pulled over for vaping

[THE]

Truth be told, the vast majority of police officer I encounter in my work are very professional, and don't take things personally. Even the ones that I cross examine in court, and attempt (often successfully) to discredit, take it all with good humor. They know it's nothing personal.

Similarly, I would venture to say that most police officers would not get bent out of shape when someone refuses consent to a search or to answer questions. It's all part of their job.

RadicalJD

Agreed. I don't see me against them. I see the system working. I don't like a-lot of the gears in it, but any interaction I have with anyone in power is just part of the system and how it works.

 

[imtheshane]

I don't think anyone disagrees with you Mark.. The stop was probably justified.. I don't want some stoned nineteen year old driving around anywhere near me, either.. The issue is what went on after the officer knew there wasn't anything wrong..

The officer didn't know that something wasn't wrong until he completed his investigation. He went about it the wrong way, definitely, but to say he knew that there wasn't anything wrong because the OP explained what an e-cig was isn't really true. There's a saying, "There are no guilty men in prison." Everyone has a story, and an excuse.

Keep in mind that I'm not defending this particular's officer's actions. There are other ways the investigation could have went, like field testing the PV and any nic juice.

 

[THE]

The officer didn't know that something wasn't wrong until he completed his investigation. He went about it the wrong way, definitely, but to say he knew that there wasn't anything wrong because the OP explained what an e-cig was isn't really true. There's a saying, "There are no guilty men in prison." Everyone has a story, and an excuse.

Keep in mind that I'm not defending this particular's officer's actions. There are other ways the investigation could have went, like field testing the PV and any nic juice.

No, of course he didn't know that something wasn't wrong. Something could be wrong in any vehicle you look at out there. His investigation was complete when he knew that his reason for the more extensive search was "wrong" or "didn't exist". If he didn't figure this out upon his examining the device, something was wrong with him.

The only way I could see an officer justifying a search after that point would be for him to say, well, you know, the device that was shown to me didn't look like what I saw from outside of the vehicle.

I'm very patient with officers when they have a good reason for concern. I've even consented to allowing them to check serial numbers on weapons when I've been stopped. I'm not sure if I had to (I wouldn't think so, but who knows).

 

[imtheshane]

No, of course he didn't know that something wasn't wrong. Something could be wrong in any vehicle you look at out there. His investigation was complete when he knew that his reason for the more extensive search was "wrong" or "didn't exist". If he didn't figure this out upon his examining the device, something was wrong with him.

The only way I could see an officer justifying a search after that point would be for him to say, well, you know, the device that was shown to me didn't look like what I saw from outside of the vehicle.

I'm very patient with officers when they have a good reason for concern. I've even consented to allowing them to check serial numbers on weapons when I've been stopped. I'm not sure if I had to (I wouldn't think so, but who knows).

You're absolutely right. I misread the post that I quoted from you. I read it as "the officer had no right to question the OP about what the PV was and should have accepted her explanation". My apologies.

 

[Vapin Da Bullet]

Honestly I can understand from the cop's perspective as an uninformed person. It wasn't that he thought you were endangering the life of yourself or someone else.

Having never seen a PV before, it probably looked like a etc.. Especially if you look at the size and shape of misshaped ones like the Ego or Hello 016, they look like .......... so when he looks over and sees smoke coming out of something that looks like a pen, that is where his first thought would go.

Education would have rectified this, but we can only hope for so much.

Thank you. I will tell you that cops aren't educated in e-cigs and mods. Most devices that look like these are used for smoking illegal drugs. Try to be patient and lets educate them. They are only trying to bust you if you are smoking illegal stuff...

 

[Lera]

Interesting read but I stopped on page 14. *laugh*

You know a lot of this could end if manufactures would design the mod’s so that they wouldn't be mistaken for any illegal devices. I feel this hurts vapor’s cause and only gives fuel to the FDA and others who wish to do away with vaping.

I'm sure too that us Vaping peeps have to be aware that people who use drugs could and will find a way to incorporate legal Vaping Devices for their illegal drug usage.

Education is the key, and it will be a long hard fought battle, and pissing off COPS isn’t going to help that cause at all. I say be polite, educate, yes your rights matter but when you get pulled over and you feel your rights are trampled on how many can seriously state that their demeanor will come across as polite, respectful and informative? No you will more than likely come across as an AHOLE.

