Variable Voltage and Patent

[AlmightyGod]

I have no intention of forcing anybody out of business , `Licences only make sense if they work for both parties involved .

Please elaborate on what you mean by this quote in regards to the post in which you were referring. Intentions vs Actions often mean different things to different people. How are your licenses going to work? Profit based? Unit based? Some VV units cost $100, while others are $200, but both may have the same margins. Some producers may sell 50 per year, while others sell 50 per month.

 

[netbususer]

Please elaborate on what you mean by this quote in regards to the post in which you were referring. Intentions vs Actions often mean different things to different people. How are your licenses going to work? Profit based? Unit based? Some VV units cost $100, while others are $200, but both may have the same margins. Some producers may sell 50 per year, while others sell 50 per month.

I believe that it would be up to him what he decides to charge for a license on a case by case basis. Assaulting him with questions about intentions and plans is really meaningless at this point. Everything will be determined by the granting or denial of the patent and then determined by the courts from there if it is challenged.

Wishing you the best, Mike.

 

[BuzzKill]

Please elaborate on what you mean by this quote in regards to the post in which you were referring. Intentions vs Actions often mean different things to different people. How are your licenses going to work? Profit based? Unit based? Some VV units cost $100, while others are $200, but both may have the same margins. Some producers may sell 50 per year, while others sell 50 per month.

We have not determined that yet , it is still in the process , also this will be dealt with on a case by case basis

 

[BuzzKill]

Apparently this got moved here by the mods ???? not sure why but I contacted them to move it back .

 

[AngusATAT]

Apparently this got moved here by the mods ???? not sure why but I contacted them to move it back .

I posted why. You aren't allowed to talk about business in the forum this was posted in. It was either move the thread, or delete half of it.

If you would rather that I go the delete route, let me know.

 

[BuzzKill]

I posted why. You aren't allowed to talk about business in the forum this was posted in. It was either move the thread, or delete half of it.

If you would rather that I go the delete route, let me know.

I must have missed your post on WHY Angus , sorry no biggie , I did not know that no business discussions were not allowed in the general forum , I better read the rules again !

 

[BuzzKill]

7 years in patent law. These days, I use my electro-mechanical skills to put food on the table, but that doesn't mean I've forgotten. If you're going to ask licensing fees to use someone elses art even in a device they never could have imagined it being used, it doesn't make their art yours. Best case scenario, you're splitting license fees with whomever holds rights to trim pots and voltage regulators (RCA and GM, probably). Worst case, RCA figures out you used their art for profit in a manufacturing process without paying them licensing fees... An idea on paper is very different than an idea that actually made it to manufacturing.

Again, more power to you. I hope you are successful. I don't know your time line (you said your app went in a year ago, but I have no idea when you began selling your devices nor when or if you discussed your idea in public), but you'll want to cover your ... as much as possible if you gave away your idea by sales or public discussion before the app went in. More so if anyone on any public forum helped you or made suggestions you tried out or that actually made it in to any production design.

Six maybe you missed the point, this is the application of variable voltage in a PV , because a pot exists has no bearing on it , it is the unique combination that is patent-able NOT the POT ! or the regulator BUT put them together and they are a patent-able device.

I have been doing this a long time and hold 10 patents many just like this one and they have proven to be very sturdy and enforceable.

Here is a quick list from the USPTO


PAT. NO. Title
1 7,461,415 Method and apparatus for automatically lifting a cover
2 6,989,895 Automated fiber optic inspection system
3 6,954,262 Automated fiber optic inspection system
4 6,454,631 Polishing apparatus and method
5 6,428,391 Method and apparatus for polishing
6 6,302,763 Apparatus for polishing
7 6,190,239 Polishing method using two stage members
8 6,183,343 Polishing apparatus with defined pattern
9 5,947,797 Computer-controlled method for polishing
10 5,319,734 Fiber optic attenuator

 

[MickeyRat]

I hope if Mike is successful in obtaining this patent is that he works out reasonable deals with the people who are currently making VV PVs. There are a lot of great people associated with the PV industry & ECF. These guys deserve a fair deal that will still allow them to produce their PVs without forcing them out of business. I think that is what we are all really worried about. Texas Instruments is making money from all the VV circuits. If the Patent office & the courts rule that Mike has a claim, then he should make something too. It's when greed takes over...that's my biggest concern. I hope that doesn't happen.

