"Competition" mods and rdas

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alicewonderland

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well, i never really said they were to 'blame' or i hate that they exist or anything like that. I was just stating my views on why i didnt like cloud chasing, due to the higher hazards/risks contained in doing so compared to normally vaping. Anyone I ever get in a discussion with about me not liking cloud chasing seems to always misread everything I say and act like im attacking cloud chasing. I agree that the flavors of vaping intrigued me when i started as well and it can be used against us like you say, but i was mostly keeping to the discussion of the thread and not widening my views just to keep on topic, im not being a hipocrit. i just dislike 'competition' products because it attracts people to a subculture with higher hazards/risks.
 
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drunkenbatman

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well, i never really said they were to 'blame' or i hate that they exist or anything like that. I was just stating my views on why i didnt like cloud chasing, due to the higher hazards/risks contained in doing so compared to normally vaping. Anyone I ever get in a discussion with about me not liking cloud chasing seems to always misread everything I say and act like im attacking cloud chasing. I agree that the flavors of vaping intrigued me when i started as well and it can be used against us like you say, but i was mostly keeping to the discussion of the thread and not widening my views just to keep on topic, im not being a hipocrit.

No worries, we're just having a discussion and exposing each other to different ways of thinking -- we cool.

The important thing is you don't put ketchup on your hot dogs or sausages, right?
 

InTheShade

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well, i never really said they were to 'blame' or i hate that they exist or anything like that. I was just stating my views on why i didnt like cloud chasing, due to the higher hazards/risks contained in doing so compared to normally vaping. Anyone I ever get in a discussion with about me not liking cloud chasing seems to always misread everything I say and act like im attacking cloud chasing. I agree that the flavors of vaping intrigued me when i started as well and it can be used against us like you say, but i was mostly keeping to the discussion of the thread and not widening my views just to keep on topic, im not being a hipocrit. i just dislike 'competition' products because it attracts people to a subculture with higher hazards/risks.

Not judging you at all, I've actually enjoyed the discussion :)
 

InTheShade

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The important thing is you don't put ketchup on your hot dogs or sausages, right?

You got to stop obsessing over this DB, it's OK for people to be different remember?

You know I once dated a girl that didn't like sausages... it was the darndest thing (and yes, I am fully aware of the plethora of replies you could make to this). She didn't like mashed taters either.

Like I think she was a communist, but it's OK for people to be different remember.
 
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InTheShade

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man, i dont put ketchup on my hotdogs. I dip my hotdogs in ketchup. I actually do sometimes when i have no buns but just want to eat one hotdog :p

Dipping in ketchup, eating hot dogs with no bun?... good lord, you ever seen drunken batman have a conniption fit - because you are about to.
 
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drunkenbatman

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crying-indian-1.gif
 

Asbestos4004

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man, i dont put ketchup on my hotdogs. I dip my hotdogs in ketchup. I actually do sometimes when i have no buns but just want to eat one hotdog :p
As far as I know, there's Hot Dog eating competitions. I've yet to see a contestant put ketchup on one and, so far, these competition hot dog eaters haven't ruined hot dogs for the people who just like eating hot dogs at a baseball game. These competition hot dog eaters probably represent the same percentage of hot dog eaters as cloud chasers do for vaping....maybe 5%, if that?
I think it's funny to see "competition..." on a piece of vape gear but it doesn't bother me very much. I'd be really surprised if cloud chasing had any impact whatsoever on future regulation or laws. There are far more eGo related fires and accidents because 90% or so are using ego/clearo type set ups. I don't think that will have any effect on regulation either. Why? because an exploding battery at a cloud competition or an ego fire in Joeys bedroom doesn't cost big tobacco a dime. Money...that is what will force regulation and extreme taxing. As more people quit smoking with vaping, the more the word gets out that there is a way to quit smoking...the more $$$ Big Tobacco and Big Pharma lose. Vaping has blown up over the last 2 years...it's not because of cloud chasing, it's because it works. Cloud chasers have a lot to do with why it works so good these days. They're why you can finally buy a clearomizer that doesn't suck.
 
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Asbestos4004

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"Competition" on a mod or dripper is kind of like putting "Limited" on a car/crossover/SUV because you added leather and charging 5k more for it. It is all hype...