A fine line here indeed.

Lera

 

[HeatherC]

I'm sure too that us Vaping peeps have to be aware that people who use drugs could and will find a way to incorporate legal Vaping Devices for their illegal drug usage.
A fine line here indeed.

Lera

Definately a fine line. But... tobacco pipes are sold everywhere, and tho I've never tried it I'm sure ppl have used these for substances other than tobacco...there are many devices for sale in tobacco shops...sold as tobacco products that aren't usually used for tobacco consumption....Basically I'm saying I agree with you!! However it hasn't stopped the sale of those other products....I really want to know when theyre going to ban tobacco pipes as drug delivery devices as I've heard they claim our PVs are.
Anyway...I agree. (and I talk too much )

 

[Lera]

Definately a fine line. But... tobacco pipes are sold everywhere, and tho I've never tried it I'm sure ppl have used these for substances other than tobacco...there are many devices for sale in tobacco shops...sold as tobacco products that aren't usually used for tobacco consumption....Basically I'm saying I agree with you!! However it hasn't stopped the sale of those other products....I really want to know when theyre going to ban tobacco pipes as drug delivery devices as I've heard they claim our PVs are.
Anyway...I agree. (and I talk too much )

Anyway , my main point was that I think the manufactures could step up and design something that is more cohesive for us. It would behoove them to increase their customer base.

 

[magz]

Editorial ?

This is what first came to mind, but when I googled it, it said that an editorial was something that specifically the editor wrote. That's when I gave up, lol. I'm sure that's it now that someone else thinks so too though, lol. Yes. Editorial. That's the word I was looking for. Thanks

 

[HeatherC]

This is what first came to mind, but when I googled it, it said that an editorial was something that specifically the editor wrote. That's when I gave up, lol. I'm sure that's it now that someone else thinks so too though, lol. Yes. Editorial. That's the word I was looking for. Thanks

I'm glad I could be of service. And yeah I think that generally it is considered something an editor writes...but I've also heard it used to describe a written opinion on something so I don't know exact definition but it fits

 

[magz]

The officer who pulled the OP over did not arrest her, did not seize the vaping equipment, and did nothing other than his job. When he advised her about not vaping and driving, it was most likely a courtesy (like trying to be nice, hello) for her to avoid getting pulled over again.

Nothing I've said will change any minds who have personal axes to grind against the police.

I'm glad the OP has (from what I read) recognized an opportunity instead of a victim-status moment. The officer violated nothing, based on this account of the story from the OP. He did his job...what a concept for some people! LOL.

When the cop pulled her over he was doing his job. He saw something that he believed to be possible illegal activity and he wouldn't have been doing his job if he hadn't pulled her over to check it out.

Once she showed him the device and explained, there was no reason to push this further. He had no probable cause to search her and this is exactly why he asked if he could.

After determining that she wasn't doing anything illegal, and wasn't posing any kind of threat on the road or otherwise, he should have told her to have a nice day and drive carefully.

Although he didn't violate her rights, because she did give her consent, there was no need for him to push her for a search in the first place. Cops will do this, because many people are afraid to say no. Many people don't know their rights or are afraid to stand up for them, and the bully cops count on this.

His job was done after he pulled her over and determined she was vaping and not doing anything illegal. If he was truly "just doing his job" he would have let her go at that.

I have the utmost respect for the police that are in it for the right reasons, but unfortunately many are in it for the power and control. These guys cause a lot of trouble not only for civilians but for there fellow officers. And once they are in, it is often hard to get rid of them. My uncle is a retired officer and has worked with many of these jerks over the years. There's one in particular that they've been trying to fire for years but every time she threatens sexual harassment suits.

Standing up for your rights is the only way to fight back. The "good cops" generally won't put you in a postilion where this is necessary, and if you don't stand up for your rights when you encounter a bully police officer, these officers will never be held responsible for their actions.

 

[magz]

He could have called it an "inventory search," since most police forces have a policy of doing an inventory of cars that are impounded or otherwise left unattended in police possession. In those cases, police have a right to do an "inventory," and anything they find is fair game.

His justification "for officer's safety" was clearly improper, since that justifies only an external pat down for weapons.