The point I was making is that no one is likely to give Mike a dime nor should they. The reason is he hasn't done anything new. He used a standard technique to apply VV to a unique product and he wasn't even the first to apply VV to that product. He neither invented the technique nor invented the product nor invented applying VV to that product. He just happened to be the first to apply this particular standard VV method to this particular product. He can go for the patent and he can go to protect the patent. More than likely all he will accomplish is to piss a lot of his customers off by driving small mod suppliers out of the business and eventually lose his .... in court. Getting the patent is the easy part. Making it stand up in court is tough. This one probably won't.

I actually was thinking about buying the new buzz that's supposed to be adjusted without a screwdriver assuming that I like the cheapie madvapes VV that I just ordered which will likely become more expensive or disappear altogether, if Mike gets his way. That's one that's off my list now. I'm pretty sure I won't be the only one.

 

[MasterofChaos]

Several important points about this patent application:

1 - Applying for a patent and getting it are two different things. It will take YEARS to get approved, assuming it ever is, which I think is doubtful. In the mean time, Buzzkill, you can troll and threaten manufacturers all you want, but noone has to pay you a cent.

2 - To argue against this patent, all you have to do is find a public disclosure of someone suggesting using VV for E-cigs or a PV earlier than 1 year before the patent application. That doesn't seem like something that would be very difficult to find to me. Also, I`m not sure when you announced the VV Buzz, but it better have been less than one year before the patent application.

3 - You argue about protecting your IP, your business and all that. That is total BS. If that was your intent, you would have applied for the patent BEFORE you released your device. That`s how companies who deal with IP all the time operate. The fact that you are applying for the patent much later (after VV has taken off in the industry) shows you to be nothing but a troll. You are trying to get everyone to pay to go through a door long after all the the cows have left the barn.

4 - You are using the ECF to compile a list of trolling targets. You petitioned the ECF membership to supply you with manufacturers you can threaten, without telling them that's what you were doing. That is very bad form, to the point of being creepy. If you had posted a thread which said "Please give me a list of manufacturers so I can send them threatening letters and sue them" I bet you wouldn't have gotten many replies, huh.

 

[alldayvape]

 

[Wharf Rat]

WOW, I did not know we have sooo many legal scholors on ecf !!!!!

I see a LARGE number of posts that are so upset over this from members who are Provari users, and I understand. I was very intrigued by it, but in the end I found the Buzz and the ∞ were a better fit ...for me.

But I would ask you ALL (some of whom I know and are friends), if vape360 had applied instead of Buzzkill, can you honestly say that you would be so veracious in your efforts and objections to this filling. Furthermore, would you be telling them that this isn't fair to Buzzkill?

There's a lot of talk about it's all about the buck. Business is all about the BUCK !!!! I don't think I can buy a Provari, an atty/carto or any juice for cost (if you know where, please let me know )

 

[MasterofChaos]

There is nothing wrong with making a buck. There is, however a LOT wrong with being a patent troll (thats what I meant by troll in my earlier post, BTW, not some kind of internet troll). Patent trolls are like ambulance-chasing lawyers, they are leeches who try to skim money off the hard work of others.

Kind of like Gordon Geko from Wall Street. They dont create anything.

There are all kinds of examples of this in the electronics industry.

The humorous thing about all this is, it will take years for Buzzkill to get his patent awarded (if he ever does), and once it is, the industry will have moved on, and it will be irrelevant anyway. Plus, looking at his patent, there are lots of ways around it, so I dont really see it as much of a problem.

