I have a 50mg base--if I were to take a drag, I'd probably throw up. I'm even having a hard time with 24 mg/ml...
Another article on the Juul
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I have a 50mg base--if I were to take a drag, I'd probably throw up. I'm even having a hard time with 24 mg/ml...
It doesn't scare me, but I do smell a rat, Robino.
The article says: "juice currently on the market uses freebase nicotine, but that's not how nicotine exists in the real world. "Nicotine in nature is a compound that wants to form and join with the organic acids and salts you find in tobacco leaves," Monsees explains. To that end, Pax developed a juice that's blended with nicotine salts, which supposedly delivers the drug to you in a more similar fashion to combustible cigarettes."
So my question is as follows: If Pax really developed ejuice that somewhat mimics smoking/makes the nic more (faster) bioavailable, then why did they have to up the nic concentration all the way to 50 (or 59 mg/ml)???? Shouldn't it be the other way around? If their nic is so fast working compared to the "free base" eliquids, why do we need to triple and quadruple the nicotine concentration???
Not really. Not if we're comparing apples to apples--1 puff of a traditional 12 mg eliquid vs 1 puff of 59 mg/ml eliquid.
Rememember to take the gear power into account. It strongly influences how much liquid (and thus nic) will be vaporized per puff.
Isn't at least one of the BT cigalikes (Vuse?) at 48 mg/ml?So my question is as follows: If Pax really developed ejuice that somewhat mimics smoking/makes the nic more (faster) bioavailable, then why did they have to up the nic concentration all the way to 50 (or 59 mg/ml)???? Shouldn't it be the other way around? If their nic is so fast working compared to the "free base" eliquids, why do we need to triple and quadruple the nicotine concentration???
If you read their patent (I only skimmed it), it seems the reason the reason they chose benzoic acid is because the benzoate salt (would you call that nicotine benzoate?) has a boiling point that allows it to become a gas in the vapor stream. I'd guess a gas can be absorbed into the bloodstream much faster than tiny liquid droplets.
That's not what we're talking about--of course you're right, but I still get 5 or 6 times more nic PER PUFF from Juul, assuming that the wattage is similar. I'm a low wattage person, BTW.
I haven't used Vuse, but I did try Enjoy when they were offering free samples.
Enjoy disposables come in 36 and 48 mg/ml, iirc. I chose the lower strength and still couldn't vape it. Too high for me. Right--so why do they have to use such high nic levels? I mean, if bioavailability of nicotine is increased, by whatever means and chemistry, why do they have to raise the concentration? It just doesn't make sense to me...
Worried about the deeming? The FDA would have a field day with this. 
Of course they may have their field day anyway....
Of course they may have their field day anyway....Worried about the deeming? The FDA would have a field day with this.
Not anymore. I used to worry. They are going to do what they are going to do, facts be damned.
They need revenue. They don't give rat's behind about our health and/or nic concentrations...
Not anymore. I used to worry. They are going to do what they are going to do, facts be damned.
They need revenue. They don't give rat's behind about our health and/or nic concentrations...
That was for those who may be worried about the deeming
But yeah you're mostly right - the other half it is 'control'.I'm not convinced that the overall bio-availability is higher, just the speed at which it gets into the bloodstream (and thus to the brain). That speed is is something vapor products have lacked over combustible cigarettes, and I believe the lack of it is one reason why so many who try vaping find it unsatisfying and revert to smoking.
If I get some Juul product, one of the things I figure I'll do is to break open one of their pods and cut their liquid down to somewhere in 15 mg range that I normally use and see how it works that way in my own gear.
Well, I do think the Juul could be very helpful to smokers wanting to get started with a "safer cigarette." As for what's in the juice, I have been under the impression that the idea behind the nicotine benzoate is to make a much higher concentration of nicotine palatable and perhaps more quickly acting. I know for a fact there's no way I can vape regular juice at a concentration of 59 mg/ml, so whatever they did works. Today, I took the Juul on a ship ride out to sea. There were quite a few smokers at the back of the ship, and I was drinking a bit too. I noticed that with the Juul, I was completely unmoved by the tobacco smoke in a way I never have been before. It was not that the smoke smelled terrible to me, it's that I just didn't feel any need for a cigarette. Weird...
Even though the Juul makes me bullet-proof to tobacco, is super convenient, and seems to last quite a long while, I don't really care for the flavors and the juice often hits my throat too hard. I am a loyal Nicoticket fan, and so I won't be getting used to Juul's flavors any time soon. So far, I find Juul's tobacco flavor to be the most "tolerable," so much so that sometimes I almost feel like I have been smoking. I will continue experimenting around with the Juul, but I do find myself using my Nauti quite a bit too for the flavor.
Even though the Juul makes me bullet-proof to tobacco, is super convenient, and seems to last quite a long while, I don't really care for the flavors and the juice often hits my throat too hard. I am a loyal Nicoticket fan, and so I won't be getting used to Juul's flavors any time soon. So far, I find Juul's tobacco flavor to be the most "tolerable," so much so that sometimes I almost feel like I have been smoking. I will continue experimenting around with the Juul, but I do find myself using my Nauti quite a bit too for the flavor.
That was for those who may be worried about the deeming
I really hoped "they" would listen to us. I did my share--I answered every call to action, I wrote letters, sent emails, told my story, submitted links to all relevant studies... IOW, I did what was was under my control. Now it's their move. We'll still have a couple of years to stock up--worst case scenario. What else can we do? Screw them.
This is the most baffling part to me. Hmmm... What's the highest nic level you can vape without getting woozy, BTW?
I might give this Juul a try. While I still can.
I think that in the worst case scenario, it is the cigalikes that will survive and be regulated just like combustible cigarettes. I can seen how many of the cigalike companies are trying to get into position for the future.
This is the most baffling part to me. Hmmm... What's the highest nic level you can vape without getting woozy, BTW?
I might give this Juul a try. While I still can.
Not woozy, but coughing up my guts. It is my windpipe that is the limiting factor--thanks to all those years of smoking cigarettes.
I wonder if what Rossum thought about doing might be something to consider.
Taking a 1/2 Full Pod and then Filling it up with a Similar Nicoticket Flavor?
Or if you do DIY, filling the 1/2 Full Pod with some VG or PG?
I get woozy... And my heart rate goes through the roof at 36 per...
I did some 42mg about a day or so after this Thread Started. I loaded it up with Sucralose because it was Hard to Vape Unflavored.
After about 5 Minutes and Maybe 9 Hits, I said... "I'll let Someone else take one for Science. Because I'm getting a Nicotine Headache."
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