Change ECF Classifieds Rules to not allow profiteering !

[TommyGunBC]

I'm sick and tired of members constantly buying and selling hard to obtain vape gear for just sheer profit

this is a Community ,and community is about sharing and helping others not making $

the classifieds have for some turned into a small business , where they are making up to 200% profit of some items tax free and this needs to stop now !

 

[Mr.Mann]

It would be hard to regulate on the side of not allowing for profit at all, but banning the "profiteers" may be a little easier to manage since they generally are so far over the line. (edit) Not that I necessarily think it should be.

 

[TommyGunBC]

It would be hard to regulate on the side of not allowing for profit at all, but banning the "profiteers" may be a little easier to to manage since they generally are so far over the line.

I don't think it would be to hard to regulate as the mods seem to swoop in on anyone making comments about a price of a item for sale and have it removed , same thing could be done with scalping

 

[Smoot]

I don't think it would be to hard to regulate as the mods seem to swoop in on anyone making comments about a price of a item for sale and have it removed , same thing could be done with scalping

Seeing all the posts removed by mods about pricing is disturbing. We can run a vendor out by posting negative reviews, but not a seller out for profit. And to think of the hoops I jumped through to become "verified" Just to view marked up products.......I don't think I would sell on here at retail for the fear of it being turned for profit. Sad

 

[Anoob2]

I have seen this topic alot. And i agree and disagree with it. It really all comes down to the buyer. If they want to pay over the top prices that is their choice. If no one will pay the prices they will come down. I myself would never pay double for a mod or anything if i can just wait. But if i want something now and it is hard to find or i would have to wait i know i would pay a little extra to have it now.

 

[gthompson]

What is forcing you to buy from these "profiteers"?

 

[Mr.Mann]

I don't think it would be to hard to regulate as the mods seem to swoop in on anyone making comments about a price of a item for sale and have it removed , same thing could be done with scalping

I mean, how can you tell, or a mod, how much some mesh, batteries, or other "accessories" costs? There are a ton of places to get some of that stuff that can have vastly different prices. What I am saying is, there are some products that are a little less specified about costs. Obviously certain things can be checked, but not all. I am aware that the price gauging is not over mesh, batteries, wire, drip tips and such, but I am just making a point.

Personally, no matter what I sell on the classifieds, even if unused, I will always sell for a little cheaper. I also try and sell to those who I know are not buying for any other reason than to get their foot in the door.

 

[TommyGunBC]

I totally get the supply and demand aspect of some of these hard to obtain products , but I feel there should be a sub section in the classifieds for these scalpers , that they must pay a premium to use , sort of like ebay maybe a auction section ?

People wait months for things like the Zenesis products and , it just tweaks me to see people who know they don't want them buy them up just to turn a profit . Zen the creator of the Zenesis line of products is against this type of behaviour , his wishes of not turning a profit should be followed.

 

[kickitback]

I dont like it either but I can care less about sellers who price their items X2 or more. If someone is stupid enough to buy it vs wait for a better deal let him/her have it. ECF can not tell anybody how to price their item or set retail sale price only. some mods are very hard to find or custom made, there is no way for anybody to set a retail price on it and in cases like that its up to the buyers to decide if they want to pay as much.
Same thing goes on ebay, lots of sellers overprice their items or add crazy amounts to the shipping, no one is banned and ebay is not restricting the seller to a price, just dont make sense.

Only thing we can do is pay attention and see who buy and sell for pure profit ( not hard to tell when someone has 100 posts and 90 of them in the classified ) and stay away.

 

[Mr.Mann]

I totally get the supply and demand aspect of some of these hard to obtain products , but I feel there should be a sub section in the classifieds for these scalpers , that they must pay a premium to use , sort of like ebay maybe a auction section ?

People wait months for things like the Zenesis products and , it just tweaks me to see people who know they don't want them buy them up just to turn a profit . Zen the creator of the Zenesis line of products is against this type of behaviour , his wishes of not turning a profit should be followed.

That makes sense and it does suck that people do it, but it happens everywhere. Now, considering how many rules this forum has, it stands to reason that there could be some rules on this as well. As much as I want a ZAP, I will only be buying mine for $149.00 (give or take a couple bucks) plus shipping, no matter who it comes from. If I miss it, then I miss it.

 

[Katz123]

Here in Canada, if you sell more than 12 cars in a year you must have a dealers licence. Something like that could easily be put in place here. I can understand buying something, getting it and feeling it was not for you and selling it. But to have a classified feedback score in the 100's and plus screams dealer to me. I think there should be a limit to the number of sales per year/month etc.

I also think that if the maker has asked for any of his "In Production" products not to be sold for profit this should also be followed as a rule in the classifieds.

 

[Mr.Mann]

I think this topic is a fantastic issue to debate. I can see literal debate teams in my head going back and forth on this issue.

