Which one should I get?? Provari Provape or Silver Bullet ?

[TravTech]

Doesn't take alot of thinking with VV really.

Slap on a carto, change display numbers til it tastes good. Just like a Darwin but you're looking at a different number.

Don't know if you noticed with ohm's law, but if you change any variable it affects all of the others. Power (wattage) and current are both derived from a voltage across a resisitance. Voltage and resistance are really the only 2 things within our control when it comes to these simpler electronic devices. Since we're not freely adjusting the resistance (other than swapping an atty or carto), it's considered a fixed value. So the only way we're going to change the wattage (or power or current) is to vary the voltage. Which is what the Dawrin does to maintain a constant wattage.

If it's easier for people to think it's better because it takes the human out of the equation that's fine. Though I highly doubt people are sitting there with a calculator every time they change their carto or atty LOL. Instead they start at a round about median value and adjust up or down to taste. For that matter they could also start low and adjust up to the desired results.

To me having worked in electronics for years it's nothing more than looking at a different variable of the same equation.

With my current setup the juice in it tastes good at 4.7v, that's all I need to know. On a Darwin it would be 11.045 watts, that's all I'd need to know. It's just a different number telling me, or a different way of measuring, the exact same thing.

Now what happens when I change juice leaving everything else exactly the same? Whether I'm looking at the wattage of the Darwin or the voltage of the Provari, I'm STILL going to adjust slightly up or down from that previously "perfect" number until the new juice tastes like i want it to.

Is my tank 1 inch or 2.54 centimeters long? Both, just depends which display I use on the digital tape measure.


Edit: What happens when the "New Provari" adds a wattage meter? Or the "New Darwin" adds a voltmeter?

Nothing, it's just more information available about what's been going on in the same old circuit.

 

[killet]

i prefer provari.. and then mechanical mod

 

[jkmtwo]

The Darwin has a voltmeter already. You are missing my point here, ask any Darwin owner, many of us have owned or do own other high end mods, many of which are VV, the Darwin does not merely vary voltage, it adjusts the voltage, not just at the push of a button, but during the vape, because as coils heat up, resistance changes,and the Darwin detects this on the fly, and adjusts accordingly. Ask anyone who has owned both, its not the same, they are both fine devices, spectacular even, but to assume that they are in any way in the same class is missing what they were designed for. Take the GG for example, to compare the GG to the Provari is foolishness, they weren't built to do the same thing.

The Darwin is concerned with one thing, and one thing only, power, its constantly checking the power output. Voltage, is a part of that equation, but its not the whole equation. The Provari, is only concerned with one thing as well, voltage, period.

The Darwin is about experience, the Darwin is akin to an taxi you sit back, while someone else gets you there. The provari is like your car, you drive, you get yourself there, you are in control.

There are plenty of videos that compare the 2 and echo this same sentiment, plenty of people here will as well.

Doesn't take alot of thinking with VV really.

Slap on a carto, change display numbers til it tastes good. Just like a Darwin but you're looking at a different number.

Don't know if you noticed with ohm's law, but if you change any variable it affects all of the others. Power (wattage) and current are both derived from a voltage across a resisitance. Voltage and resistance are really the only 2 things within our control when it comes to these simpler electronic devices. Since we're not freely adjusting the resistance (other than swapping an atty or carto), it's considered a fixed value. So the only way we're going to change the wattage (or power or current) is to vary the voltage. Which is what the Dawrin does to maintain a constant wattage.

If it's easier for people to think it's better because it takes the human out of the equation that's fine. Though I highly doubt people are sitting there with a calculator every time they change their carto or atty LOL. Instead they start at a round about median value and adjust up or down to taste. For that matter they could also start low and adjust up to the desired results.

To me having worked in electronics for years it's nothing more than looking at a different variable of the same equation.

With my current setup the juice in it tastes good at 4.7v, that's all I need to know. On a Darwin it would be 11.045 watts, that's all I'd need to know. It's just a different number telling me, or a different way of measuring, the exact same thing.

Now what happens when I change juice leaving everything else exactly the same? Whether I'm looking at the wattage of the Darwin or the voltage of the Provari, I'm STILL going to adjust slightly up or down from that previously "perfect" number until the new juice tastes like i want it to.

