Which is less harmful for health?

[englishmick]

Hi, you don't have to and nobody forces you to do it, but some folks want to know and want to choose a healthier option. That's the whole point of discussing such matters, to give people an idea of all the spects involved with the decision they make.

I personally want to know about what I'm doing (This is one of the reasons why I quit smoking once I weighted out pros andcons) Doesn't necessarily mean that such knowledge is going to change my decision regarding my vaping style but it could affect it. Let's say that in a year or two a series of studies comes out that will prove that higher wattage, more vapor and lower nic is in fact 4 times more harmful than mtl, then I would rather know that and I might reconsider my long-term choices.

Most folks would like to know this stuff. I'm not aware of any useful studies in progress. Flavoring chemicals are a vast unknown as far as inhalation goes. We use thousands of them. I saw the list for strawberry once, there were dozens in just that flavor. None of them have been tested for inhalation, individually or in the infinite number of combinations. It's hard to see how they could ever be tested. Not really practical to have large numbers of people in labs inhaling each one of those base chemicals for long periods of time. You could feed them to lung cells in a dish but that only gives you a hint of what happens out in the world.

Some people avoid flavors for that reason.

We are really just waiting for long terms studies of the health outcomes of vapers. Even then extracting results for different styles of vaping and different flavoring choices and different levels of nic would be hard. How many people vape the same stuff in the same way for long periods of time. What happens if one of the ingredients of Mango flavor is bad? People might use Mango for a while then move on. There won't be a control group of people who use Mango and nothing else for long periods.

My guess is that for the foreseeable future all we will have is some numbers for the overall effect of vaping on health. They could look at the mostly older group of vaping ex-smokers and compare them to a similar group of non-vaping ex-smokers.

I think I saw some results for inhalation of VG and PG. At least regarding their inhalation in work situations. Didn't seem like they were too worrisome.

 

[dripster]

I do sometimes wonder what new a vaper expects from vaping. Do they think that vaping nicotine will offer sublime satisfaction like smoking does !. Are they aware of a thing called a "throat hit" !. Do they know that higher temperature vaping provides a different kind of throat hit unrelated to nicotine !. I imagine some new vapers try it then wonder why it works for others but not for them. Where do they even start !.

How many ex-smokers do you know who, like me, managed to stop smoking by switching to vaping as opposed to by switching to DUAL USE before finally switching to only vaping? Is dual use more harmful than only vaping? Of all those who, like me, completely skipped the dual use transition stage, how many were low wattage vapers at the time when they made the switch? How many were high wattage ones? How many percent of low wattage vapers have relapsed back to combustible tobacco? How many percent of high wattage ones have? Take a wild guess. I've witnessed a significant part of the data. Those who aren't even interested in listening to people who skipped dual use will never know how the data looks like. But it certainly doesn't stop these vocal apostles, who will always─with every chance they get─defend the low wattage bulwark until the last breath (literally), from keep BELIEVING they know how data looks like. That in fact is how superstition always wins. And the ANTZ all love it, obviously like no tomorrow.

 

[dripster]

For me, I 'd like to match my vaping to my former smoking habit.

For me, my former smoking habit is something negative. Why would I want to match my vaping to something negative, when, clearly, vaping isn't? I mean, wouldn't that be detrimental to my vape experience? Had the vape experience not been noticeably more pleasurable to me than smoking, I would still be smoking. Possibly I would be dead as a consequence of not having stopped smoking. Vaping trying to mimic smoking is a recipe for disaster. A lot of times vapers suggest that the low wattage, restricted DL vaping style more closely matches smoking. You should see the look on their face when I reply to them, "How many smokers do you know are sucking on their cigarette for like 7 whole seconds?" Whereas with a true MTL setup, all I get is sheer nic harshness with almost no flavor. So then, I match my vaping to vaping, not smoking. Because I am a realist.

 

[Jebbn]

Jeez @dripster, do you ever just chill tf out and stop tilting at windmills, even for a second? Its just tedious and uninspiring.

One sentence in that post, "I've witnessed a significant part of the data"....and, what? what are you alluding to?

