FDA TVECA post table of contents for Deeming Final Rule

[Kent C]

Well, I, for one, am very happy that the FDA is concerned about the deterioration of my atties!

... that they're going to ban

 

[Katya]

... that they're going to ban

Picky, picky....

 

[Jman8]

<snip>
.....those of us that live in the Northern half of the United States should be dropping like flies.
Your basic portable electronic space heater is a giant heating coil made out of similar or exactly
the same materials as the coils we use in e-cigs. There is no related heath issues that I am aware of
by using space heaters regarding the absorption of any metals. In the winter these are run 24/7
depending on the requirements needed.<snip>

Using one right now. Warmth is good.

 

[MacTechVpr]

I think any good cook knows not to make things too acid. Now if we could just get a decent polycarbonate bell cap. That would be something!

Goodluck.

 

[MacTechVpr]

Using one right now. Warmth is good.

Cough..cough. Dust magnets! Yikes.

 

[v3nom151]

I will take these comments and give one response. If there was any potential harm concerning heating coils
those of us that live in the Northern half of the United States should be dropping like flies.
Your basic portable electronic space heater is a giant heating coil made out of similar or exactly
the same materials as the coils we use in e-cigs. There is no related heath issues that I am aware of
by using space heaters regarding the absorption of any metals. In the winter these are run 24/7
depending on the requirements needed.
In other words, explain to me why I have to have an advanced science degree to understand
this BS.

Regards
Mike

But, you're not vaporizing an acidic solution on your space heater element. Are you?

 

[Jman8]

But, you're not vaporizing an acidic solution on your space heater element. Are you?

You're not the boss of me.

Er, I mean, of course not!

 

[Rossum]

But, you're not vaporizing an acidic solution on your space heater element. Are you?

This past summer, I tested a bunch of commercial e-juices using pH paper, including some citrus flavored ones, and every last one of them (except Juul's) tested alkaline, I believe due to the "free base" nicotine.

Edit/PS:

 

[v3nom151]

The Ph balance argument has gone too far. It also has to do with the lungs absorption of the vaporized solution and there is talks about the use of levorotatory nicotine. Take this info how you like, to each their own.

 

[skoony]

But, you're not vaporizing an acidic solution on your space heater element. Are you?

But we have been using these glorified vaping coils to heat are homes and everything in them
since at least the 1920's. No acidic solutions of anything in the home or workplace as been tagged
yet. I suppose it couldn't be because there's nothing going on there.

Regards
Mike

 

[Katya]

This past summer, I tested a bunch of commercial e-juices using pH paper, including some citrus flavored ones, and every last one of them (except Juul's) tested alkaline, I believe due to the "free base" nicotine.

Healthy Mouth & Lung pH & E-Juice

"I saw your other posting on your concerns about pH in juices. I'm not so sure this is a very important issue. I don't know about other producers, but Adam at vtvapor.com adds a little citric acid to his VG-only 35 mg unflavored juice, which is the base for his other flavored juices. Citric acid is necessary to turn nicotine, an amine base, into a more water-soluble and less stinky ammonium salt. So this could be the source of the slightly lower pH in the juice you analyzed with pH paper...which actually may not be accurate since pH is a water property, and juices are primarily PG or VG with only a little water or ethanol."

 

[Katya]

The Ph balance argument has gone too far.

Right.

It also has to do with the lungs absorption of the vaporized solution and there is talks about the use of levorotatory nicotine. Take this info how you like, to each their own.

Say what???? What kind of talks?

More information on the subject, just in case...

"L" and "D" Nicotine

 

[v3nom151]

I'm not talking about using a space heater within the confines of a home. I'm talking about vaporizing a liquid and it's effects on the metal coils and materials that the atomizer is machined from. It might just be a bunch of BS, but this has caused it to become a topic of mention.

 

[englishmick]

If you had information that's contradicts my previous statement, please post it. I just think it makes sense if you consider all aspects of e-liquid and what goes into it. An acidic solution can cause metals to deteriorate. This ultimately comes down to what the atomizer is made of, and how it reacts to a potentially acidic e-liquid. This may happen in an extremely slow process, but happens nonetheless.

I'm not a chemist so I have no competence to evaluate this as true or false. But it sounds like stainless steel and pyrex versus orange juice. We know it messes with some forms of plastic, but stainless? I could maybe see a problem with coil metal, but coils aren't going to be in there for very long. Has there been any actual testing done on this, or is it just someone's theory?

 

[v3nom151]

Right.



Say what???? What kind of talks?

More information on the subject, just in case...

"L" and "D" Nicotine

"L", Levorotatory nicotine came up in a discussion regarding possible e-liquid manufacturing in the future.

 

[Kent C]

Healthy Mouth & Lung pH & E-Juice

"pH is a water property, and juices are primarily PG or VG with only a little water or ethanol."

Hard to argue with Kurt on chemistry but while water has a ph property (ie is the 'neutral' standard' of pH), neither acid or base, many liquids have pH properties. Baby shampoo "no more tears" for example has neutral pH so as not to 'make' the eyes hurt, but hair prefers different pH.

 

[v3nom151]

I'm not a chemist so I have no competence to evaluate this as true or false. But it sounds like stainless steel and pyrex versus orange juice. We know it messes with some forms of plastic, but stainless? I could maybe see a problem with coil metal, but coils aren't going to be in there for very long. Has there been any actual testing done on this, or is it just someone's theory?

I haven't seen it tested yet. I'd like to though.

 

[rhelton]

This past summer, I tested a bunch of commercial e-juices using pH paper, including some citrus flavored ones, and every last one of them (except Juul's) tested alkaline, I believe due to the "free base" nicotine.

Edit/PS:

Below 6 is a issue right? I think bellow that metal will start to corrode I think that would be the main concern.

 

[Katya]

"L", Levorotatory nicotine came up in a discussion regarding possible e-liquid manufacturing in the future.

In the future?????

Did you look at the discussion I linked above?

Per DVap--one of our resident chemists:

"Production-wise, the naturally occurring (L),(-),(S)-nicotine is what we get and what we use. Purification of this stereoisomer from tobacco is relatively easy and cheap.

Racemic nicotine (DL),(RS),(±)-nicotine, is available in mg quantities for a hefty price.

The purified non-natural stereoisomer (D),(+),(R)-nicotine is typically found only in research settings, and the price is out of this world."

 

[Katya]

Hard to argue with Kurt on chemistry but while water has a ph property (ie is the 'neutral' standard' of pH), neither acid or base, many liquids have pH properties. Baby shampoo "no more tears" for example has neutral pH so as not to 'make' the eyes hurt, but hair prefers different pH.

Not arguing--just linked his post (and the thread) as an example of an interesting discussion of pH in e-liquids--nothing else.

And I expanded Kurt's quote in my post to avoid confusion...