Cold maceration of tobacco
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Extracting flavored tobaccos generally results in a bit more subtle level of taste than adding flavors post extraction. Most flavors come through the cold soak process just fine and can add interest to the juice. The Kuba Kuba cigar I extracted last round is highly flavored resulting in a very flavorful extract. However, in many blends the flavor is very lightly cased in the tobacco resulting in an almost undetectable flavor when vaped.
I have been using Pipes and Cigars for years and know the president very well.
You cannot go wrong with the Daughters and Ryan tobacco. Mark Ryan the owner is the owner of the St. James Parish Perique and it's sold blended as SJ Rimboche. I love that whole line of tobacco. The descriptions are very accurate and this used to be mainly used for RYO/MYO until the tax act forced it to be called pipe tobacco with a 2-4mm cut. Good stuff!
You cannot go wrong with the Daughters and Ryan tobacco. Mark Ryan the owner is the owner of the St. James Parish Perique and it's sold blended as SJ Rimboche. I love that whole line of tobacco. The descriptions are very accurate and this used to be mainly used for RYO/MYO until the tax act forced it to be called pipe tobacco with a 2-4mm cut. Good stuff!
3 week mark today for my batch. I now wish I had taken that remainder of the pouch and done it in another jar. Then I would be filtering that batch tomorrow to compare 3 weeks to 4 weeks. I'm sooooo impatient.
johni, just wondering what the average ambient temp is approximately, where you put your jars? Asking because I am doing a few cold macerations and winter is coming on down here, my house is not heated, the average temp is around 60 degrees F. Another question, have you tried leaving the tobacco mix in the jars for 2 or 3 months, is there any noticeable difference?
I'm doing some small cold macerations - White Ox (again), Luxury Navy Flake, Virginia Flake and Bali Nature American RYO. Would love to get my hands on some Daughters and Ryan tobacco but would need a mule and import tax is 50c a gram, so I'll just keep chipping away at what I can get locally, so far its been good. I also have some hot macerations going but now that I have enough juice, I can handle the wait time for cold macerations. Paul - you are showing great restraint, I know its not easy to wait...I hope your American Spirit turns out as good as the NET.com juices you bought.
I'm doing some small cold macerations - White Ox (again), Luxury Navy Flake, Virginia Flake and Bali Nature American RYO. Would love to get my hands on some Daughters and Ryan tobacco but would need a mule and import tax is 50c a gram, so I'll just keep chipping away at what I can get locally, so far its been good. I also have some hot macerations going but now that I have enough juice, I can handle the wait time for cold macerations. Paul - you are showing great restraint, I know its not easy to wait...I hope your American Spirit turns out as good as the NET.com juices you bought.
Ian, the temperature in the room where my soaks are is typically in the mid 60s during winter. It hit 84 in here earlier this week and I'd guess that might speed things up a bit.
I haven't run any soaks past 35 days and I'm happy with the level of flavor achieved. I have pulled small samples at two and three weeks several times. At two weeks you can tell it isn't ready. After three weeks it doesn't seem to change all that much. The extracts do gain some intensity over time (after filtering and bottling), level off, then they lose some flavor after extended storage (according the billherbst). Like most NETs, juice made from home extractions benefits from a week or two of steeping.
The cold maceration method definitely requires some patience but after you bottle, mix, and steep some of your own creations, you have plenty of good juice on hand. If not, PM me and I'll send you a little.
Relax, have a vape, and enjoy!
I haven't run any soaks past 35 days and I'm happy with the level of flavor achieved. I have pulled small samples at two and three weeks several times. At two weeks you can tell it isn't ready. After three weeks it doesn't seem to change all that much. The extracts do gain some intensity over time (after filtering and bottling), level off, then they lose some flavor after extended storage (according the billherbst). Like most NETs, juice made from home extractions benefits from a week or two of steeping.
The cold maceration method definitely requires some patience but after you bottle, mix, and steep some of your own creations, you have plenty of good juice on hand. If not, PM me and I'll send you a little.
Relax, have a vape, and enjoy!
OK lost my patience today and dumped it out. First into a cold wire coffee filter, second into a melitta natural cone filter. Have about half a coffee mug of liquid. I'm guessing around 3oz 90ml. $6 of the pouch, <$3 pg, around $9 for 90ml is .10/ml cheaper than a lot of flavorings and wayyyyy cheaper than what NET charges, 60ml $111.
At worst, I wasted $12 plus a few dollars worth of nic mix if I toss it all out.
Put some cotton ball down a 60ml syringe, poured the liquid into a funnel in the syringe. Forced it.
Ended up with at least 3oz of liquid. Clear and color of flat cola.
There may have been some good stuff left in the two initial filter collections but down the sink it went. Or it could be the bitters.
Pulled 3ml of extract, 9ml of 50/50 18mg. That should be 12ml of 12mg 66/33 pg/vg. Steeped long enough to let the dogs out, back in, pour some more coffee. Clean out my RDA, dry burn and rewick.
The extract has a smell to it. Somewhat perfume, food, drink, and tobacco. Can't place it.
The vape as mixed above has a good chest hit, slightly sweet, pleasant, tobacco-y taste but not a bold pouch smell taste.
Overall I'm happy and, understatement, can't wait, for it to steep a while and see how it changes.
Thanks johni for mentoring us. I wish I had the diligence to perform proper test to see if shorting the filtering is better or if the dregs have the good stuff.