Is my tank 1 inch or 2.54 centimeters long? Both, just depends which display I use on the digital tape measure.


Edit: What happens when the "New Provari" adds a wattage meter? Or the "New Darwin" adds a voltmeter?

Nothing, it's just more information available about what's been going on in the same old circuit.

 

[Randy C]

Let's try to simplify-

a VV device requires manual adjustment of voltage to maintain watts
A VW device automatically adjusts voltage to maintain watts

So now that we understand that, let's look at the examples below:

VV- User manually adjusts the voltage to find his "sweet spot" in taste. When the user changes atty's, cart's, stardusts, etc (of varying ohms), he would have to manually adjust voltage (up or down) to get back to that "sweet spot".

VW- User tries different watts to determine his "sweet spot"; then "locks-in" the watts. As user changes atty's, cart's, stardusts, (of varying ohms), the VW automatically adjusts the volts up or down to maintain the pre-determined watts.

So.... Watts="sweet spot"

 

[Riverboat]

Hello Randy, I have only been using Ecigs for one week now as of today but here is what I think from what I've learned so far...

1.

Variable Voltage is overrated. In my opinion, it's more of a toy, or something to fiddle around with by bored vaporists. It's just something more that could go wrong or break on your PV. Once you find the right resistance atty to go along with the voltage of your device that creates the power that you prefer to vape at, stick with it.

.

VV over rated? Are you serious? I vaped for over 2 years using a LR atty @ 3.7 volts. It was good, that was until I got a VV Provari. Now I know what vaping can really be.. VV all the way!

 

[Mr.Mann]

No VW is not the same as VV.

VV is nice, but is only half the equation, ohms are the other half.

With VW one doesn't worry about ohms and voltage. The device may vary the voltage to achieve the desired wattage, but its very different. As an owner of a Provari, which I love, a Darwin, and a couple of Kicked PVs, believe me, there is no comparing the 2.

Let me rephrase a few things here.....

When we talk about VW and VV, it helps to understand certain things, with VV there is a learning curve, where as with VW there is no learning curve. In the case of the Darwin, it takes all the thinking out of the equation of VV, one only needs to set the Darwin to the desired wattage, and that's what it does, no matter what, where as a VV mod will only supply the desired voltage, wattage, or experience, is still a numbers game.

Nice and succinctly put! It takes a clear understanding of vv and vw to be able to wrap it up so tightly! Great read!

 

[TravTech]

Let's try to simplify-

a VV device requires manual adjustment of voltage to maintain watts
A VW device automatically adjusts voltage to maintain watts

So now that we understand that, let's look at the examples below:

VV- User manually adjusts the voltage to find the "sweet spot" in taste. When the user changes atty's, cart's, stardusts, etc (of varying ohms), he would have to adjust voltage (up or down) to get back to that "sweet spot".

VW. User tries different watts to find the "sweet spot"; then "locks-in" the watts. As user changes atty's, cart's, stardusts, etc (of varying ohms), the VW automatically adjusts the volts up or down to maintain the watts.

So.... Watts="sweet spot"

That's fine if when you change attys, cartos, etc you're still using the same juice. Though most people change those items as part of changing to a different flavor. What happens when you change juice? You manually adjust the wattage to find the sweet spot for that juice. LOL

And "VW" is still a misnomer since you're varying the voltage to maintain the wattage. "CW" (constant wattage) would probably be a more accurate moniker for those types of devices. That's all I'm saying there.

As far as automatically adjusting wattage to compensate for resistance changes, it sounds really nice and is great advertising hype to help sell the the product as "something completely different". But I assure you unless you have a defective coil, those changes in resistance are pretty minute. I'd think they would hardly be enough to make a noticable difference in flavor.

Also, in a regulated circuit that maintains a steady output voltage, it should automatically increase or decrease the current (which directly affects wattage) as the load resisitance changes in order to maintain the desired voltage across the load. So once again we're talking the same result, just simply monitoring a different variable of the same equation.