Its the attitude of trolling and the deception I dont like.

 

[Zen~]

I'm starting actually laugh out loud at some of these folks that clearly cannot wrap their heads around how patents work...

I got a pm from somebody as a reaction to my last post in another thread on this topic threatening to patent water so they could force me to die of dehydration...

To that I respond, "there is water in beer, my friend, and that cannot be effectively patented... I shall never die of thirst!"

 

[Wharf Rat]

There is nothing wrong with making a buck. There is, however a LOT wrong with being a patent troll (thats what I meant by troll in my earlier post, BTW, not some kind of internet troll). Patent trolls are like ambulance-chasing lawyers, they are leeches who try to skim money off the hard work of others.

Kind of like Gordon Geko from Wall Street. They dont create anything.

There are all kinds of examples of this in the electronics industry.

The humorous thing about all this is, it will take years for Buzzkill to get his patent awarded (if he ever does), and once it is, the industry will have moved on, and it will be irrelevant anyway. Plus, looking at his patent, there are lots of ways around it, so I dont really see it as much of a problem.

Its the attitude of trolling and the deception I dont like.

He did market the 1st VV and continues to create...

I can tell you honestly, I am not one but I did not realize we have sooo many legal scholars here.

 

[Digs]

I don't think being an owner of a ProVari has anything to do with it. I would be just as upset if they were the ones doing it.

 

[Wharf Rat]

I don't think being an owner of a ProVari has anything to do with it. I would be just as upset if they were the ones doing it.

Honestly......... Why?

 

[Digs]

I already stated why. I'm not going to argue about it. I think it's pretty obvious why some of us do not agree with it.

 

[Wharf Rat]

Fair enough Digs.

 

[GMoney]

Several important points about this patent application:

1 - Applying for a patent and getting it are two different things. It will take YEARS to get approved, assuming it ever is, which I think is doubtful. In the mean time, Buzzkill, you can troll and threaten manufacturers all you want, but noone has to pay you a cent.

2 - To argue against this patent, all you have to do is find a public disclosure of someone suggesting using VV for E-cigs or a PV earlier than 1 year before the patent application. That doesn't seem like something that would be very difficult to find to me. Also, I`m not sure when you announced the VV Buzz, but it better have been less than one year before the patent application.

3 - You argue about protecting your IP, your business and all that. That is total BS. If that was your intent, you would have applied for the patent BEFORE you released your device. That`s how companies who deal with IP all the time operate. The fact that you are applying for the patent much later (after VV has taken off in the industry) shows you to be nothing but a troll. You are trying to get everyone to pay to go through a door long after all the the cows have left the barn.

4 - You are using the ECF to compile a list of trolling targets. You petitioned the ECF membership to supply you with manufacturers you can threaten, without telling them that's what you were doing. That is very bad form, to the point of being creepy. If you had posted a thread which said "Please give me a list of manufacturers so I can send them threatening letters and sue them" I bet you wouldn't have gotten many replies, huh.

While I have a problem with a few things you have stated - it is not worth getting into it all.

I am completely baffled by your attitude that the notification process is somehow evil. Notifying those that would be potentially affected by an issued patent of the application at an early stage provides them with ample opportunity to determine their legal rights and obligations and to make business decisions accordingly. It is much nicer to let people know now than to surprise them with it later after a patent issues and possibly force them into a difficult situation. Furthermore, I think your vitriol in general is unwarranted.

 

[Zen~]

I already stated why. I'm not going to argue about it. I think it's pretty obvious why some of us do not agree with it.

The only thing that is obvious to me, is that all of the folks that seem upset by it, don't seem to have even the most basic understanding of patents or intellectual property... If you have some other reason, maybe you should clue us in, because so far, it's not being communicated in any meaningful way... No need to argue about it, with the exception of disagreeing with the patent process in general... Why does this upset you? I'm sincerely interested in knowing!