FDA may soon propose regulation that could ban many/most e-cigarette products, eliminate many/most companies

[LibertyValance]

THE SKY IS FALLING THE SKY IS FALLING

Seriously folks, lets wait to see what the actual regulation proposed is, how is implemented, etc.

I'm a huge fan of the FDA generally.

They are what makes us different than a banana republic or a place like China where many common products you can purchase can kill you. And don't talk to me about personal responsibility... I don't usually carry a heavy metals or toxins chemistry lab with me when I am out and about.

We NEED regulation of the ecig marketplace. I WANT a product that is regulated by the FDA and where rules are strictly enforced.

Is it possible they'll go overboard? Sure, but the US has been fighting a so called war on drugs forever and yet they are still easily available everywhere so I don't see ecigs going away either anytime soon.

Regulations will greatly improve the quality and safety of ecig products, and not result in any sort of ban, if history is any guide.

 

[Lisa Belle]

hmm? We are dealing with more than a humanitarian Big Government program, and by the looks of the TV ads, for new drugs, every ten minutes, with lists of what could and will go wrong, it's useless government spending anyway you slice it, it might as well be third world, because it's profit driven and health is the last concern of this mega power wielding ineffective black hole of tax payer dollars. Just another opinion, still glad to hear from every thought sphere.

 

[Phi]

THE SKY IS FALLING THE SKY IS FALLING

Seriously folks, lets wait to see what the actual regulation proposed is, how is implemented, etc.

I'm a huge fan of the FDA generally.

They are what makes us different than a banana republic or a place like China where many common products you can purchase can kill you. And don't talk to me about personal responsibility... I don't usually carry a heavy metals or toxins chemistry lab with me when I am out and about.

We NEED regulation of the ecig marketplace. I WANT a product that is regulated by the FDA and where rules are strictly enforced.

Is it possible they'll go overboard? Sure, but the US has been fighting a so called war on drugs forever and yet they are still easily available everywhere so I don't see ecigs going away either anytime soon.

Regulations will greatly improve the quality and safety of ecig products, and not result in any sort of ban, if history is any guide.

What your heroes are proposing to do to improve the quality and safety of electronic cigarettes is to require that they contain tobacco. And in exchange for this marvelous humanitarian value, they will ask only that we pay a couple hundred dollars a month in cigarette-level tobacco taxes.

Most of us here would gladly welcome reasonable regulation (particularly in regards to ensuring the purity and potency of our e-liquids); but our idea of reasonable regulation and their idea of reasonable regulation are two vastly different things.

Therefore, for the sake of the children, please promptly dispose of that Kool-Aid you've been sipping.

 

[Bash123]

Let's be realistic here. You and I know that as the market for ecigs grows somebody somewhere, DC mainly, will tax it. The only way to do so is by regulating it and somehow equate it with Tobacco. What we need is self-imposed regulation. The electronic cigarette manufacturers need to adopt a manifesto and stick to it otherwise something will happen and we will either pay more or get less. The question is, how do we organize ourselves. Let's face it, unless you and me gather enough people and achieve critical mass, we will not be heard. An excellent way to do this is via CASAA. I am just now getting ramped up on what and how they do. As for the comment LibertyValance made about wanting FDA regulation, he is right. The Chinese will not regulate the manufacturing process. I lived in Asia and most of the countries I worked in, from Singapore to Vietnam, made ecigs illegal!! Although they are the ones running the import/export businesses. Any suggestions?

 

[Luisa]

Let's be realistic here. You and I know that as the market for ecigs grows somebody somewhere, DC mainly, will tax it. The only way to do so is by regulating it and somehow equate it with Tobacco. What we need is self-imposed regulation. The electronic cigarette manufacturers need to adopt a manifesto and stick to it otherwise something will happen and we will either pay more or get less. The question is, how do we organize ourselves. Let's face it, unless you and me gather enough people and achieve critical mass, we will not be heard. An excellent way to do this is via CASAA. I am just now getting ramped up on what and how they do. As for the comment LibertyValance made about wanting FDA regulation, he is right. The Chinese will not regulate the manufacturing process. I lived in Asia and most of the countries I worked in, from Singapore to Vietnam, made ecigs illegal!! Although they are the ones running the import/export businesses. Any suggestions?

Join CASAA and become a regional rep and then attend the weekly meetings by Webinar. You will be able to understand the history behind this 4 year fight against the FDA and other "health" organizations.

 

[simply me]

And lets not forget how they regulate our food. Rats run through our veds. and we are allowed to eat so much of rat poop and magets in our food. And our meds give us 1 reason it will help us and 15 reasons why it will kill us. Nobody can convince me this isn't about money, the FDA could care less about our health, just the pocket book. I've been vaping for over 2 and a half yrs. now and have used many many vendors. I have never got sick once. I'll take my chances, FDA will just insert some of there poisons.