 

[dripster]

Let's say that in a year or two a series of studies comes out that will prove that higher wattage, more vapor and lower nic is in fact 4 times more harmful than mtl,

Good luck with trying to design a testing apparatus that can accurately simulate how my brain controls my fast inhalation technique as my brain continuously, from start to finish during every hit I take, responds to the tactical receptors inside my mouth and throat sensing the subtlest of the subtle changes in vapor characteristics. They'll just let the coils overheat like usual I mean, why do you think so many vapers keep wrongfully assuming that the fact I'm vaping at 230 watts on a 25mm RDA logically implies my vape is hot? Don't answer that question. It's because the low wattage apostles only care about low wattage vaping. It's a typical knee-jerk reaction, based on pure anadultered superstition, and that they are obsessed.

 

[dripster]

Jeez @dripster, do you ever just chill tf out and stop tilting at windmills, even for a second? Its just tedious and uninspiring.

One sentence in that post, "I've witnessed a significant part of the data"....and, what? what are you alluding to?

I'm not alluding to anything. Rather, I'm pointing out the simple fact I listen to real stories from real vapers, as opposed to obsessively keep believing in gasbag facts being touted by low wattage apostles.

 

[Javichu]

Jeez @dripster, do you ever just chill tf out and stop tilting at windmills, even for a second? Its just tedious and uninspiring.

One sentence in that post, "I've witnessed a significant part of the data"....and, what? what are you alluding to?

I completely DISAGREE!!
@dripster is passionate about a subject that saved his life,is it wrong? Nope

Wish more people were like him,really passionate about things that are important not Oompa-Loompas that just cruise thru life with no passion for anything.

Do i always agree with @dripster ? nope,not always but i do respect him and his beliefs,more people should be like that.

cheers

 

[evan le'garde]

Yeahhh take a chill pill, chillax dude.

For me i can't stand the heat from high powered vaping. And the Harsh so called hit from that is just rough.

I prefer the simulated version of that from nicotine. And flavour isn't important either. Doesn't take much more than a mil for the flavour to fade anyway. No sweetners nothing particularly great tasting either. I like chocolate unsweetned, cinnamon, coffee and several others all at 11.5 watts with a simple no frills 1 ohm coil. The Prime has the easiest deck to re-wick i've ever used. Takes but a couple of minutes. No mess no fuss.

Never dual used. I don't know any vapers to ask. Recipe for disaster ?. I'm still at it after about 8 or something years solid. New users don't know what they want, or to expect. Having the patience to try the different methods is what's lacking i think.

 

[evan le'garde]

I'm not alluding to anything. Rather, I'm pointing out the simple fact I listen to real stories from real vapers, as opposed to obsessively keep believing in gasbag facts being touted by low wattage apostles.

So the experience from these low wattage apostles in your opinion is that they are quite simply making it up then !. I'm a real vaper and i vape low at wattage. It's a fact.

I HONESTLY have no idea who you are referring to dripster.

 

[dripster]

Some people avoid flavors for that reason.

For reasons that are surprisingly very similar, some people stay in a padded room wearing a flannel suit stuffed with pillows for their entire life.

 

[Javichu]

New users don't know what they want, or to expect. Having the patience to try the different methods is what's lacking i think.

Agreed.
For me i kinda eased into vaping from the bottom up,meaning i bought one of those cheapo pens for 25 euros then when i felt it just wasn't enough i asked my friend who owns the vape shop to hook me up with something better.
Ended up getting a SWAG 80w,tried RDA's...didn't like the whole drip,dripitty drip thing so switched to RTA's and I've been a happy vaper since.

But I've met a lot of people that didn't really give it a try,an honest try i mean and gave it time until they found their right set up.

And then again,what i gather a lot of people get into vaping without the right information,i know a lot of people doesn't like to visit shops but i still think that specially for a new vaper a visit to a vaping shop is invaluable.

If you get a good salesperson at the shop he will make sure you get the right device for your vaping needs so you can quit smoking for good.

 

[evan le'garde]

I completely DISAGREE!!
@dripster is passionate about a subject that saved his life,is it wrong? Nope

Wish more people were like him,really passionate about things that are important not Oompa-Loompas that just cruise thru life with no passion for anything.

Do i always agree with @dripster ? nope,not always but i do respect him and his beliefs,more people should be like that.

cheers

I understand you admire his passion in general.

