New studies find carcinogens in vg and pg at high temps, even in tootle puffers

[dwcraig1]

Where is the best place in the states to get ss430?

I get mine here:
28 gauge Stainless Steel Wire - 430 Grade Nickel Free - 200 feet - 100% Guarantee - Creating Unkamen

 

[mikepetro]

Its possible and it happens. We know. Its been analysed like 1000 times already. Lots of other stuff is formed when PG/VG break down, its pretty complex.
Here is just one example of all the stuff you can find when you fire a ProTank2 at 15W:
Solvent Chemistry in the Electronic Cigarette Reaction Vessel : Scientific Reports
Doesn't look all that nice, right?

Here is something else we also know...Don't dry fire your vape!

Interesting, several have mentioned that we should be able to "taste" the bad stuff. The article you linked addresses that topic.

However, it is known that in traditional cigarettes the harsh taste from formaldehyde and other aldehydes is overcome due to the nicotine drive26 and to cross-desensitization of transient receptor potential ankyrin subtype 1 (TRPA1) channels in sensory neurons27,28. Moreover, it has not been shown to what degree the use of flavorants in e-cigarettes dulls or overcomes any harsh taste from toxins.

 

[Eskie]

Interesting, several have mentioned that we should be able to "taste" the bad stuff. The article you linked addresses that topic.

So, who wants to volunteer to inhale different concentrations of formaldehyde and report where the cutoff for taste is? Don't be shy, just raise your hands.

Yeah, some things just have to be extrapolated. That, or unsanctioned human experimentation.

The thing is this. I really like TC on my DNA mods. I get a nice consistent vape. But until someone sets up a DNA (or any TC board) hooked up to a consumer tank with a 316L coil in the bottom, tosses some 70/30 juice in there (with my specific flavorings would be even better), and measures aldehyde levels in the vape produced, I've got nothing solid to tell me how to run my tanks, other than don't try to draw a hot vape, and don't do dry hits. Those things are just plain nasty, toxins or not.

 

[tj99959]

So, who wants to volunteer to inhale different concentrations of formaldehyde and report where the cutoff for taste is? Don't be shy, just raise your hands.

Yeah, some things just have to be extrapolated. That, or unsanctioned human experimentation.

The thing is this. I really like TC on my DNA mods. I get a nice consistent vape. But until someone sets up a DNA (or any TC board) hooked up to a consumer tank with a 316L coil in the bottom, tosses some 70/30 juice in there (with my specific flavorings would be even better), and measures aldehyde levels in the vape produced, I've got nothing solid to tell me how to run my tanks, other than don't try to draw a hot vape, and don't do dry hits. Those things are just plain nasty, toxins or not.

^^ this
There still comes a point where common sense is the only safe guide.

 

[beckdg]

Except one slides list the Aspire Nautilus as in the gen 3 very low carcinogens category of gen 3 devices. Oops it's not tootle puffing, it's not subohm, its temperature. And VG is much higher than PG at higher temps. Per these charts.

Be the person who turns that nautilus up to 20 Watts in your pocket.

Then What?

My statement stands.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Kanthal really doesn't have any benefits anymore. Switch over to stainless steel. Works just as well as kanthal and can be used in tc.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

I can't use it.

I react.

Throat and tongue swells.

So there's that.

Tapatyped

 

[beckdg]

Interesting, several have mentioned that we should be able to "taste" the bad stuff. The article you linked addresses that topic.

How so?

That doesn't mention e-cigs at all.

Tapatyped

 

[Rossum]

So the question still remains, how to use Kanthal safely?

Keep the heat flux of your builds reasonable, make sure your wicking can keep up, and make sure your wick stays wet. Oh, and don't let the wick or coil get too gunked up.

I believe that if you do those things, wire surface temperatures will not exceed the boiling point of your e-liquid by much at all, and the boiling point of the liquids we actually use is below the danger zone of aldehyde production.

 

[KenD]

Oh I'm not guessing. I've been vaping TC for a long time and have a temp reference when using kanthal/nichrome.
I guess that's another reason to vape with at least one TC setup, so you have a temp reference.

Sorry, but that's guessing.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[tj99959]

Keep the heat flux of your builds reasonable, make sure your wicking can keep up, and make sure your wick stays wet. Oh, and don't let the wick or coil get too gunked up.

I believe that if you do those things, wire surface temperatures will not exceed the boiling point of your e-liquid by much at all, and the boiling point of the liquids we actually use is below the danger zone of aldehyde production.

Ya got it!
Again, all common sense.

 

[Rossum]

Be the person who turns that nautilus up to 20 Watts in your pocket.

Then What?

LOL -- that actually happened to me with ProTank 2 on Vaporshark DNA20. The partial hit I took was horrible and the coil was unrecoverable.

 

[Flavored]

That one is incorrect, it's actually using the same TFR as ni200. Take a look at it next time. You can download the correct inr from SE

Thanks, it had been so long ago, but I am using one I downloaded from SE. Just compared the two, and they are spot on.

 

[beckdg]

LOL -- that actually happened to me with ProTank 2 on Vaporshark DNA20. The partial hit I took was horrible and the coil was unrecoverable.

I know that feeling of disappointment all too well.



Tapatyped

 

[NU_FTW]

does pg/vg not behave like water? Water boils at 100c the steam it produces is 100c, the only way to alter those temp points is by changing pressure. Lower pressure and water boils at lower temp and steam produced will be same, higher pressure boiling point is increased and so the steam will be increased. So unless vg and pg behave differently how can the actual temp of the vapor be any higher than boiling point

 

[KenD]

It would probably be far easier to get a mod like the hohm tech g2 or slice that can do TC on kanthal, or find a tc wire build for your tank to use that is similar ohms to what you are used to if you are concerned by this data/thread. You may find though you need to lower your ohms and maybe increase your watts in tc mode using different wire types to get a similar vaping experience using tc.



A pico can't do tc on kanthal. ss, ni or ti only. I have only used ss so I can't comment on the ni question.

The problem with the hohm tech is that you don't really calibrate kanthal tc based on temperature but on taste. Thus you don't really know what temp you're actually vaping at. You need regular tc with tc compatible wire.

Sent from my K6000 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[happy valley]

What's 'regular TC' ?

 

[NU_FTW]

I'm really curious to know if these tests were performed under any pressure at. Is it exposure to intense energy or actually being at temp that really creates these compounds

 

[DPLongo22]

Anybody got a smoke I could bum?

 

[kiba]

Only one problem with that. Many of us have lifetime supplies of Kanthal that you are suggesting that we just throw away. ........... Not gonna happen!

So the question still remains, how to use Kanthal safely?
Also remember that many of us have years invested into how to use Kenthal.

Add:
Also remember that many of us like simplistic devices.

Warning: Don't try that! Cartos have recessed center pins.

Ive still got a bunch of kanthal too, probably a lifetime supply of it but I won't use it, apart from the reasons in this thread... SS tastes better, heats up faster, allows me to use more wraps, nickel free (430) and works extremely well in TC.

 

[Bonskibon]

Ok, so are we NOW saying that kanthal is bad to use?