 

[sonicdsl]

And lets not forget how they regulate our food. Rats run through our veds. and we are allowed to eat so much of rat poop and magets in our food. And our meds give us 1 reason it will help us and 15 reasons why it will kill us. Nobody can convince me this isn't about money, the FDA could care less about our health, just the pocket book. I've been vaping for over 2 and a half yrs. now and have used many many vendors. I have never got sick once. I'll take my chances, FDA will just insert some of there poisons.

Not to mention, they've told their workers before that their customer is Big Pharma, not the people. (I don't have the source, check w/CASAA). How's that for protecting us?!?

 

[Bill Godshall]

Any vaper who wants Obama appointees at DHHS to impose Chapter IX (of the FSPTCA) regulations on e-cigarettes (as Obama appointees have repeatedly stated is their intent) is either an idiot, is totally ignorant of Obama's FDA e-cigarette prohibition and propaganda campaign since he became President in 2009, and/or has not read (or comprehended) the dozens of provisions in Chapter IX that will decimate (if not destroy) the e-cigarette industry.

Besides Obama, all of the members of US Congress who have urged the FDA to ban/regulate e-cigarettes are Democrats, as are all members of Congress who have cosponsored legislation to tax e-cigarettes at the same rate as cigarettes.

Two weeks ago, Congress' most vehement opponent of tobacco harm reduction (Henry Waxman, D-CA) urged FDA Commissioner Hamburg to propose/approve the "deeming" regulation (to apply Chapter IX of FSPTCA to e-cigarettes and other unregulated tobacco products).
http://democrats.energycommerce.hou...documents/Hamburg.CigarUseStudy.2012.8.27.pdf
Ranking Member Waxman Releases New Tobacco Documents And Calls on FDA to Protect Youth by Closing Tobacco Loopholes | Committee on Energy and Commerce Democrats

Its telling that nobody has even commented on my posting of Waxman's letter on another "legislative news" thread.

While I respect everyone's right to vote for whomever they choose, any vaper who votes for Obama is aiding and abetting the enemy of e-cigarettes who tried to ban the products from 2009-2011, and who has vowed to impose excessive and unwarranted regulations that would decimate the industry.

If the Democrats take over the House, Waxman will regain his Chairmanship of the E&C Committee, where he will oversee all FDA related legislation and investigations, will push for the most oppressive FDA regulations (i.e. ban) on e-cigarettes, and to tax them at the same rate as cigarettes.

In sharp contrast, if the Republicans keep the House, Republican Chairs of the E&C Committee and its Subcommittees will continue their appropriate investigation of Obama appointees at DHHS who gave hundreds of millions of dollars in grants to state/local health agencies who illegally used that taxpayers money to lobby for state/local laws to ban e-cigarette sales and use, ban tobacco use, ban dissolvables, ban flavorings, and increase tobacco taxes.

If the Republicans take over the Senate, the biggest losers will be the Democrat Senators who have urged FDA to ban and regulate e-cigarettes and who have sponsored legislation to tax e-cigarettes at the same rate as cigarettes.

Its time to wake up and smell the coffee folks.

In November, several million vapers have the power to either keep e-cigarettes legal, affordable and easily accessible, or to destroy and tax the industry.

Unfortunately, the overwhelming majority of the vaping community (particularly the overwhelming majority of ECF members who never visited this legislative news thread) don't even know (or care) that Obama's appointees at FDA created and have led the federal, state, local and international battles against e-cigarettes.

And there are many Democrat loyalists who post notes on this and other threads that confuse other vapers to believe there is no difference between the Democrats and Republicans on e-cigarette policy issues.

 

[JerryRM]

This thread started out with good intentions but it has turned into a political thread.

 

[Bill Godshall]

Obama and the Democrats have made e-cigarettes a political issue.

Vapers who deny, downplay or ignore that fact are risking the future of the e-cigarette industry.

Whose side are you on?

 

[JerryRM]

I don't trust either party, Bill. They both follow the money and there is no money for them in e-cigs.

 

[Phi]

Any vaper who wants Obama appointees at DHHS to impose Chapter IX (of the FSPTCA) regulations on e-cigarettes (as Obama appointees have repeatedly stated is their intent) is either an idiot, is totally ignorant of Obama's FDA e-cigarette prohibition and propaganda campaign since he became President in 2009, and/or has not read (or comprehended) the dozens of provisions in Chapter IX that will decimate (if not destroy) the e-cigarette industry.

Besides Obama, all of the members of US Congress who have urged the FDA to ban/regulate e-cigarettes are Democrats, as are all members of Congress who have cosponsored legislation to tax e-cigarettes at the same rate as cigarettes.