It may not be the most accurate analogy, but I am too tired, busy, and lazy to think about a better one right now.
Actually...I think it's a great analogy!
 

alicewonderland

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I'd be really surprised if cloud chasing had any impact whatsoever on future regulation or laws. There are far more eGo related fires and accidents because 90% or so are using ego/clearo type set ups. I don't think that will have any effect on regulation either. Why? because an exploding battery at a cloud competition or an ego fire in Joeys bedroom doesn't cost big tobacco a dime.

im not worried about cloud chasing 'directly' effecting future regulation or laws that will be put in place regardless. Where im coming from is the fact that,if an exploding battery at a cloud competition happens, lots of people see it compared to ego batteries exploding in joeys bedroom. its the bad publicity that people will use to demonize ecigs. Of course, i would blame the user himself for not being knowledgable of the limits of his setup or the manufacturer for faulty product, but if the people who are fighting against us get a hold of this type of media attention they are able to twist it into something that will help them push against us. I mean it already happened at a big event and was publicized, the vape meets/events are getting larger and larger every year, and those kind of stuff will stick in people sminds because of the growing interest in vaping and higher amounts of people attending these kind of events. back when vape meets were only in the two figure attendance numbers, i wouldnt bet against stuff having malfunctioned or people misusing mods to the point of danger, but word not spreading. but with us growing to hundreds maybe thousands of people per vape meets with big companies at these events, if an incident happens again it will get way more media attention.

the more popular vaping gets the more regulation it will get, i mean its already starting to be regulated, and the thing we can do is keep fighting for our rights to prevent harsher restrictions from coming out. vaping is harmless compared to smoking, but laws are being made that treat vaping on equal ground to smoking, if not even worse. the more it grows the more publicity it will get and when things happen, laws will be made to prevent those things from happening again.

I am just in favor of trying to prevent those laws from getting worse, as long as possible, to keep prices down, to keep vaping a business that can exist in the U.S., anything that can prevent the inevitable total FDA regulation of our tobacco alternative products, which would raise prices of everything due to the fact that people in the U.S. would have to pay to have their products tested before they can sell them to the public, and if that ever happens, it will destroy the vaping industry and further raise products that are made and sold in the U.S. Right now U.S. made and sold product cant come close to competing with chinese product pricing. Im willing to bet the majority of the vaping community buy clones and product that are made in china. What if those prices were raised higher due to the fact that the companies had to have their products tested by the FDA before they are able to sell them? No one would buy them, and we would further keep having to go overseas and contribute to someone elses economy.

The majority of the starter businesses in the U.S. made money by making e-liquids, which they make a huge profit margin on because if you buy bulk materials it is DIRT cheap, where 'gourmet' and boutiquey style 30ml bottles cost upwards of 20$+ dollars, making it yourself you can spend 20$ to make over 300ml of eliquid. If you think prices of eliquid are high now, if the FDA ever regulate it it will cost more than double that price just for the business to make back the ridiculous amount of money (that only big companies can afford) they have to pay to get EACH eliquid flavoring tested and be able to sell.

that was long winded but like i said before, the sole reason I dislike 'competition-vaping' is because it raises the risks of things going wrong/malfunctioning. vaping on mechs already contains its own dangers, if it didnt then there wouldnt be stickies about battery safety on this forum.
 
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Asbestos4004

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im not worried about cloud chasing 'directly' effecting future regulation or laws that will be put in place regardless. Where im coming from is the fact that,if an exploding battery at a cloud competition happens, lots of people see it compared to ego batteries exploding in joeys bedroom. its the bad publicity that people will use to demonize ecigs. Of course, i would blame the user himself for not being knowledgable of the limits of his setup or the manufacturer for faulty product, but if the people who are fighting against us get a hold of this type of media attention they are able to twist it into something that will help them push against us.
I sort of agree with you...BUT...we read these forums a lot. Again, a small percentage of vapers participate on these boards. We're considered "enthusiasts". The majority of people using ecigs to stop smokong have never even heard of ECF or any other forum. I only heard of the Vapeblast incident on forums....the place where extreme vapers are pitted against standard vapers in a death match. There may be more talk of battery venting or injury in sub ohm/ cloud chasing threads but actual incidents are rare. I never saw that the Vapeblast incident got national news coverage but I've seen some major news outlets cover fires from an ecig, a baby drinking e liquid, illegal drugs being used in ecig devices.....
We tend to give cloud chasing more credit than it deserves. It's only front and center around this tiny percentage of of the community that watches videos and plays around on forums.
 

alicewonderland

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. The majority of people using ecigs to stop smokong have never even heard of ECF

thats the thing that scares me. we are just a small percentage of people who vape, and from what ive experienced outside of ECF, most people are not informed of these issues. They spread misknowledge to people, and I personally know people who wanted or did get into mech mods who dont even use forums/boards to educate themselves. They just listen to what people tell them and believe its true and thats how it works. I actually had to tell one of my friends that him trying to build a <0.2ohm coil was dangerous because his battery cant handle the draw. He had no clue about pairing batteries with resistance to make sure it was safe. Also know a few people IRL who tried to DIY eliquid, and I had to tell them the reason the liquid they are vaping is real harsh is because they are vaping 60mg nicotine and that is hazardous to their health and potentially life threatening if they spill it on themselves. Ran into 2 local vape shops that try to sell me mech mods and tell me my DNA30 device 'cant handle the ohms a rebuildable atomizer produces', I assumed they have no clue what they are building on their RDA's, or have no clue that you actually build the coils to your own ohms/resistance.

