMods have that slot gap! That's why I thought it was intentional.

Anyone else care to chime in on gap/no-gap?

 

[MastiffMike]

wait a minute; i can't tell if that is from the top or bottom....
i don't have my XL with me inside the house...

[/QUOTE]

The picture is from the bottom plate looking up into where the bottle attaches.

 

[YoMa!]

You could try the screwdriver handle mod but I'm not responsible if you do.

 

[Chief Thunder]

Screwdriver handle mod?

 

[YoMa!]

I broke mine and used a screwdriver handle to hammer a part back in. I don't necessarily recommend it.

 

[Fernand]

Just a note on 357 life. I just checked and this atty HAS been in constant use for 12 weeks. It had started spitting more and being capricious a couple of days ago. I took it off for rinsing under hot water tap, then soaked in 95% ethanol, then let it drip out and evaporate, then did a dry-burn at 3.2 volts (on an eGo Twist battery). It's back in service and back to being smooth. And the taste is so wonderful. Yes, they do spoil you, I'm not a "fanboy", it's just that nothing I tried as a temp replacement, IKV 1.8, i06, Vapage Hybrid, etc, none of them are as flavorful, and none actually make as thick and fine a vapor. I'm convinced it's the many turns close together on a specific wick that creates fine droplets. When you think about it, at the microscopic level, a typical LR 3 winding coil has the (few) wire wraps so far apart, it's basically a big isolated hot wire on the wick, it doesn't form a grid. In the 357, once the wire has baked with juice residue, it forms a solid unit, with the wraps actually touching. Very different machine. The crust should not be scraped off, it's like a charcoal filter, and it's (also) the easiest way to kill it.

As far as longevity factors go, I don't know, but I never depress the button for more than 5 seconds, usually 2 seconds, because it's not necessary, the vapor just billows right away. If it's feeding correctly, after pressing the button, I wait half a second and start to draw, total on-time: 2 seconds, 3 max. Oops, feeling queasy, nic OD, and that's at 8 mg/ml. The bugger's very efficient.

@Mastiff, the gap seems to do nothing. You can block it and nothing changes, which makes sense as the chimney seals the chamber.

 

[Andy Thatcher]

Counting down the days till June 9th when I will get my mitts on a couple perhaps three.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2

 

[ukeman]

I always get a lot out of your posts Fernand... thanks.
I've been hooked on HH357 for about a month now and i have to say, everything I have been learning regarding finding the best vape for me has settled since finding these.
What has changed is my perspective:
APV's are merely power delivery sources... no more. Regardless of the design, some more advanced or efficient, it all stops at the connector and from there, at the atomizer, comes the variations in vape quality/value.
If you want true voltage or watts, regulated, variable, or waning as the battery charge drops, we've got it.

IMO atomizer design is where potential for real value has been overlooked. Qulaity of vape today can be "so so" or "improved", as is the case with the HH357 (and the AVA imo, and different from the 357).

I am surprised that there is not more "fireworks" among veteran ecf posters regarding HH357's.
Not only is this discovery of Hanna's atomizers the biggest thing in vaping to date IMO, but I now realize I have little use for the multiple VV APV's i have.
{In spite of warnings even on AVID's site not to use eGo or such batts, I've had an LR 357 on my either Joye 3.3 regulated eGo, and a Joye 18650 Joye eGo, for a month, and any good "3.7" mod will do.}

For me it seems to take a little more expertise to work them on the XL or other bottom feeder so far, so I've settled with the Aero and the i06 1.5 LR's. But it's worth a second look.

Regarding your instructions on inhale and button press: Thanks for your insight on just how that works.

So far I have not gotten more than 4 weeks out of mine, and I am not as disciplined nor insightful as you are.
My normal vape is more drawn out; about 4 or 5 seconds inhale, and holding about 6 or 7 + seconds.
I will try to be aware of the time pressing the button factor, which requires shorter button presses and more focused inhale.