Two weeks ago, Congress' most vehement opponent of tobacco harm reduction (Henry Waxman, D-CA) urged FDA Commissioner Hamburg to propose/approve the "deeming" regulation (to apply Chapter IX of FSPTCA to e-cigarettes and other unregulated tobacco products).
http://democrats.energycommerce.hou...documents/Hamburg.CigarUseStudy.2012.8.27.pdf
Ranking Member Waxman Releases New Tobacco Documents And Calls on FDA to Protect Youth by Closing Tobacco Loopholes | Committee on Energy and Commerce Democrats

Its telling that nobody has even commented on my posting of Waxman's letter on another "legislative news" thread.

While I respect everyone's right to vote for whomever they choose, any vaper who votes for Obama is aiding and abetting the enemy of e-cigarettes who tried to ban the products from 2009-2011, and who has vowed to impose excessive and unwarranted regulations that would decimate the industry.

If the Democrats take over the House, Waxman will regain his Chairmanship of the E&C Committee, where he will oversee all FDA related legislation and investigations, will push for the most oppressive FDA regulations (i.e. ban) on e-cigarettes, and to tax them at the same rate as cigarettes.

In sharp contrast, if the Republicans keep the House, Republican Chairs of the E&C Committee and its Subcommittees will continue their appropriate investigation of Obama appointees at DHHS who gave hundreds of millions of dollars in grants to state/local health agencies who illegally used that taxpayers money to lobby for state/local laws to ban e-cigarette sales and use, ban tobacco use, ban dissolvables, ban flavorings, and increase tobacco taxes.

If the Republicans take over the Senate, the biggest losers will be the Democrat Senators who have urged FDA to ban and regulate e-cigarettes and who have sponsored legislation to tax e-cigarettes at the same rate as cigarettes.

Its time to wake up and smell the coffee folks.

In November, several million vapers have the power to either keep e-cigarettes legal, affordable and easily accessible, or to destroy and tax the industry.

Unfortunately, the overwhelming majority of the vaping community (particularly the overwhelming majority of ECF members who never visited this legislative news thread) don't even know (or care) that Obama's appointees at FDA created and have led the federal, state, local and international battles against e-cigarettes.

And there are many Democrat loyalists who post notes on this and other threads that confuse other vapers to believe there is no difference between the Democrats and Republicans on e-cigarette policy issues.

When a long-fighting battered soldier for our cause gives a report of the facts from his unique and knowledgeable perspective, the only appropriate response is a duly respectful thank you. Therefore, thank you for your unquestionably credible insights.

 

[tearose50]

Thanks Bill. I should have known my congressman, IMO the very unsavory Henry Waxman, would be against THR.

Please continue to keep us informed.

 

[Bill Godshall]

After Waxman introduced the FSPTCA legislation in 2004 (that was privately negotiated and agreed to by Philip Morris lawyers and CTFK's Matt Myers), I pleaded with Waxman's staff on hundreds of occassions from 2004 to 2009 to amend the legislation to truthfully inform the public about the comparable health risks of different tobacco products and to encourage (instead of make it a crime) for smokeless tobacco companies to truthfully inform smokers that smokeless tobacco products are far less hazardous alternatives to cigarettes.

Waxman and his lead tobacco staffer, Josh Sharfstein, not only refused to do so, but informed me that they would oppose any efforts to amend the legislation to promote (or even acknowledge) tobacco harm reduction.

Sharfstein was subsequently appointed by Obama (several weeks after Obama became President) as Deputy Commissioner of the FDA, where he began the FDA's campaign to ban and lie about e-cigarettes.

 

[Angel Wings]

there are ALOT of members here on ecf. the problem i see is, MOST of them have no idea this is even happening. most vapers, especially the new vapers i talk to have no idea there was even a court case and FDA lost it and the appeal. some of the ones i talk to have no idea this tax is looming upon us.....

the majority of them are spending all there time on the forums chit chatting, asking for help on why this leaks, why that tastes burnt etc.

this forum is soooo big, most of them do not even know this information is even available. they just skim past this area thinking, as someone told me yesterday "i just thought that legislation thingie was for people traveling and how not to get your e cig taken when you fly or something." GEEEZZZZZZ alot of them have no idea...

my question is, how do i/we get this post bill made out of the legislation thread and into the 'main' forum ex. general e cig discussion. etc.?

i know there is a sticky of 'most important thread on ecf' but alot of them skip the stickies as well and scroll down to the "action" as one lady called it

i have followed this since i started vaping. WE HAVE to get this info, the post bill just made, out of here and into the main forum IN PEOPLES FACES and wake them up before november!!!!!