True there are places that help and are knowledgable that exist, but there are also the type of shops and types of people I mentioned that dont get help or attention from anyone. Someone going into mech mods and advanced vaping without safety information, has all the resources to order and buy whatever they want but will not understand it unless they themselves put in the effort to learn the correct way to do things. All the vape shops around me focus on mech mods, and are always cloudy with vapor and filled with people blowing huge clouds, which is alluring to the type of people who would compete in a cloud chasing competition.
 
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ReigntheGamer

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There is always no matter what going to be that "one guy/girl" that jumps into something without researching or educating themselves on what they're doing. This is where accidents occur, it has nothing to do with cloud chasing or competitions since the majority of people do it safely or every other day we would be reading about someone "blowing" themselves up.

So I would lean towards blaming the people who just want the fast track to "huge clouds brah" and completely ignore any and all safety protocols and education about what they are getting into. Rather than a whole group of people enjoying a certain aspect of vaping.
 

Asbestos4004

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thats the thing that scares me. we are just a small percentage of people who vape, and from what ive experienced outside of ECF, most people are not informed of these issues. They spread misknowledge to people, and I personally know people who wanted or did get into mech mods who dont even use forums/boards to educate themselves. They just listen to what people tell them and believe its true and thats how it works. I actually had to tell one of my friends that him trying to build a <0.2ohm coil was dangerous because his battery cant handle the draw. He had no clue about pairing batteries with resistance to make sure it was safe. Also know a few people IRL who tried to DIY eliquid, and I had to tell them the reason the liquid they are vaping is real harsh is because they are vaping 60mg nicotine and that is hazardous to their health and potentially life threatening if they spill it on themselves. Ran into 2 local vape shops that try to sell me mech mods and tell me my DNA30 device 'cant handle the ohms a rebuildable atomizer produces', I assumed they have no clue what they are building on their RDA's, or have no clue that you actually build the coils to your own ohms/resistance.
I can see those situations doing far more damage to our cause than competition stuff or cloud chasing.
 

alicewonderland

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So I would lean towards blaming the people who just want the fast track to "huge clouds brah" and completely ignore any and all safety protocols and education about what they are getting into.

:p

again im not blaming cloud chasers, im simply not supporting cloud chasing/competitions because it 'supports' that type of subculture that would attract the kind of people im mentioning. Also you cannot completely ignore protocols and education when most of the products has no instructions. If the products came with instructions and there were preventative measures in place then hell i wouldn't give a rats .... about competition vaping.
 
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ReigntheGamer

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:p

again im not blaming cloud chasers, im simply not supporting cloud chasing/competitions because it 'supports' that type of subculture that would attract the kind of people im mentioning. Also you cannot completely ignore protocols and education when most of the products has no instructions.

Saying that the FDA is going to regulate us more heavily because of cloud chasers, competitions, and competition labeled products is kind of blaming. But my views are skewed, in my first month of vaping I had a mech mod and what some would call a competition RDA (MutX) but I had also spent hours on end reading about build and battery safety before I ever fired it up. Neither of them came with instructions but to me they are so simple if you know what you're doing you don't need any.

But having said that I also didn't buy it from a B&M who built my coils in it, slapped a battery in it and then sent me on my way with a fully functioning mech/RDA without having a clue to what I was vaping on. I saw a mech wanted to know what it was and did the research and didn't stop until I felt safe to use one, that is something you can't force people to do even by including a manual. Honestly if a maker of a set up were to try and include everything I read before firing mine up the manual would be about 100 pages long and I doubt any of the people who will get themselves into a bind with it would read it in it's entirety.

To me it falls into the "caution the contents of this cup are hot" mentality, leaving it to manufacturers to completely protect the consumer even when the consumer knows full and well there is some inherent danger with the item they are purchasing. To me the B&M's who are building super low sub ohm coils for people and sending them out the door with them are far more dangerous than mechs and RDA's with no manuals. At least with no manual that may encourage the person to go research a little bit before trying to use it.
 

alicewonderland

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Saying that the FDA is going to regulate us more heavily because of cloud chasers, competitions, and competition labeled products is kind of blaming.

well if you see it as blaming then you can see it as blaming. :p

but on your statement about mech mods being simple if you know what you're doing that you dont need any. How would you know what you are doing if you didnt know what you were doing? it comes with no instructions. These products are available to all people regardless if they do their own research or not.
 
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