Which is less harmful for health?

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evan le'garde

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Strawman argument. Where in my posts did I say that anyone who vapes low wattage MTL does it wrong?

I dunno but you did (why are you asking me anyway, don't you even know what you wrote. :)). But your attitude is that MTLers are doing it wrong because they should be DTLing.
 
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evan le'garde

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You're the one who supports the assertion that high wattage vaping necessarily always produces a hot vape, when the reality is that every real high wattage vaper will tell you this entirely depends on the various specifics of cooling effect, and, you didn't even know the difference between the description of high wattage vaping and vaping MTL at an increased wattage that is still nowhere nearly as high as high wattage vaping. Ergo, the one who sounds like an apostle is you.

I realize there is a difference between the description i just didn't realize they were official categories. Saying i didn't know the difference between the description makes me look stupid, and i'm not stupid, ever..................so !.
 
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evan le'garde

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I already tried to answer that question... sheer nic harshness with not much flavor. Nic salts do eliminate the harshness to a large extent, but they still don't fix the flavor problem. I'll also add that I don't like anything more than just a very small amount of throat hit, and, vaping on anything too far below 90 watts just feels anemic to me, or else there's just too much throat hit. Either way, there's not much flavor at low wattage (or at medium wattage, for that matter...).

I'm thinking it's possible, based on the things you say, that it's assumed flavour is in some way important. And maybe some people might not agree with that, or more likely will have high expectations then feel short changed after realizing the reality of it. And the more throat hit the better. It's the only thing that keeps me vaping. And in no way is it harsh. It's smooth !.

Smooth.
 

dripster

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I used dual coil sub ohm rta's for months around 25 watts. It's just too much like hard work. like preparing my lungs to inflate a lilo. MTL is simple and a lot less effort. Any higher and i risk heart burn. The vapes alright but isn't worth the effort compared to a nice relaxed MTL vape.
If you think 25 watts is a lot, then try vaping at 230 watts. The simplest, most relaxing part about MTL is, it makes me feel like I want to murder someone just to be able to smoke a normal cigarette.
 

evan le'garde

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It's not just about being passionate. I live in a country where consumers can no longer (i.e., since 17 January 2017) buy vaping products online so it's also about watching how people vape in person, being allowed to give their vape a try, and talking to them face to face as opposed to reading what they write online, visiting places where high wattage vapers, mech users, and coil builders meet up and show you what they've got under the hood... it's a friendly little atmosphere. If you don't visit such places very often, then you can't very often learn from those who don't usually share a lot of detailed info or in-depth knowledge online. At my go to B&M store, there's always an experienced mech-using professional coil builder standing behind the counter excepting only when both of them have called in sick. The shopkeepers also own a wholesale company of vaping products, BTW. The vast majority of other shops don't cater to a wide variety of vaping styles, or they barely try to, and, knowledge about vaping products that aren't just another money grab tends to be extremely limited in most other shops. Not every new vaper finds the luxury to enter a decent shop or receive unbiased info online. A lot of mediocre stuff gets overhyped, just like a lot of good stuff gets underrated, when most online reviewers only vape for half an hour on the products before they review them. The same also applies to users who voice their opinion before they put in real effort to learn how to use a product.

I've been to belgium a few times. Love De Panne, stayed at the Hotel Donny. Right there on the coast about 40km west of Calais. Been to Arlon to. I was in a cell directly below Marc Dutroux. That was in the remand wing, six months i was there until i was convicted and moved to a much nicer area of the nick. It's only a little place Arlon nick. God, that was like, 2002.

Nice place Belgium. De Panne has an amazing beach.

Just thought i'd mention it.
 
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evan le'garde

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If you think 25 watts is a lot, then try vaping at 230 watts. The simplest, most relaxing part about MTL is, it makes me feel like I want to murder someone just to be able to smoke a normal cigarette.

I feel exactly like that after i've drunk caffeinated Coffee.

This is weird !.
 
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englishmick

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I just think most smokers are too afraid of what their friends might say. Peer pressure and all that. It's more of a social weekness they might have.

I do remember my smoking friends were not exactly enthusiastic and supportive when I started vaping. And I didn't get around to looking on-line so I didn't have access to any feedback from vapers. Hence I spent 5 years piddling around with cigalikes. Eventually I picked up some Egos from a local head shop. Soon after that I found ECF and rapidly moved up to Pro Tanks and a proper mod and quit without too much difficulty.
 

dripster

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I'm thinking it's possible, based on the things you say, that it's assumed flavour is in some way important. And maybe some people might not agree with that, or more likely will have high expectations then feel short changed after realizing the reality of it. And the more throat hit the better. It's the only thing that keeps me vaping. And in no way is it harsh. It's smooth !.

Smooth.
Flavor isn't just in some way important to me. Rather, it is so totally important to me that I actually REFUSE to vape on anything that tastes even just a little bit too weak/diluted or has an 'off' taste, be it due to too much PG, which starts to taste chemical to me at above 30%, or if it doesn't, then the vape starts to FEEL less textured, or be it due to something else. But if the FEEL of the vape is not to my liking, then I don't vape it either. Here's a simple suggestion. Go to a famous restaurant and ask what people think about the importance of top culinary food characteristics like temperature, density, and texture. Do you think their reply will be that only the flavor itself is all that really matters to them? I should hope not...
 

dripster

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24mg's at 11.5 watts.

it's smooth baby yeah.