 

[Lisa Belle]

Yes, to what Bill Godshall says! It's documented and proven beyond a shadow of doubt. Political Scmomitical. It's not funny and this is a real crossroads epic historical moment that could send health concerns back to the dark ages, where power and money hungry over sized government takes all. I'm am 110% with you Bill Godshall, and I do read all your intense reporting that is followed and upheld by your years of dedication to the health of nicotine addicts, one of the least threatening groups and most put upon. Thank you. I will vote my conscience and to tell you another interesting thing, none of the campaigning even remotely hints at their covert plans to control, tax and spend people who are using nicotine.

 

[simply me]

This thread started out with good intentions but it has turned into a political thread.

And how is this not political? It's up to you to vote they way you want. But your right to vape is at stake. We can help the FDA or we can fight FDA. The Gov. would just have us smoke them cancer sticks, I mean that is where the money is. The doctors, pharma's meds is lining everyones pockets. Heaven forbid should vaping save millions of life.

 

[Stubby]

I am a dye in the wool democrat on most issues

But


I can no longer support them or vote for them. If the democrats get both houses and Obama gets elected we can expect bills like this to pass

Bill Text - 112th Congress (2011-2012) - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

The above bill was supported by 15 democrats and no republicans.

Besides that we would be assured of a deeming regulation on e-cigs. This would be the end of tobacco harm reduction as there would be essentially no chance for it to have any meaningful impact. Smokeless tobacco would be taxed at about the same rate as cigarettes, and with several generations of brainwashing as to the risk of smokeless tobacco there would be no incentive to switch. E-cigs would be essentially gone except perhaps a few primitive ineffective devices at best.

When I first got involved in harm reduction in 2009 I was convinced I could reason with the democrats and turn them over to the idea of tobacco harm reduction. No luck with that as all I ever got from them in response to many letters, phone calls and emails is the same old prohibitionist stance on tobacco. At this point there isn't even a glimmer of hope they will become reasonable and rational when it comes to tobacco.

 

[Angel Wings]

i agree stubby...

i am not a democrat but i am sure fighting them so i can KEEP MY HEALTH. vaping has saved me. my dr continues to be impressed with my lungs since i began vaping. I have lupus and since i began vaping, i have been able to STOP taking alot of the meds i was taking and my lungs are great.

vaping is one thing. of course i will fight for my right to vape.
BUT when the dems.. well, read it for your selves. google democrats remove god and jerusalem from their platform.

IMHO THIS showed me if obama is re-elected, we are snowballing straight to hell.

if they will even consider taking god out of their platform what else will they do. i WILL not sit back quietly and let dems or anybody else strip me one by one of my freedoms or rights as a american. i will be screaming from the rooftops

You all decide for yourselves where your vote needs to be cast.

if you are proud to be a vaper vote obama's behind outa there. if you dont vote against obamA, then dont be complaining when you lose your right to vape.

I know romney is not the best choice bUT he IS the better choice. when i vote in november i will not be exactly thrilled to do it BUT IMHO romney IS the less of BOTH EVILS so i am left with no choice.

Voting outside of romney and obama only gives obama a better chance to win so i HAVE to vote for romney. I LOVE MY FREEDOM TOO MUCH NOT TO and i love vaping just as much because it has saved my life.

YOUR DARN RIGHT IT IS POLITICAL. OBAMA AND HIS CREW PUT IT THERE.

I am a dye in the wool democrat on most issues

But


I can no longer support them or vote for them. If the democrats get both houses and Obama gets elected we can expect bills like this to pass

Bill Text - 112th Congress (2011-2012) - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

The above bill was supported by 15 democrats and no republicans.

Besides that we would be assured of a deeming regulation on e-cigs. This would be the end of tobacco harm reduction as there would be essentially no chance for it to have any meaningful impact. Smokeless tobacco would be taxed at about the same rate as cigarettes, and with several generations of brainwashing as to the risk of smokeless tobacco there would be no incentive to switch. E-cigs would be essentially gone except perhaps a few primitive ineffective devices at best.

When I first got involved in harm reduction in 2009 I was convinced I could reason with the democrats and turn them over to the idea of tobacco harm reduction. No luck with that as all I ever got from them in response to many letters, phone calls and emails is the same old prohibitionist stance on tobacco. At this point there isn't even a glimmer of hope they will become reasonable and rational when it comes to tobacco.

 

[Slickstick]

@Bill Maybe someone, a non vendor, can make a youtube video for "Debate 2012 Omaba vs 2.5 million American former smokers." or something like that and ask him if he has our back. We all could put out testimonies at the bottom of the video the whole nation would see it and see what is going on. Keyword it so all vapers, smokers and non smokers/vapers would see the video and like and share it and whatnot. Tweet the video to msnbc and stuff.. just a thought.