Now I've not tried to say that they're exactly the same or one may not be a little better than the other. I'd need to see the circuitry schematics for each device to determine that. There are many different techniques and circuit configurations capable of doing similar things, so it really comes down to the designers intentions, feasabilty restricted by space, and whatever impact keeping costs down might have had.

What I am saying is that there may not be as much difference between the two devices as people are led to believe.

 

[DaveP]

VV or VW, it still boils down to roughly the same thing as operating a dimmer switch. You adjust it until it's right, and then leave it alone. Unless you change coil resistance, you don't need to do it again. Yes, coils will change resistance slightly when wet or dry, but we are talking about .1 to .2 ohms difference. The 3 ohm carto I have on my Provari is actually 2.9 ohms. I have actually seen it change once to 2.7 when checked, but I was just playing and never noticed the difference in the vape. If it changes to 2 ohms or 0 ohms, I will notice.

 

[jkmtwo]

Randy C great post

I'm not putting down VV guys, I'm only noting the difference, they are different, and 2 different animals is all I'm saying, I love my Provari, and I use it daily, but it is also not my Darwin, or not my Kicked Legacy, in some ways I like it more, in some ways I like them more.

If i were to put a noob on a bigger battery device, which I have recently done, it wouldn't be the provari, it would be what I did exactly, a kicked mechanical mod, because of the ease of use.

 

[Randy C]

That's fine if when you change attys, cartos, etc you're still using the same juice. Though most people change those items as part of changing to a different flavor. What happens when you change juice? You manually adjust the wattage to find the sweet spot for that juice. LOL

And "VW" is still a misnomer since you're varying the voltage to maintain the wattage. "CW" (constant wattage) would probably be a more accurate moniker for those types of devices. That's all I'm saying there.

As far as automatically adjusting wattage to compensate for resistance changes, it sounds really nice and is great advertising hype to help sell the the product as "something completely different". But I assure you unless you have a defective coil, those changes in resistance are pretty minute. I'd think they would hardly be enough to make a noticable difference in flavor.

Also, in a regulated circuit that maintains a steady output voltage, it should automatically increase or decrease the current (which directly affects wattage) as the load resisitance changes in order to maintain the desired voltage across the load. So once again we're talking the same result, just simply monitoring a different variable of the same equation.

Now I've not tried to say that they're exactly the same or one may not be a little better than the other. I'd need to see the circuitry schematics for each device to determine that. There are many different techniques and circuit configurations capable of doing similar things, so it really comes down to the designers intentions, feasabilty restricted by space, and whatever impact keeping costs down might have had.

What I am saying is that there may not be as much difference between the two devices as people are led to believe.

You didn't read my post properly. In paragraph one and three, you reference that I said something about "adjusting watts". I never said anything like that

 

[Randy C]

Randy C great post

I'm not putting down VV guys, I'm only noting the difference, they are different, and 2 different animals is all I'm saying, I love my Provari, and I use it daily, but it is also not my Darwin, or not my Kicked Legacy, in some ways I like it more, in some ways I like them more.

If i were to put a noob on a bigger battery device, which I have recently done, it wouldn't be the provari, it would be what I did exactly, a kicked mechanical mod, because of the ease of use.

Thanks jkmtwo. I understand what you're trying to say. As much as I like the Provari, a kicked mod was actually more attractive to me! Just sick and tired of waiting around for the "Kick"

At the end of the day... I just want a device that is reliable and consistent in performance

 

[Randy C]

As far as automatically adjusting wattage to compensate for resistance changes, it sounds really nice and is great advertising hype to help sell the the product as "something completely different". But I assure you unless you have a defective coil, those changes in resistance are pretty minute. I'd think they would hardly be enough to make a noticable difference in flavor.

Again, I never said "adjusting wattage to compensate for resistance changes". I said "adjusting VOLTS to compensate for resistance changes"

It sounds like you are not an advocate of Darwin and Kick performance, but I'm not sure how you can even argue your point without first understanding what they claim to do

 

[Smokalo]

Both are great, I like the Silver Bullet because it's built like a tank but if aesthetics are important to you than the Provari gets the edge. I see many people saying that the Silver Bullet is uncomfortable to carry around but it never bothered me.