And anyway, how long does it take for a sub ohm coil and wick to lose flavour because i don't know. I do know it only takes 1 ml or so at low wattage MTL for the flavour to fade.
To me, a 'sub ohm coil' is fairly synonymous to a 'drop in coil', i.e. factory prebuilt. I never vape on those things... I shudder the thought.
 

dripster

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I've been to belgium a few times. Love De Panne, stayed at the Hotel Donny. Right there on the coast about 40km west of Calais. Been to Arlon to. I was in a cell directly below Marc Dutroux. That was in the remand wing, six months i was there until i was convicted and moved to a much nicer area of the nick. It's only a little place Arlon nick. God, that was like, 2002.

Nice place Belgium. De Panne has an amazing beach.

Just thought i'd mention it.
You were in jail for 6 months after murdering someone just to be able to smoke a normal cigarette? TBH, that really DOES sound like Belgium to me...
 

evan le'garde

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You were in jail for 6 months after murdering someone just to be ale to smoke a normal cigarette? TBH, that really DOES sound like Belgium to me...

I was in there because, well, i was kind of passing through Belgium to France from Amsterdam, at night, with a very large, a very large quantity of Cannabis. And i didn't do six months that's just how long i was on remand for. Once convicted a prisoner will move from the remand wing to the general population wing which is much cleaner and you get your own cell. Before my arrest i was in the process of moving the weed and resin from Amsterdam to another courier when i was stopped by the Gendarmerie on the road at night. I didn't go quietly either. As you could imagine Belgium is quite busy with those passing through so to speak. And the judge who sat in front of me was Connerotte in the Neufchateau court. I think i had their very divided attention as they weren't concerned with what id done at all. As i recall dutroux was all over the news at that time, the weirdo !.
 
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dripster

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You said something along the lines about high power vaping isn't about heat but basically about how cool the coil is kept.

Same as saying a cars engine doesn't get hot it just isn't cool. It's daft !. And haven't you heard of the metaphore "a glass half full ? or a glass half empty ?. Such as seeing things in an either positive or negative way.

I'm assuming you actually aren't at all familiar with this metaphore.
High power vaping can be about getting a warmer vape, and can be about getting a hot vape, but not necessarily so... powerful (yet fairly stable) airflow focussed accurately at the center of the coils can tame the heat much to the point of it becoming nothing more than just moderately warm, even if it's a whopping 230 watts in a 25mm RDA. It depends on all kinds of different factors─too many to even begin to technically describe without going hopelessly off-topic.

As for the metaphor, yes, I know what it means, but I'm neither an optimist nor a pessimist. I am a realist.
 

dripster

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I was in there because, well, i was kind of passing through Belgium to France from Amsterdam, at night, with a very large, a very large quantity of Cannabis. And i didn't do six months that's just how long i was on remand for. Once convicted a prisoner will move from the remand wing to the general population wing which is much cleaner and you get your own cell. Before my arrest i was in the process of moving the weed and resin from Amsterdam to another courier when i was stopped by the Gendarmerie on the road at night. I didn't go quietly either. As you could imagine Belgium is quite busy with those passing through so to speak. And the judge who sat in front of me was Connerotte in the Neufchateau court. I think i had their very divided attention as they weren't at all concerned with what id done at all.
Ouch! All for a little green plant that grows just about anywhere.
 

evan le'garde

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High power vaping can be about getting a warmer vape, and can be about getting a hot vape, but not necessarily so... powerful (yet fairly stable) airflow focussed accurately at the center of the coils can tame the heat much to the point of it becoming nothing more than just moderately warm, even if it's a whopping 230 watts in a 25mm RDA. It depends on all kinds of different factors─too many to even begin to technically describe without going hopelessly off-topic.

It does sound like a hell of a lot of trouble to go through though, getting it right. I've built multiple coil assembies in the past and they can be very time confusing and rather frustrating to get right. I cannot be bothered to be honest. And probably another reason people get turned off. Give me something simple to build which takes five or ten minutes and i'm good with that.
 
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dripster

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Home made coils/wicks lose flavour too, which is what i was talking about. Whether they are high powered or not.
At worst, I can vape on the same pair of handbuilt Ni80 alien coils for almost 2 months daily. But the FEEL of the vape changes noticeably much faster than this... I just don't consider that a huge issue, because, on a mech the vape also gets weaker with every hit, due to discharging the battery further. My wicks last 4-5 days or longer on a single battery mech, usually A LOT longer on a stacked mech so, in general, the higher the power, the slower the coils tend to gunk up. That is, despite it also fairly heavily depends on what juice I'm vaping, among a few other factors.
 

dripster

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It does sound like a hell of a lot of trouble to go through though, getting it right. I've built multiple coil assembies in the past and they can be very time confusing and rather frustrating to get right. I cannot be bothered to be honest. And probably another reason people get turned off. Give me something simple to build which takes five or ten minutes and i'm good with that.
It's called a vaping hobby for a reason. Some (or most) people just want to vape and that's basically it, they care about convenience and cost so they aren't as picky about the vape experience, or they don't notice that much of a difference in the vape experience, if any.
 

dripster

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I realize there is a difference between the desciption i just didn't realize they were official categories. Saying i didn't know the difference between the description makes me look stupid, and i'm not stupid, ever..................so !.
Official? There's nothing 'official' about it, just when people talk about high wattage vaping, typically what they are referring to is DL at something like 90 watts or higher, could be a lot higher than that, could also be a tad less depending who you ask, but certainly not a lot less.
 
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