But what about the subject he's talking about. Don't you have an opinion about that?. Isn't that more pertinent.

Oh Hitler did some terrible things but didn't you notice how passionate he was, you've got to admire that.

Seems it's ok to do or say almost anything just so long as you show some passion eh.

 

[evan le'garde]

Agreed.
For me i kinda eased into vaping from the bottom up,meaning i bought one of those cheapo pens for 25 euros then when i felt it just wasn't enough i asked my friend who owns the vape shop to hook me up with something better.
Ended up getting a SWAG 80w,tried RDA's...didn't like the whole drip,dripitty drip thing so switched to RTA's and I've been a happy vaper since.

But I've met a lot of people that didn't really give it a try,an honest try i mean and gave it time until they found their right set up.

And then again,what i gather a lot of people get into vaping without the right information,i know a lot of people doesn't like to visit shops but i still think that specially for a new vaper a visit to a vaping shop is invaluable.

If you get a good salesperson at the shop he will make sure you get the right device for your vaping needs so you can quit smoking for good.

I just think most smokers are too afraid of what their friends might say. Peer pressure and all that. It's more of a social weekness they might have.

 

[Javichu]

I understand you admire his passion in general.

But what about the subject he's talking about. Don't you have an opinion about that?. Isn't that more pertinent.

Oh Hitler did some terrible things but didn't you notice how passionate he was, you've got to admire that.

Seems it's ok to do or say almost anything just so long as you show some passion eh.

WOW!!
Hitler? you actually went there?
Seems wrong doesn't it,just sayin'

And about the subject at hand,yes i do have an opinion but no one asked me so i didn't say anything,was just replying to someone else who seemed bothered about @dripster passionate posts,that is all.

 

[Javichu]

I just think most smokers are too afraid of what their friends might say. Peer pressure and all that. It's more of a social weekness they might have.

That might be right with the younger crowd,but older folks (past 25 years old or so) know better but then again we are knee deep in all this social media bs so yeah maybe you're right,the whole ''peer pressure'' might get to some people...which is sad but you know,it happens.

 

[evan le'garde]

WOW!!
Hitler? you actually went there?
Seems wrong doesn't it,just sayin'

And about the subject at hand,yes i do have an opinion but no one asked me so i didn't say anything,was just replying to someone else who seemed bothered about @dripster passionate posts,that is all.

It's just a laugh though aint it !.

 

[Javichu]

It's just a laugh though aint it !.

 

[Jebbn]

I'm not alluding to anything. Rather, I'm pointing out the simple fact I listen to real stories from real vapers, as opposed to obsessively keep believing in gasbag facts being touted by low wattage apostles.

So, what, on the one hand you have "witnessed a significant part of the data" and on the other hand you arent referring to any specific data?
And anyone who vapes low watt mtl does it wrong?

I dont think you have anything to back up any of your opinions on this subject, just an obsessively gasbaggy high wattage apostle .

 

[dripster]

Yeahhh take a chill pill, chillax dude.

For me i can't stand the heat from high powered vaping. And the Harsh so called hit from that is just rough.

I prefer the simulated version of that from nicotine. And flavour isn't important either. Doesn't take much more than a mil for the flavour to fade anyway. No sweetners nothing particularly great tasting either. I like chocolate unsweetned, cinnamon, coffee and several others all at 11.5 watts with a simple no frills 1 ohm coil. The Prime has the easiest deck to re-wick i've ever used. Takes but a couple of minutes. No mess no fuss.

Never dual used. I don't know any vapers to ask. Recipe for disaster ?. I'm still at it after about 8 or something years solid. New users don't know what they want, or to expect. Having the patience to try the different methods is what's lacking i think.

Please read my posts before hitting the reply button. The true reason why you're getting too much heat from high powered vaping is simply because you don't understand how to correctly tweak all the other variables that keep the temperature down low enough, i.e., you are just letting the coil overheat as a result from the fact you're getting an inadequate cooling effect. What you have been doing is following the same basic principle as the experiment that 'proved' vaping causes very high levels of formaldehyde... no high wattage vaper vapes how you tried to experiment with high wattage vaping. None of them do.

 

[Frenchfry1942]

Weren't Oompa-lumpas passionate about chocolate?