RadicalJD

I had a similar situation with a car accident, however when I demanded my backpack it was given to me (thankfully). I understand that they can do an "inventory search", but say they didn't give me my bag, and they found paraphanelia in it, but after I asked over and over and over for it, and said I would not leave without it.

Shouldn't any charges that came from what they found in my bag automatically be dropped since I didn't actually leave it in the car I wrecked? It seems to me that in this case they took his bag without his consent, and searched it without his consent, and charges should be dropped based on this alone.

 

[magz]

You actually can use these devices for illegal substances... When I first got mine I recieved a few comments like "hey my boyfriend smokes his ..... with one of those too!" or people asking me for a hookup for a liquid ... supplier. So, IMO, The officer is completely in the right for pulling over the OP. But after observing the behavior and coherency of the user he should have continued his patrol. Just my 2cents

This is funny, my friend and I were just talking about this the other night. We were talking about a guy we knew who would totally find a way to use it for smoking something..... lol. We came to the conclusion that it would be very easy to use a PV for things other than what it's intended.

Like I said before, it makes sense that he pulled the OP over, but after she showed him her PV and took it apart, and he could plainly see it was being used only for what it was intended for, he should have let her go at that.

 

[BiffRocko]

It seems to me that in this case they took his bag without his consent, and searched it without his consent, and charges should be dropped based on this alone.

That is exactly what happened.

 

[THE]

You're absolutely right. I misread the post that I quoted from you. I read it as "the officer had no right to question the OP about what the PV was and should have accepted her explanation". My apologies.

Nah, thanks for helping me clarify. I don't think you were alone. I think several others are even "skimming" my posts and coming to the same conclusion.

 

[THE]

Interesting read but I stopped on page 14. *laugh*

You know a lot of this could end if manufactures would design the mod’s so that they wouldn't be mistaken for any illegal devices. I feel this hurts vapor’s cause and only gives fuel to the FDA and others who wish to do away with vaping.

I'm sure too that us Vaping peeps have to be aware that people who use drugs could and will find a way to incorporate legal Vaping Devices for their illegal drug usage.

Education is the key, and it will be a long hard fought battle, and pissing off COPS isn’t going to help that cause at all. I say be polite, educate, yes your rights matter but when you get pulled over and you feel your rights are trampled on how many can seriously state that their demeanor will come across as polite, respectful and informative? No you will more than likely come across as an AHOLE.

A fine line here indeed.

Lera

But the manufacturers of these devices have to make them look "cool" and be marketable.. You know how it is, these days. I may be one of a very few, but I can indeed assert my rights without "rubbing them the wrong way".

When I have to, I politely let them know that I know what time it is, along with making sure that they know I'm doing my best to cooperate and be helpful.

If you're one of these loud mouthed I KNOW MY RIGHTS BLA BLA BLA ETC ETC ETC "Aholes" you're referring to, sure, it's definitely not going to go well. Saying you know your rights is kind of silly. I show that I know mine

 

[THE]

Anyway , my main point was that I think the manufactures could step up and design something that is more cohesive for us. It would behoove them to increase their customer base.

That's an exceedingly good idea because ALOT of people who vape do NOT want to "stand out" at all ..

 

[THE]

This is funny, my friend and I were just talking about this the other night. We were talking about a guy we knew who would totally find a way to use it for smoking something..... lol. We came to the conclusion that it would be very easy to use a PV for things other than what it's intended.

Like I said before, it makes sense that he pulled the OP over, but after she showed him her PV and took it apart, and he could plainly see it was being used only for what it was intended for, he should have let her go at that.

Absolutely, I've been trying to say just that, he knew once he examined the device that it was innocent. It should have ended there. Also like you said.

 

[RollTheBones]

Every American citizen needs to know the rights they have. It is possible to be polite yet firm when dealing with the police. This vid. and others like it changed my outlook on the entire situation; say and do as little as possible!

YouTube - Don't Talk to Cops, Part 1

 

[THE]

That is a good video.. The second part of it really hits home for me... can't really say why but Mr. Bruch is from somewhere very very close to one of my lady friends and it's an interesting story for another time. But that really is a good video. Especially if you hear what Mr. Bruch has to say.


This guy is pretty good, too
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nOMbfsgZ9s[/youtube]