Just a note on 357 life. I just checked and this atty HAS been in constant use for 12 weeks. It had started spitting more and being capricious a couple of days ago. I took it off for rinsing under hot water tap, then soaked in 95% ethanol, then let it drip out and evaporate, then did a dry-burn at 3.2 volts (on an eGo Twist battery). It's back in service and back to being smooth. And the taste is so wonderful. Yes, they do spoil you, I'm not a "fanboy", it's just that nothing I tried as a temp replacement, IKV 1.8, i06, Vapage Hybrid, etc, none of them are as flavorful, and none actually make as thick and fine a vapor. I'm convinced it's the many turns close together on a specific wick that creates fine droplets. When you think about it, at the microscopic level, a typical LR 3 winding coil has the (few) wire wraps so far apart, it's basically a big isolated hot wire on the wick, it doesn't form a grid. In the 357, once the wire has baked with juice residue, it forms a solid unit, with the wraps actually touching. Very different machine. The crust should not be scraped off, it's like a charcoal filter, and it's (also) the easiest way to kill it.

As far as longevity factors go, I don't know, but I never depress the button for more than 5 seconds, usually 2 seconds, because it's not necessary, the vapor just billows right away. If it's feeding correctly, after pressing the button, I wait half a second and start to draw, total on-time: 2 seconds, 3 max. Oops, feeling queasy, nic OD, and that's at 8 mg/ml. The bugger's very efficient.

@Mastiff, the gap seems to do nothing. You can block it and nothing changes, which makes sense as the chimney seals the chamber.

 

[MastiffMike]

Interesting explanation Frenand!

Word from the rumor mill is that there's a manufacturer who's VERY close to releasing (2ml?) cartos that use a heating "grid"or "plate" instead of a coil. My understanding (bear in mind I was wrong once before back in 1974) is that it'll hit the market in the next 3-4 weeks. Since it's a carto and not an atty it's not really for the VMod but it'll be interesting to see how it performs compared to other more traditional coils.

 

[Fernand]

Cartos work fine in the VMod. I use Boges and Resurrectors on occasion, it's a change. The Boges gum up in a couple of days and lose that "freshness", but the Resurrectors last a little longer.

Yeah, of course that German cat's work on the Genisis shows the crucial role of the "mesh". He plotted vapor "throat hit" vs. resistance wire diameter and mesh size of the stainless steel mesh he uses for the wick. It's obvious, imagine yourself at the scale where the wire is like 2 stories tall, that a loosely wound coil is JUST a fat hot wire on a bunch of silica ropes, the vapor is going to be large droplets. If you bring the wires close together and cover them with a carbon shell, you create a very different vaporizing "engine". That's what HH has done. The breaking in is while the wire oxidizes and then gets encrusted with carbon from the burned juice. His wire is critical, being lower resistance, so he winds like 9 turns and still comes up with 1.5 ohms. You might be able to do the same at a higher voltage with a well made HR atty, since the atty will have more windings than the typical pathetic 3 winding LR atty, hence of necessity being packed closer together.

@Uke I'm with you on mostly sticking to a simple 3.7 volt source and adjusting the atty, not the battery, when you can find good LR atties like the 357. In all the time I've had my Provari I barely use it, and if I do, I mostly run it around 3.8-4 volts. I like the eGo twist because you can touch up the voltage on the fly so easily, say for cartos or the "star" clearos. The whole premise of the Darwin and the Kick, being that you can just set a wattage, not have to change it often, and be able to just swap cartos/atties, is just plain wrong. Even at the same resistance, no two devices will be optimal at the same wattage, and will have a different range of usable wattage.

I'd get into rolling my own atty, like a Genisis, but frankly I've got better things to do. There's going to be hot development in the atomizer field for sure, as soon as the big players get in the game.

 

[ukeman]

I hope you're right about "big players" getting in....
Yes, that 3 wrap wire for LR Genesis doesn't ever match the flavor of the many (9) wrap LR 357. I forgot to mention that is what caught my eye in your earlier post... At least in my experience with Genesis AND the GG attys.

Cartos work fine in the VMod. I use Boges and Resurrectors on occasion, it's a change. The Boges gum up in a couple of days and lose that "freshness", but the Resurrectors last a little longer.

Yeah, of course that German cat's work on the Genisis shows the crucial role of the "mesh". He plotted vapor "throat hit" vs. resistance wire diameter and mesh size of the stainless steel mesh he uses for the wick. It's obvious, imagine yourself at the scale where the wire is like 2 stories tall, that a loosely wound coil is JUST a fat hot wire on a bunch of silica ropes, the vapor is going to be large droplets. If you bring the wires close together and cover them with a carbon shell, you create a very different vaporizing "engine". That's what HH has done. The breaking in is while the wire oxidizes and then gets encrusted with carbon from the burned juice. His wire is critical, being lower resistance, so he winds like 9 turns and still comes up with 1.5 ohms. You might be able to do the same at a higher voltage with a well made HR atty, since the atty will have more windings than the typical pathetic 3 winding LR atty, hence of necessity being packed closer together.

