Titanium wires
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Thankyou very much for being concerned and also for the quick reply.
can you tell me what VIR is?
I looked on USA seller FMS website and they show a picture for Ti Gr1 wire. It is not for sale yet. But... Is this the real wire that we can use for VIR?
What Gauge Titanium Wire do you think will be the most popular 26 G 24 G 28 G 30 G I have a lead for a Canadian supplier but I sure they want to sell large quantity's.
I use 0.25mm - 30G and no thicker.
It gives better taste and saves battery energy
It gives better taste and saves battery energy
When it comes to the smaller batteries used for Proteus, the smaller Ti wire will save on power.
Hi guys.
Lately I have been reading some worrying reports on Ti wires.
Check this for example:
Titanium wires for vaping
Just check the pictures, I mean...
One excerpt:
Dr Farsalinos states: “First of all, titanium dioxide was probably used as a food colouring. It is really unfortunate that there are companies using food colourings in their products. These substances have NEVER been tested for inhalation, do not offer anything in terms of flavour or experience to the vaper and are only used for aesthetic purposes (if there is any real reason for making the liquid more colourful). Using something that has never been tested for inhalation purposes in order just to make the e-liquid 'look better' is AT LEAST an irresponsible behaviour. Using food colourings introduces an unknown, potentially dangerous factor, for absolutely no reason. It does not promote the experience and pleasure perceived by consumers. For titanium dioxide, it is officially classified as a probable carcinogen when inhaled.
So while obviously we are not talking about adding TiO2 to our eliquids here, the apparent ease of formation of the oxide is scary at least.
At the same time Farsalinos is working with VIR, which only accepts Ti wires, and warned us about Kanthal and Nichrome producing potentially inhalable oxides when heated.
Actually it seems at least curious to me that nobody here using Ti reported similar phenomena, so maybe the nature of the material referred to in that post is questionable; still, Farsalino's quote bothers me.
So...thoughts?
Lately I have been reading some worrying reports on Ti wires.
Check this for example:
Titanium wires for vaping
Just check the pictures, I mean...
One excerpt:
Dr Farsalinos states: “First of all, titanium dioxide was probably used as a food colouring. It is really unfortunate that there are companies using food colourings in their products. These substances have NEVER been tested for inhalation, do not offer anything in terms of flavour or experience to the vaper and are only used for aesthetic purposes (if there is any real reason for making the liquid more colourful). Using something that has never been tested for inhalation purposes in order just to make the e-liquid 'look better' is AT LEAST an irresponsible behaviour. Using food colourings introduces an unknown, potentially dangerous factor, for absolutely no reason. It does not promote the experience and pleasure perceived by consumers. For titanium dioxide, it is officially classified as a probable carcinogen when inhaled.
So while obviously we are not talking about adding TiO2 to our eliquids here, the apparent ease of formation of the oxide is scary at least.
At the same time Farsalinos is working with VIR, which only accepts Ti wires, and warned us about Kanthal and Nichrome producing potentially inhalable oxides when heated.
Actually it seems at least curious to me that nobody here using Ti reported similar phenomena, so maybe the nature of the material referred to in that post is questionable; still, Farsalino's quote bothers me.
So...thoughts?
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All metals used for coils will form a an oxide layer. This is what protects the underlying metal from further oxidation. The question is, does the oxide layer adhere strongly to the underlying metal and stay put, or does it end up in the vapor stream? One way way to make some indirect judgements about this is to use a coil for a long period of time and observe whether its resistance increases. If it increases, that's probably a sign that metal from the coil is turning into oxides, which in turn indicates that the original oxide layer isn't staying in place on the coil, protecting the underlying metal. However, if the resistance of the coil remains the same over long periods of use, I take that as an indication that the protective oxide layer is stable and not going anywhere. And that's precisely my experience with Grade 1 Titanium on a DNA40 -- the resistance of a coil is very stable over several months and several hundred milliliters of juice.
Good analysis Rossum. But does that mean there is titanium oxide on your wire?
Sure. Bare titanium forms a thin, passive layer of oxide the moment it's exposed to air. Every coil material we use does this. With Kanthal, it's aluminum oxide, and it's pretty thick. With nichrome, it's a chromium oxide, but I'm not certain which one.
As Imeo have said a lot of times:
We just have to remember to not leave the coil to get red hot, as it accelerates the oxidation process. Am I right?
Actually until there's at least one scientific study done on coils by someone such as Dr. Farsalinos, we don't really know what's safe enough. It might be that even if you torch your Kanthal or Titanium, it doesn't expose you enough to anything harmful at the point of it being toxic.
That being said, until such a study has been completed, it is safer if you just refrain from heating up or torching your coils at any time.
"Safe enough" for what purpose? Even with torched kanthal that's been dry-burned numerous times, I believe we've eliminated 95% or more of the the risks we took when we were smoking. That's good enough for me. Now I'm focused on what gives me the best vape with the least hassle. But you know, I eat grilled meat too. Is that "Safe enough"?
Eating grilled meat every single day is definitely not best practice. Is it safe enough? It depends... but it's definitely not advised. Obviously even torched Kanthal is much better than smoking but we still need some solid numbers to back it up. Maybe vaping like this on a day to day basis is not toxic but what about 30 years down the line?"Safe enough" for what purpose? Even with torched kanthal that's been dry-burned numerous times, I believe we've eliminated 95% or more of the the risks we took when we were smoking. That's good enough for me. Now I'm focused on what gives me the best vape with the least hassle. But you know, I eat grilled meat too. Is that "Safe enough"?
Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see some real studies on different coil materials. In fact, if you look back far enough, I believe in this very thread, I offered to contribute several thousand Euros toward such a study by Dr. F. That offer still stands. But until we see actual evidence rather than speculation, I'll vape what gives me the best vape. Without temperature limiting, that's Kanthal. With temperature limiting, that's titanium.
We're in agreement, although I prefer to vape the ESG titanium alloy.
Does ESG work in temperature mode? Sorry if this has been answered before. I believe it doesn't or at least mine (which I think is ESG) put my wick in flames at 200F.
Thx
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Thx
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
It didn't work for me either. I suspect the TCR is too low, something which is pretty much expected for an alloy.
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