Replace "Subohm" with "High Wattage"

[josho]

dna 20 mod. You could just run down a battery in a mech mod with a .8 or .9 coil and do the same.

mmmm... no.

did you catch pbusardo's review of the DNA20?

1) 10W @ .9ohms would require 3V... unless i'm mistaken somewhere it's a somewhat discouraged practice to drain your battery that far.
2) the DNA20 kinda fails at stepdown, if you put a .9ohm atty on your DNA20 and drop it to 10W and fire, the ohm logo will start flashing and the mod will just act as a passthrough for the battery and dump whatever voltage the battery is putting out. Unless of course, your battery has drained far enough to actually allow the DNA20 to step down. If you're on a .8ohm coil, i'd assume the battery drain would need to be even lower. But with a fresh battery, there's no way it's firing a sub-ohm at 10W. Here's where he discusses that. I made the link fast-forward to this specific subject A PBusardo Review - The DNA 20 - YouTube

 

[Mitey F]

dr g, it is obvious you have gotten yourself balls deep into an argument, realized you cannot win (and/or that you are wrong), but continue to fight because you do not want to ADMIT that you are wrong. I really cannot tell if you are just to prideful to admit your mistake/misunderstanding, too stubborn to quit arguing, or too stupid to realize you're wrong.

"Sub-ohm" means less than 1 ohm. Period. It is as precise and descriptive as you can possibly be. With today's current equipment, it has a very important role. Perhaps that will not be true in the future, but as of right now, at this point in time, it's EXTREMELY useful.

To suggest we use the term "high wattage" as opposed to "sub ohm" is akin to suggesting we discontinue use of the words "cotton", "hemp", "silica" and "mesh", referring to them only using the term "wick". Because after all, they all achieve the same goal, right? We should also quit saying "clearomizer", "cartomizer tank" and "cartridge", because really, they're all the same. You fill them with juice, connect it to a battery, and vaporize the contents.

I gotta get out of this conversation before your stubbornness rubs off on me. I'm bad enough already.

 

[dr g]

mmmm... no.

did you catch pbusardo's review of the DNA20?

1) 10W @ .9ohms would require 3V... unless i'm mistaken somewhere it's a somewhat discouraged practice to drain your battery that far.

You can go to about 3 but don't go much lower (loaded).

2) the DNA20 kinda fails at stepdown, if you put a .9ohm atty on your DNA20 and drop it to 10W and fire, the ohm logo will start flashing and the mod will just act as a passthrough for the battery and dump whatever voltage the battery is putting out. Here's where he discusses that. I made the link fast-forward to this specific subject A PBusardo Review - The DNA 20 - YouTube

I caught the fact that I actually own many DNA20 devices and use them regularly -- and thoroughly. They can step down as low as 2.9 volts.

dr g, it is obvious you have gotten yourself balls deep into an argument, realized you cannot win (and/or that you are wrong), but continue to fight because you do not want to ADMIT that you are wrong. I really cannot tell if you are just to prideful to admit your mistake/misunderstanding, too stubborn to quit arguing, or too stupid to realize you're wrong.

None of the above, I have said nothing incorrect. Well other than mixing up one post's author with another.

"Sub-ohm" means less than 1 ohm. Period. It is as precise and descriptive as you can possibly be. With today's current equipment, it has a very important role. Perhaps that will not be true in the future, but as of right now, at this point in time, it's EXTREMELY useful.

It has almost no role in my equipment so ...

I do dispute that it's actually useful in other equipment as well other than to determine wattage. The other details of the build are critical.

To suggest we use the term "high wattage" as opposed to "sub ohm" is akin to suggesting we discontinue use of the words "cotton", "hemp", "silica" and "mesh", referring to them only using the term "wick". Because after all, they all achieve the same goal, right? We should also quit saying "clearomizer", "cartomizer tank" and "cartridge", because really, they're all the same. You fill them with juice, connect it to a battery, and vaporize the contents.

