OK, I tried SS36L in TC and I am wondering if in TC mode suitable wick is more important than in Power mode? I have a felling that in lower temps (under 220 Celsius) there is too much e-liquid on the wick/coil and it doesn't atomize so efficiently... Or maybe I am wrong...
New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers
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Why would there be more juice on the coil under TC than in power? And in TC, if your wicking is falling behind, TC will keep the coil from overheating and producing a dry hit. If your wicking is bringing "too much" liquid to the coil, you'll have a flooded tank and maybe leakage out the airflow.
If you tank is properly wicked in either mode, it should only "draw juice in" at the rate it is being vaporized off.
Smoking would be so, so, so much worse than vaping even with frequent dry hits.
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It doesn't really matter what we guess or think, we need the actual qualifiers from the test.
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In the minds of many v̶a̶p̶e̶r̶s̶ ECF'ers it does
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FTFY
Tapatyped
In principle, that should be true. But in the real world, where there are pressure temperature changes, even a properly wicked tank can and will "flood" on occasion.
Of course TC (or the lack thereof) should have no effect on this.
Hi,
Regarding the graphs in the first post
carcinogens started rising:
100% VG - 410f
100% PG - 480f
50/50 VG/PG - 470f
PG seems to have a regulating effect on the amount of carcinogens produced.
I would have expected the 50/50 mix to be more like 50% between 410f and 480f (445f)
But it is instead at 470, just bordering on pure PG in terms of the temp you can get up to before the Form/Acetaldehyde start shooting up.
So i was wandering; what sort of temp would be acceptable for a 75VG-25PG blend? I know without studies no one can answer with any certainty - but i'd be interested to know your thoughts on it.
I've got some 60VG/40PG arriving tomorrow and i'm wandering whether to play it safe at 400f, or if i'm all right to push it up to 420~f..
Cheers,
D
Regarding the graphs in the first post
carcinogens started rising:
100% VG - 410f
100% PG - 480f
50/50 VG/PG - 470f
PG seems to have a regulating effect on the amount of carcinogens produced.
I would have expected the 50/50 mix to be more like 50% between 410f and 480f (445f)
But it is instead at 470, just bordering on pure PG in terms of the temp you can get up to before the Form/Acetaldehyde start shooting up.
So i was wandering; what sort of temp would be acceptable for a 75VG-25PG blend? I know without studies no one can answer with any certainty - but i'd be interested to know your thoughts on it.
I've got some 60VG/40PG arriving tomorrow and i'm wandering whether to play it safe at 400f, or if i'm all right to push it up to 420~f..
Cheers,
D
Interesting study, and a bit concerning. I always thought there would be vape study findings that would require changes in the way we do things, which is OK as long as we pay attention and change the way we vape or change the constituents of what we vape to eliminate harmful effects as much as possible. Probably best described as progress. Nothing wrong with finding problems and fixing them. We just have to realize that vaping as a technology is still in it's infancy and we need a lot more studies and data to make it as harmless as possible. We also need to realize we are all in essence lab rats at this point since so little is really known. I think it should make us all a bit pessimistic and expect some negative aspects will be found and rather than dismiss it out of hand, we need to actively engage to increase our knowledge of the effects of vaping through studies and clinical testing. Studies like this one deserves serious consideration even though it is easy to say it's all BS and we don't want to deal with it.
What makes these studies difficult to interpret is the abundance of junk studies and testing motivated by politics, corporate interest, and public prejudice. Hard to separate the wheat from the chaff. But I'm of the opinion this study warrants some serious consideration and further testing, and if these finding turn out to be verified... then we can fix it easily enough.
At least for now I'm back on the TC bandwagon, and honestly I'm quite surprised how good TC has gotten since I stopped using it well over a year ago. Even small devices, which are my preference, can do a good job of TC now with a very nice vaping experience. I'll stick with TC for the time being until further data proves or disproves this study.
What makes these studies difficult to interpret is the abundance of junk studies and testing motivated by politics, corporate interest, and public prejudice. Hard to separate the wheat from the chaff. But I'm of the opinion this study warrants some serious consideration and further testing, and if these finding turn out to be verified... then we can fix it easily enough.
At least for now I'm back on the TC bandwagon, and honestly I'm quite surprised how good TC has gotten since I stopped using it well over a year ago. Even small devices, which are my preference, can do a good job of TC now with a very nice vaping experience. I'll stick with TC for the time being until further data proves or disproves this study.
Perhaps the subject and object are mutually exclusive. And that to me suggests our reliance on technology to solve our problems may put us in a trap. I'm a technologist and love the concept of TC. However, there is a very real risk that vaping as a phenomenon will be swallowed by the premise.
We cannot expect to rely upon the very compromised sources you describe for answers given the track record we have seen. This certainly includes government and industry. Without our consumer participation and in much larger measure we many never see the answers that suit US without our active engagement in their evolution and development. So you're right there. We're not well served shutting doors now open to us self-regulating in response to the inference of possible harm.
There simply will be no studies or clinical testing for products and approaches that we categorically reject without a reasonable basis. Innovation (investment) is driven by consumer interest and participation. Were it gospel that all risk be defined before we shed our dollar we'd still be driving our donkey.
It's your thing. Do what you want to do.
Good luck.
I remember when TC was just a concept of Brandon's.
This forum wasn't so kind on the concept.
I thought it showed great potential.
I posted such.
Matter of fact I predicted it would be the future in the face of skepticism.
Though I also said I wasn't going to be the proof of concept... IE; a test subject.
Now this.
Tapatyped
This forum wasn't so kind on the concept.
I thought it showed great potential.
I posted such.
Matter of fact I predicted it would be the future in the face of skepticism.
Though I also said I wasn't going to be the proof of concept... IE; a test subject.
Now this.
Tapatyped
Interesting, could be of potential use for Kanthal users.
Cant find any specs on it yet, no clue how it supposedly works.
The temp scales they show look way off in terms of being useful, maybe its a typo.
Cant find any specs on it yet, no clue how it supposedly works.
The temp scales they show look way off in terms of being useful, maybe its a typo.
What does a low precision measurement of the temperature of the outside of an atty have to do with anything? I'm pretty sure I can identify that range with my sense of touch. Total gimmick.
I still believe "Temperature Matters"
Start at the 17 minute mark.
Yes, this is coming from a vested interest, nonetheless, I believe him.
Start at the 17 minute mark.
Yes, this is coming from a vested interest, nonetheless, I believe him.
I am just intrigued by the concept, if they got the temp range right, as in a useful range, then it could be a solution to all of the folks questioning their Kanthal coils.
Something like:
- Green = < 420f
- Yellow = 420f to 460f
- Red = > 460f
Put the indicator on the atty itself, then you can put it on any mod, I like the concept.
Perhaps as an indicator of suboptimal batt, wire or build. I'm pretty much always in the green cause if not it's out. If I can't chain it, I can't have it. Still I'd concede it might be useful for some.
Good luck.
p.s. @mikepetro, you had to go and do that, huh? Now one more thing to try and prove the point.
Good luck.
p.s. @mikepetro, you had to go and do that, huh? Now one more thing to try and prove the point.
I think it would useful for the non-techy folks, and/or non TC folks. If done right, it could give them a go/no-go indicator that they are in a safe range.Perhaps as an indicator of suboptimal batt, wire or build. I'm pretty much always in the green cause if not it's out. If I can't chain it, I can't have it. Still I'd concede it might be useful for some.
Good luck.
Better than nothing, I guess. The idea of putting a temp sensor in the atomizer is a good one but I'd like it to connect back to the controller...there's goes the good old 510 connector but progress is progress.
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