FDA Sued Over Electronic Cigarette Embargo
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Previously posted: Details of company and shares Smokefree Innotec --> Stock Disclosure
Includes shares, marketing plan, history and competition.
Includes shares, marketing plan, history and competition.
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Interestig, Smokefree Innotec is about 2 blocks from where I'm sitting at the moment. May have to go check them out later.
PM has been on this since the 80's. They registered patents and actually had esmoke as a trademark! Not anymore.
They "have" a Chinese e-cig just like everyone else and his grandmother! Except they have the $$$ to go public. Watch this stock... SFIO $0.015 0.003 UP 25% 45,000 Shares Traded, no news, no filing, no nothing except 45,000 shares out there that "somebody" owns at a current value of $675,000.00
Shareholder's Filing: Interesting Gang, Changed Name and Locations How many times now?
NASDAQ Info Quotes - Stock Prices - Stock Research
"B. Business of the Issuer
We are in the business of designing, developing, manufacturing and marketing a hi-tech
smokeless nicotine delivery cigarette like electronic device which is completely smokefree
and tobacco-free. Products are designed to protect the non-smoker from second hand
smoke and all its effects while providing the smoker a way to enjoy smoking anywhere
including places that prohibit smoking. Further, it will allow the smoker to enjoy smoking
while not having to worry about the dangers and ill effects of regular cigarette smoking".
"With further test-marketing planned in Pensylvania, the Board of Smokeless believes that within the next 18 months its product will yield a multi-million dollar turnover from around the globe."
Have to go now, I have a multi-million dollar turnover from around the globe to handle!
So basically the time line is this:
May of 2009 Senate will vote on the Tobacco Bill, effectively making it impossible for all current ecigs to stay on the market. In late September of 2009, Smokeless Innotec will release their Rauchless cigarette, owned by Altria. Is this what you have found because this is what I have found...
Sherid where are you!?! Here is what we have been waiting for!
We wondered why PM would let their patent run out here in the US. Brilliant they are. They let all of the current suppliers get the market up, then they are going to "ban" them all out of the market and then release their own when everyone is good and desperate.
Tobacco Industry holds us hostage again. Shocker.
Well for good or ill we're not facing an "honest legal system" here.
I'll be frank from an American legal standpoint being classified as a tobacco product is the only hope these devices have now that they are on the radar.
They are going to be regulated that's a fact. The only question is how they will be regulated will they fall under the less stringent requirements placed on tobacco or will they end up under the far more draconian drug classification.
If they are classed as a tobacco product they're going to get grandfathered into Waxman's bill since these devices were marketed prior to February 2007. The worst case at that point is controls on the Nicotine content available. We'll probably also get some better quality controls on the actual content of the liquids some basic standards such as childproofing as well as requirements to take some measures to ensure these aren't sold to minors. (assuming Waxman's bill passes unammended)
If they are classed as a drug delivery device they will have to undergo the same testing as any other drug which means very expensive studies and it's questionable that such studies could even be done. I've read arguments by experts who basicallly say that even if the manufacturers wanted to go through such testing they'd never be able to find an organization that would be willing to do it and that such studies might fail to meet ethical standards regardless.
To quote our President "Do not let perfection become the enemy of the good"
Sure our ideal solution would be to have a completely new catagory carved out for the E-cigarette and have it regulated only to ensure that we are getting what we pay for.
But that simply is not going to happen. If they are classified as a drug rather than tobacco then the E-Cig is dead in the United States end of story end of debate, And if we kill it here you can be pretty sure that the UK and the rest of Europe will follow pretty rapidly, hell the two biggest other chunks of the former British Empire have already banned these devices.
The die as they say has already been cast. The battle joined and since no one else stepped up to the plate we're stuck with SE as the standard bearer.
If the smaller suppliers had pooled resources earlier and been willing to set aside petty bickering and their selfish individualist nonsense then perhaps they could have filed this action instead but that didn't happen.
But as I've always said about regrets and spilt milk. Could have, would have, should have, didn't.
At this point any other option is wishful thinking and that has never accomplished anything in this world.
Touchdown! And now all the cats are out of the bag!!!!!!!
But there are other players with other plans.
Keep your eyes on the SE case because that could change PM's plans and the entire picture. Let's see how freedom in the USA really works!
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Touchdown! And now all the cats are out of the bag!!!!!!! But there are other players with other plans.
I swear to god the next step is to lodge a complaint with the FTC for unfair business practices of a monopoly.
