What are the best batteries?

[Oli Squire]

Last question. What tank do you use?

Freemax Mesh pro for my main tank, and then occasionally my Asmodus Viento

 

[smacuser]

@Baditude

 

[susieqz]

buy online from one of mooch's listed venders n you will get years of use from a battery.

 

[Oli Squire]

Signing off for the night, thanks for the input, will check back in the morning!

 

[smacuser]

Nite.

 

[englishmick]

Two of these guysView attachment 870461

I believe those silver labels are put on by someone other than the manufacturer. If you look closely you can sometimes see a line of small faint text elsewhere on the battery that will tell you the manufacturer and the model. It can even be underneath the silver label, which peels off. If you can find that it should help identify what you have. Not that it matters really since they are worn out and you are planning to replace them.

There are a lot of fake batteries around. Fakes can be seriously underpowered and not last long, which sounds like what is happening to you. Could be dangerous too since you are using them at quite high power levels. There's a really high chance of getting fakes if you buy from a local store, and the store probably won't even know themselves. Same with Ebay and Amazon.

The Mooch info should point you to the short list of reliable on-line suppliers, and also the right battery for your power needs.

 

[smacuser]

$2.99 each. Add $5 to ship 4 of them.

I'd say get the LG's if you can. Though, their wrappers are crap.

 

[Oli Squire]

I believe those silver labels are put on by someone other than the manufacturer. If you look closely you can sometimes see a line of small faint text elsewhere on the battery that will tell you the manufacturer and the model. It can even be underneath the silver label, which peels off. If you can find that it should help identify what you have. Not that it matters really since they are worn out and you are planning to replace them.

There are a lot of fake batteries around. Fakes can be seriously underpowered and not last long, which sounds like what is happening to you. Could be dangerous too since you are using them at quite high power levels. There's a really high chance of getting fakes if you buy from a local store, and the store probably won't even know themselves. Same with Ebay and Amazon.

The Mooch info should point you to the short list of reliable on-line suppliers, and also the right battery for your power needs.

Ace, thank you, I'll get some ordered so I can stop using these as soon as poss then.

 

[Oli Squire]

$2.99 each. Add $5 to ship 4 of them.
View attachment 870471
I'd say get the LG's if you can. Though, their wrappers are crap.

Great, this is super helpful, thanks for your time/help!

 

[Punk In Drublic]

That's about the color of Sony's, though Sony per se is no longer making cells for e-cig use. There is Murata, which iirc was spun off from Sony. I'm not sure just what names are being used these days between the two.

Sony has never made cells for e-cig use. They do/did make cylindrical Li Ion batteries that we have used for e-cigs. In 2016 Sony sold off part of it’s battery manufacturing to Murata, hence the Sony/Murata marketing. The current “Murata” cells should be pretty much identical to their older Sony counterparts.

Murata is a giant electronics manufacture out of Japan dating back to the mid 1940’s

 

[Punk In Drublic]

I believe those silver labels are put on by someone other than the manufacturer.

Those are mandatory shipping labels and are not necessarily put on by the cell manufacture but by whom ever was distributing the cell. You could very well receive 2 of the same cells with different labels although the labels should indicate the same information, ie: size, mAh and nominal voltage.

Counterfeits have gotten REALLY good at mimicking the aesthetics of the actual cell they are trying to copy. So good that in some cases the only way to tell is through detailed measurements. This stresses the importance of buying from reputable retailers, although Mooch has stated several times that even they are not void of receiving a fake cell(s).

 

[Punk In Drublic]

@Oli Squire – you should choose the correct cell based on your usage. Given you vape with a regulated device, with some simple math we can determine the correct cell. Take the cell’s CDR rating and multiply that by 3. That will give you the maximum wattage per cell you could use while reducing risk. If your device uses more than one cell, multiply that answer by the amount of cells your mod uses.

Example: Samsung 30Q is a 15 amp CDR cell. 15 x 3 = 45 watts. If your device utilizes 2 cells, 45 x 2 = 90 watts. So in order to reduce risk, you should not use the 30Q beyond 45 watts (per cell). It is also good practice to leave some head room as so you are not stressing the battery. 45 watts with the 30Q would result in poor runtime, so if that was the power in which you intend to use, a higher CDR, such as 20 – 25 amp, would most likely give you more run time.