As Scotty says, vape your juice, vape it!
Put some cotton ball down a 60ml syringe, poured the liquid into a funnel in the syringe. Forced it.
Ended up with at least 3oz of liquid. Clear and color of flat cola.
There may have been some good stuff left in the two initial filter collections but down the sink it went. Or it could be the bitters.
Pulled 3ml of extract, 9ml of 50/50 18mg. That should be 12ml of 12mg 66/33 pg/vg. Steeped long enough to let the dogs out, back in, pour some more coffee. Clean out my RDA, dry burn and rewick.
The extract has a smell to it. Somewhat perfume, food, drink, and tobacco. Can't place it.
The vape as mixed above has a good chest hit, slightly sweet, pleasant, tobacco-y taste but not a bold pouch smell taste.
Overall I'm happy and, understatement, can't wait, for it to steep a while and see how it changes.
Thanks johni for mentoring us. I wish I had the diligence to perform proper test to see if shorting the filtering is better or if the dregs have the good stuff.
As Scotty says, vape your juice, vape it!
I live in Vegas and do a "Sun Maceration", I take advantage of the Sun by sitting my maceration's in the Kitchen Window. I usually steep my Cigars ~28-32 days and my Pipe Blends ~20-24 days, and burp my jars every 3-4 days to relieve any possible pressure build-up, and have a quick sniff to check the aroma.
Johnni,
A couple of questions, if I may.
Have you tried a flavour infused extraction such as soaking in a spirit or a fruit flavour? Do you know how this would be done. I'd love to try a variety of spirit infused extractions such as rum, bourbon or whiskey.
Would this sort of filler paper listed on the link below be the type I ought to be using? I notice they have a range of micron rather than a specific micron. (5-8 micron, 10-20 micron).
http://www.anpros.com.au/laboratory-filtration-products/150mm-filter-paper/
Also, could I ask, have you experimented with extracting a cigar? Is it just a matter of chopping it up and soaking it in the PG as well.
A couple of questions, if I may.
Have you tried a flavour infused extraction such as soaking in a spirit or a fruit flavour? Do you know how this would be done. I'd love to try a variety of spirit infused extractions such as rum, bourbon or whiskey.
Would this sort of filler paper listed on the link below be the type I ought to be using? I notice they have a range of micron rather than a specific micron. (5-8 micron, 10-20 micron).
http://www.anpros.com.au/laboratory-filtration-products/150mm-filter-paper/
Also, could I ask, have you experimented with extracting a cigar? Is it just a matter of chopping it up and soaking it in the PG as well.
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No to using booze in my extractions. I'm an alcoholic in recovery (13 years) so probably won't try that. There are plenty of flavored tobacco blends available so I add nothing else.
The lab filters you linked are fine. I use 15 cm diameter and fold to fit into a funnel. Google how to fold it. Filter paper is rated by the smallest particulates it will capture. If you use one that is too fine (rated for extremely small particles), extract will not flow through it. I currently us 11 micron followed by 6 micron and will experiment with 2.5 micron soon.
I extracted an Acid Kuba Deluxe last batch and it came out great. Acid Blondie extracting now. I cut and tear the cigar to bits and extract same as pipe tobacco. It seems cigars don't release their flavor quite as readily so more extraction time may be required. I'm still learning.
The lab filters you linked are fine. I use 15 cm diameter and fold to fit into a funnel. Google how to fold it. Filter paper is rated by the smallest particulates it will capture. If you use one that is too fine (rated for extremely small particles), extract will not flow through it. I currently us 11 micron followed by 6 micron and will experiment with 2.5 micron soon.
I extracted an Acid Kuba Deluxe last batch and it came out great. Acid Blondie extracting now. I cut and tear the cigar to bits and extract same as pipe tobacco. It seems cigars don't release their flavor quite as readily so more extraction time may be required. I'm still learning.
I would be more inclined to make a good batch of straight extract and then add a vape flavoring to some of it. There are some very good spirits flavors that are not spirits. Same with vanilla and chocolate and others.
I prefer straight up or mildly flavored tobacco vapes so if I want one flavored I get a blend with flavor infused. If you like various flavors, you are right Paul, add post extraction. Much simpler.
I do sun tea by putting the pitcher in the kitchen out of the sun. Room temp steep for and hour is just as good to me.
We are usually 10 or more degrees hotter than you in summer and I fear that a jar in the sun would reach 140-150f, too hot. I'm going to put a thermometer on my computer case above the PSU and see what that is.
Some plant material held in suspension, can react with sunlight and create strange flavors. Don't know if this happens to any detectable level with tobacco but it sure as hell does with hops. Skunky beer anyone?
Cigars are pretty easy to extract.. Just as you thought, use pg and I use heat extraction method. Wait about a week and is fine for acid blonde's ..
Pack Ratting justified again. Found a wired indoor outdoor digital thermo that I had before the wireless one. Put the outdoor probe on the box and the display on the desk. 77 inside, 91 boxtop.
I guess I would have to make two batches of the same thing to see a difference.
I guess I would have to make two batches of the same thing to see a difference.
I figure the window sill temperature is ~15-20 degrees warmer than ambient, strictly a guess, and still well below a simmer. Enough to decrease a Cold Maceration without crystallizing any of the sugars in a pipe or cigar tobacco, and decrease the Cold Maceration time by about 5-7 days or more.
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