They are writing the legislation... that's the problem. They have a seat on the advisory board being created within the FDA over tobacco products. They will have a direct say in what the fees are and who will have to do what in order to get a product on the market. They can afford anything. The rest of us... not so much.
This is the real problem at hand here. A direct manipulation of the legislative process in order for one company to destroy the rest of the market. With 50% industry control, they would be the industry leader and therefor, get to dictate how even RJR's products are sold and marketed.
We don't know. The bill is very vague and basically says that the FDA has control to determine whatever rules/laws they want. But with PM as a birdie in their ear... we can guestimate it won't be favorable.
If PM are going to sell PVs then the legislation is going to have to allow them somehow.
If you are sure they are going to do that then they may be lining the market up for acceptance that will benefit all of us.
If they want to crush the market and not have a slice themselves then being a tobacco product is a very big liability.
If you are sure they are going to do that then they may be lining the market up for acceptance that will benefit all of us.
If they want to crush the market and not have a slice themselves then being a tobacco product is a very big liability.
That's a definite possibility that they do write regulations that is positive for us all. I don't deny that. But I don't think they are going to make it a reasonable by in fee by any means.
In 2000 when Altria (PM) decided that they could not get public perception to not see them as the bad guys, they decided the only way they could save their business was to jump in bed with the FDA.
Also, does anyone have info that would tie Courtside Products to Courtside Acquisitions? This is my missing link...
It would be handy to know if your suspicions are right about PM planning to sell PVs.
We should either want to get into bed with them and be a tobacco product or run a mile because they could easily crush us for years if they wanted.
Conspiracy theories are only useful if they can help us plan for a better outcome.
I still think the honest thing would be to back anyone who says we are not using tobacco or drugs with zero nic eliquid.
In fairness the FDA could have a good case to regulate the nicotine liquids, it is a toxic, psychoactive drug.
We should either want to get into bed with them and be a tobacco product or run a mile because they could easily crush us for years if they wanted.
Conspiracy theories are only useful if they can help us plan for a better outcome.
I still think the honest thing would be to back anyone who says we are not using tobacco or drugs with zero nic eliquid.
In fairness the FDA could have a good case to regulate the nicotine liquids, it is a toxic, psychoactive drug.
You're very excited, Lacey. You've been connecting dots. Good for you. We've posted pix of the Aria from Altria before and I'm sure it will morph into an e-cig before being mass marketed as a Raunchless. The other big winner? Where does the nicotine come from? Big Pharma. Clean, regulated.
Devices from Big Tobacco. Liquid from Big Pharma. All FDA approved in a way no other companies can hope to obtain.
I see the lawsuit as a liability, however. Altria will market an alternative to tobacco ... not a new cigarette. SE complicates things in pursuit of recovery from its financial setback.
Devices from Big Tobacco. Liquid from Big Pharma. All FDA approved in a way no other companies can hope to obtain.
I see the lawsuit as a liability, however. Altria will market an alternative to tobacco ... not a new cigarette. SE complicates things in pursuit of recovery from its financial setback.
Agreed with you on all points there. This is a twisted bag and I have followed a slew of things I have come across and some work out and some don't.
Either way... the Dutch and Canadians handled this situation pretty reasonable, leaving the devices and the no-nic solutions to their own accord... but they also had the right to regulate nicotine before the product even hit the market. This is not the case here in the US.
"Altria will market an alternative to tobacco ..."
That's what I suspect. Supporting interests who want us to be regulated as tobacco might be us killing our own industry.
If the future is being set up for alternatives then that's where we should be looking.
That's what I suspect. Supporting interests who want us to be regulated as tobacco might be us killing our own industry.
If the future is being set up for alternatives then that's where we should be looking.
I could not agree with you more. This SE lawsuit is devastating. Just devastating.
What was interesting in our conversation with TFK the other day was that the poor lady who unfortunately got our phone call LOL, told us that "All electronic cigarettes are marketed as Quit Smoking Devices". When we told her that was a blatant lie... she then responded "Well I have seen your kiosks in the mall..."
SE is the one in the malls so therefor, everyone assumes that there is only one e-cig. It is a sad day that all of us will be compared to Smoking Everywhere and most of us, can't stand what they have done.
Their argument does make sense... but the FDA will have plenty of arguments back and none of them are good.
Whoa! Before you do that make sure your customs tariffs and sales taxes are paid!
They'll be all over you and your books and won't take monopoly money!
It's just another drooling three letter acronym FTC. (F*** The Consumer).
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