I am thinking though, while it may be different than out right selling something for a profit, if someone came up to me and offered to buy my prized PV for $500, you better believe I would sell it. It's not the same thing...or is it?

 

[TommyGunBC]

Here in Canada, if you sell more than 12 cars in a year you must have a dealers licence. Something like that could easily be put in place here. I can understand buying something, getting it and feeling it was not for you and selling it. But to have a classified feedback score in the 100's and plus screams dealer to me. I think there should be a limit to the number of sales per year/month etc.

I also think that if the maker has asked for any of his "In Production" products not to be sold for profit this should also be followed as a rule in the classifieds.

I agree fully , there should be a limit on # of sales , the same people are selling day in day out

 

[Jonner]

I'm torn about this. Here's an example for ya. I'm an avid fly-fisher with several hard to get rare fly rods that I'm not using because I have other ones I prefer. Why shouldn't I sell a fly-rod for twice what it originally cost if there's a willing buyer and otherwise it will just be lying around unused? On the other hand, I don't think I should buy a product just to turn around and flip it. But, what if I was to quit vaping, should I then be limited to sell my hard to acquire item (Zenesis ASH) for what it cost me-retail? So there it is, I'm terribly conflicted. But I think, in the end, let the marketplace dictate the price.

 

[Jonner]

Then again, I had a Denali (by Mamu) and sold it for cost to a member here, just because he wanted one, I had one, and it turned out to be a "not for me" mod.

 

[Katz123]

Is it possible that the part that has you conflicted or confused is: Zen~ does not want the APV's that are still being manufactured to sell for profit, but has no problem with the one of a kind runs selling for profit. So ASH, AYS, are OK but Mini and Standard and the 3 Z-Atty designs are NOT OK. I hope this clears up some of the confusion for people.

I'm torn about this. Here's an example for ya. I'm an avid fly-fisher with several hard to get rare fly rods that I'm not using because I have other ones I prefer. Why shouldn't I sell a fly-rod for twice what it originally cost if there's a willing buyer and otherwise it will just be lying around unused? On the other hand, I don't think I should buy a product just to turn around and flip it. But, what if I was to quit vaping, should I then be limited to sell my hard to acquire item (Zenesis ASH) for what it cost me-retail? So there it is, I'm terribly conflicted. But I think, in the end, let the marketplace dictate the price.

 

[18SixFifty]

I haven't bothered to become "verified" because it looks like a pain in the rear end and I can't stand evilbay/payscam and that seems like the only way to get on. This type of attitude makes me even less likely to care. If I wanted something at standard price I would shop around. I have tons of stuff I could sell, literally hundreds of items. However, I'm not going to spend my life running to the post office for free. I give away enough stuff locally. Isn't there already a pay it forward? Honestly I have hundreds of batteries, connectors, atties, chargers, bottles, boxes, buttons, older mods, etc., that I would be glad to unload, but not if it's going to cost me money to do it. I also have no intention of making a business out of my hobby. I honestly don't understand the point of restricting a classified section. It makes no sense to me at all. So I guess my extra stuff will just gather dust.

 

[Jonner]

Is it possible that the part that has you conflicted or confused is: Zen! does not want the APV's that are still being manufactured to sell for profit, but has no problem with the one of a kind runs selling for profit. So ASH, AYS, are ok but Mini and Standard and the 3 Z-Atty designs are not OK. I hope this clears up some of the confusion for people.

Oh, I'm just conflicted all around. I knew that Zen didn't want his APV's being sold for profit but I didn't know it was ok for the one of a kinds. Not that I plan on selling my ASH anytime soon anyway. And thanks for the info, that's good to know, and I'm sure many are just as unaware of that as I was.

 

[Katz123]

If your prized PV is still being manufactured you could be considered a crook, if it is no longer being manufactured then go for it. This is how the market should be, but sadly, with the "I want it NOW" mentality, that is not how things have been going. This is what is driving the scalpers to inflate the prices. Also saying how rare and hard to get an item is, should not be part of a classified ad for something that is going on sale again next week.

I think this topic is a fantastic issue to debate. I can see literal debate teams in my head going back and forth on this issue.

I am thinking though, while it may be different than out right selling something for a profit, if someone came up to me and offered to buy my prized PV for $500, you better believe I would sell it. It's not the same thing...or is it?

p.s. A limit on sales is not that bad of an idea.

 

[grruss]

All of these comparisons to eBay are moot. eBay is an auction site. Auctions are not allowed on the ECF classifieds. What if they were? What if it were an auction site with a "Buy It Now" option. I could put my Zenesis Ti on for whataver "Buy It Now" price I want, and then let the market decide.

On second thought, not a good idea. It would encourage the businesses that are being run on the classifieds even more. AND, make no mistake about it, there are businesses being run in the classifieds.