It is best to stick with brand names, Sony/Murata, LG, Samsung, Molicel and Sanyo/Panasonic. It is also best to purchase from a reputable retailer which can mitigate the risk of acquiring a counterfeit cell. Here’s a link to Mooch’s recommended cells which also has an extensive list of reputable retailers.

Mooch's Recommended Batteries | E-Cigarette Forum

 

[dripster]

By far the dominant factor in determining what to expect from a battery as far as the amount of vaping time is concerned, is the Wh (Watt-Hours) rating, especially for a regulated mod. As far as battery aging and the resulting gradual loss in battery capacity are concerned, the dominant factor is always the temperature, how hot the battery gets.

On average 70 watts on a dual battery regulated mod translates to about 12.5 amps being the highest current that the mod will pull from the batteries. The highest current, that is, for a regulated mod the current will be lower if the batteries are fully charged to 4.2 volts, after which the current will gradually go up with every puff until the "battery low" message appears on the display of the regulated mod, usually around 3.2 volts. This is because the correct math to use to calculate this is to take the highest wattage setting you'll ever use, divide it by the number of batteries (2 batteries in your dual battery regulated mod), divide that by the voltage cut-off of your regulated mod (usually this is 3.2 volts, as I explained above, but it depends on the technical specifications of your regulated mod), and then finally divide that by a factor to also account for the efficiency of the regulated mod (if it's 90 percent, use 0.9, if it's 85 percent, use 0.85, and so on... ).

So if the battery you select for vaping in your dual battery regulated mod at up to 70 watts has a Continuous Discharge Rate (CDR) of at least 12.5 amps as tested by Mooch (!), then, in pure terms of general battery safety recommendations, that would be an OK selection. But in terms of the performance, the amount of vaping time you'll get before needing to put the batteries back in the charger, in this specific case (i.e. vaping at 70 watts on a dual 18650 battery regulated mod), I recommend the Molicel P26A. Why? Simple. It's because a quick glance at the Wh ratings of all the different battery suggestions reveals the P26A can't seriously be beat at 12.5 amps. The Wh you're going to get from a pair of these P26A batteries at that level of current is going to be highly similar to the best performing 3000mAh battery of them all, which is the Sony/Murata VTC6 (video below). Mark my word for it. Now, because the P26A has a true CDR of 25 amps, it won't heat up much using it at 12.5 amps. Not only will you be getting slower battery aging as a result, but also additional headroom with regards to safety as well. That plus the fact charging it goes faster when compared to any 3000mAh battery. Plus the fact if you ever change your mind about 70 watts being the highest you'll ever vape... well, you get the picture. I should go on?

 

[BigPappa]

I just get whatever the shops suggest

That probably just means they are recommending the ones they have with the highest markup. lol

That's about the color of Sony's, though Sony per se is no longer making cells for e-cig use.

They never made batteries for e-cig use. According to all of the manufacturers: No one does.

That's about the color of Sony's

Samsung 25R's are also that color. Can't really go by the color... I'd either check under that label, and if nothing was there pull off the wrapper to see what is on the battery itself and then re-wrap it.

 

[Oli Squire]

By far the dominant factor in determining what to expect from a battery as far as the amount of vaping time is concerned, is the Wh (Watt-Hours) rating, especially for a regulated mod. As far as battery aging and the resulting gradual loss in battery capacity are concerned, the dominant factor is always the temperature, how hot the battery gets.

On average 70 watts on a dual battery regulated mod translates to about 12.5 amps being the highest current that the mod will pull from the batteries. The highest current, that is, for a regulated mod the current will be lower if the batteries are fully charged to 4.2 volts, after which the current will gradually go up with every puff until the "battery low" message appears on the display of the regulated mod, usually around 3.2 volts. This is because the correct math to use to calculate this is to take the highest wattage setting you'll ever use, divide it by the number of batteries (2 batteries in your dual battery regulated mod), divide that by the voltage cut-off of your regulated mod (usually this is 3.2 volts, as I explained above, but it depends on the technical specifications of your regulated mod), and then finally divide that by a factor to also account for the efficiency of the regulated mod (if it's 90 percent, use 0.9, if it's 85 percent, use 0.85, and so on... ).