@Uke I'm with you on mostly sticking to a simple 3.7 volt source and adjusting the atty, not the battery, when you can find good LR atties like the 357. In all the time I've had my Provari I barely use it, and if I do, I mostly run it around 3.8-4 volts. I like the eGo twist because you can touch up the voltage on the fly so easily, say for cartos or the "star" clearos. The whole premise of the Darwin and the Kick, being that you can just set a wattage, not have to change it often, and be able to just swap cartos/atties, is just plain wrong. Even at the same resistance, no two devices will be optimal at the same wattage, and will have a different range of usable wattage.

I'd get into rolling my own atty, like a Genisis, but frankly I've got better things to do. There's going to be hot development in the atomizer field for sure, as soon as the big players get in the game.

 

[MastiffMike]

The carto I've heard is coming though is ego sized and thus won't fit. I'm not sure if a more standard diameter carto with grid/plate will be available at the same time or not. If it works well though I'm sure they'll make it in that form factor since the manufacturer makes other products/cartos that size.

To me one of the big advantages of the VMod is that you get the benefits of dripping in an atty without the hassle, all while having a capacity larger than a tank!

But I may have to try making a new "continious" coil for one of my viva nova heads and see how that works on the VMod. Then again, I'm very happy with the performance of the VMod right-out-of-the-box so messing with the atty it's pretty far down my list of priorities.

 

[Andy Thatcher]

Fiddly, really irritating music, but interesting modular concept could be developed.

The TerroX mod. - YouTube

 

[Synnuh]

Has anyone found a good fix for the airy draw on the VMods? I just got an XL in, and am getting a nice vapor, but absolutely zero throat hit, and what feels like too much air getting in. I've tried the Hybrid, Silo, and Boge 2.0's. The Hybrid seems to reduce it the most, then the Silo, with the Boges being super, super airy.

I replaced the o-ring on the chimney because I busted the one that came on it last night, and it seemed to help, some. I know I am getting better flavor and more vapor than what I got on my Ego, but the throat hit on the Ego is what I am after. It's giving me enough vapor that I'm actually getting a head buzz after pulling on it a few times. Is the throat hit just not possible with this mod? I'm using 50/50 18mg in both the Ego and the VMod, but for the life of me I just can't get a throat hit at all. Even double and triple pulling on it won't give me a TH.

I tried searching for "airy draw vmod" and just found people talking about it happening on the VMod, with only a couple people talking about fixes. Any help out there? I appreciate any help or guidance I can get to fixing this issue.

 

[Chief Thunder]

Get yourself a Cisco atty from avidvapor.com. Best investment I have made for my vmod

 

[Synnuh]

Are you talking about the Cisco Spec, HH.357 or the Aero's?

I just tried mucking with it some more. I tightened down the chimney as much as I could without stripping the threads, then tightened down the atty til it felt as tight as I could get it without busting it. I took the tip off of a CE2 clearo and put it onto the atty. The tip is a soft silicon style with a much smaller opening than the drip tip that came with the mod. It is helping a bit more, but it's still not what I'm looking for. ;/

 

[MastiffMike]

Synnuh, I'm no VMod expert so ignore my suggestion if it's dumb....

Have you tried temporarily covering the air holes to see if that makes a difference for you? I ask because that might give an indication of what a tighter draw TH is like or if there's an air leak somewhere that can/should be fixed.

 

[Fernand]

Assuming the battery doesn't restrict airflow, and I'd rather it didn't, and if we can agree the vmod is just a fancy battery, with a bottom feed, then it's all up to the atomizer, isn't it? So don't blame the messenger, find yourself the atomizer you crave. If you like a tight draw, the IKV atties have a peculiarity, which is that they cannot draw air from the bottom, only the side pinholes on the 510 connector. In a Vmod that translates to tight as a marsupial rectum. In fact you just about have to remove the inner o-ring. And you clearly want more heat. So maybe a 1.5 ohm IKV 510 atty will give you joy. Their iO6 provides the additional pleasure of messing with the 306 drip tip issue, making it adjustable on the entire continuum between a brick and straw.

 

[Scottinboca]

Just FYI, I put up one of my Vmod XL's in the classies.