So if the battery you select for vaping in your dual battery regulated mod at up to 70 watts has a Continuous Discharge Rate (CDR) of at least 12.5 amps as tested by Mooch (!), then, in pure terms of general battery safety recommendations, that would be an OK selection. But in terms of the performance, the amount of vaping time you'll get before needing to put the batteries back in the charger, in this specific case (i.e. vaping at 70 watts on a dual 18650 battery regulated mod), I recommend the Molicel P26A. Why? Simple. It's because a quick glance at the Wh ratings of all the different battery suggestions reveals the P26A can't seriously be beat at 12.5 amps. The Wh you're going to get from a pair of these P26A batteries at that level of current is going to be highly similar to the best performing 3000mAh battery of them all, which is the Sony/Murata VTC6 (video below). Mark my word for it. Now, because the P26A has a true CDR of 25 amps, it won't heat up much using it at 12.5 amps. Not only will you be getting slower battery aging as a result, but also additional headroom with regards to safety as well. That plus the fact charging it goes faster when compared to any 3000mAh battery. Plus the fact if you ever change your mind about 70 watts being the highest you'll ever vape... well, you get the picture. I should go on?

Awesome, will take a look at these too! Thanks for the detailed response! I knew there was a lot to batteries but this threads opened my eyes a little at this point haha

 

[Oli Squire]

@Oli Squire – you should choose the correct cell based on your usage. Given you vape with a regulated device, with some simple math we can determine the correct cell. Take the cell’s CDR rating and multiply that by 3. That will give you the maximum wattage per cell you could use while reducing risk. If your device uses more than one cell, multiply that answer by the amount of cells your mod uses.

Example: Samsung 30Q is a 15 amp CDR cell. 15 x 3 = 45 watts. If your device utilizes 2 cells, 45 x 2 = 90 watts. So in order to reduce risk, you should not use the 30Q beyond 45 watts (per cell). It is also good practice to leave some head room as so you are not stressing the battery. 45 watts with the 30Q would result in poor runtime, so if that was the power in which you intend to use, a higher CDR, such as 20 – 25 amp, would most likely give you more run time.

It is best to stick with brand names, Sony/Murata, LG, Samsung, Molicel and Sanyo/Panasonic. It is also best to purchase from a reputable retailer which can mitigate the risk of acquiring a counterfeit cell. Here’s a link to Mooch’s recommended cells which also has an extensive list of reputable retailers.

Mooch's Recommended Batteries | E-Cigarette Forum

Sweet, that's really useful! Will definitely be using Mooch's list for a reputable retailers, didn't realise counterfeits were that rife! Thank you

 

[Oli Squire]

That probably just means they are recommending the ones they have with the highest markup. lol

Yeah I assumed as much but felt like they must have been at least somewhat honest on which were the better ones, but you never know

 

[Don29palms]

Yeah I assumed as much but felt like they must have been at least somewhat honest on which were the better ones, but you never know

When you ask what is the best battery and someone gives you an answer without getting anymore info they are not honest.

 

[rob33]

Since all the fakes and knockoffs came around, I've been exclusively been buying my batteries from Liion Wholesale Batteries | Li-ion battery/cell distributor. They authenticate and test batteries so you always get safe and fresh batteries. For past few years been using Vapcell 20700s, take something earthshaking to get me to change.

 

[Baditude]

Easiest way to choose what battery to use is determine how many watts you use for vaping, and then choose the battery that has the appropriate amp rating for that wattage setting.

WATTAGE PER SINGLE BATTERY on REGULATED MOD:
(Total wattage doubles using 2 batteries; Triples using 3 batteries.)

Up to 45W:

Samsung 18650 30Q, 3000 mah 15 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC6 3000mAh 15 amp CDR

​

Up to 60W:

LG 18650HG2 3000mah 20 amp CDR

LG 18650HE4 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-25R, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Sanyo UR18650NSX, 2500 mah 20 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5, 2600 mah 20 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC4, 2100 mah 23 amp CDR

​

Up to 75W:

LG 18650 HD4 2100 mah 25 amp CDR

LG 18650 HD2 2000 mah 25 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-24S, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Sony 18650VTC5A, 2500 mah 25 amp CDR

Molicel 18650-P26A, 2600 mah 25 amp CDR

​

Up to 90W:

LG18650HB6 1500mah 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB2 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

LG18650HB4 1500mAh 30 amp CDR

Samsung 18650-20S 2000mah 30 amp CDR

​

Battery Basics for Mods: The Definative Battery Guide for Vaping

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