No honest person would make this argument. In general use, and also as stated by people in this thread, "subohm" is intended to describe a style of vaping which includes high wattage and large coils. None of those other terms is used to describe as broad a swath of variables by implied meaning.

 

[JackSparrow]

What a useless thread.

I feel stupid for having read all this nonsense.

Sent via NSA Spy Satellite...

 

[BobC]

6 hours discussing absolutely nothing, I want some a what they're snorting

 

[Mad Scientist]

Wow, I turn my back on my thread for a day and a pack of wolves start in on dr. g. My intention in starting the thread was to try to find agreement that what we call subohm vaping now, with its implicit IMR lithium battery almost always in a mech with a particular result, is really just the result. As vaping evolves, that result will be achieved using different hardware not now in common use or some not yet invented (actually its not all that hard to achieve using what's already readily available with some basic understanding of how an atomizer really works). As that evolution takes place, the descriptor "subohm" is becomming meaningless (except to the apostles we have here).

Obviously there will be no such agreement. No worries. Call it as you like.

 

[t8kiteasy]

This thread has been a good laugh especially while i sit here vaping on my ELA with my Immortalizer on top with a sub ohm dual coil build at .5 ohms that is NOT going to stop????

 

[Mad Scientist]

Immortalizer with dual coils sounds good. I'm sitting here vaping an 8 ohm coil with clouds of vapor ... Almost can't see the keyboard. It's a converted toaster -- 1500 watts. I'm calling it the immortal mortalizer.

 

[ClippinWings]

thought of one more thing...

it's all perspective.

Dr G wants "Sub Ohm" replaced cause it carries no relevance to him... he cares about Watts not Ohms.

Meanwhile, for me(and I think most sub ohm vapers) Ohms are crucially important...
In fact, I worry far more about Ohms than watts...

Watts, to me, exist as kind of just a byproduct of the Ohms, Volts & Amps... its a curious afterthought and a nice "Wow, that's insane" number to throw out at people who don't understand mechanicals and sub-ohm vaping.

 

[Mad Scientist]

...
Watts, to me, exist as kind of just a byproduct of the Ohms, Volts & Amps... its a curious afterthought and a nice "Wow, that's insane" number to throw out at people who don't understand mechanicals and sub-ohm vaping.

Yeah, the irony of the curious afterthought of the unit of power byproduct that us folks who must not really understand seem so interested in lol.

 

[ClippinWings]

Yeah, the irony of the curious afterthought of the unit of power byproduct that us folks who must not really understand seem so interested in lol.

well no, that's just ignorant.

Look...

Mechanical/sub-ohm:
Adjust Ohms to allow limited Volts to produce more vapor & stay within a safe Amperage. This generates a Wattage of some kind.

VV:
Adjust Volatge to produce the desired Wattage based on the Ohms. Staying within the Amp limits of the device

VW:
Adjust the Wattage, the device will calculate Voltage based on measured Ohms automatically. Staying within the Amp limits of the device.

Notice the order of the items... it's not coincidence that you value Wattage over Ohms... and We don't.

 

[dr g]

well no, that's just ignorant.

Look...

Mechanical/sub-ohm:
Adjust Ohms to allow limited volts to produce more vapor & stay within a safe Amperage. This generates a Wattage of some kind

This means wattage, so this is disingenuous.

 

[st0nedpenguin]

Always clutching those straws.

PS: No it doesn't.

 

[Aal_]

wattage does not mean anything on its own. The only things that matter are heat and surface area. 20 watts on 26ga is not the same as 20 watts on 32ga and definitely not the same as 20 watts on a silver wire. resistivity/conductivity in the wire will decide the heat, space you have in the atomizer will decide the surface area. 'nuff said or what?

 

[Mad Scientist]

wattage does not mean anything on its own. The only things that matter are heat and surface area. 20 watts on 26ga is not the same as 20 watts on 32ga and definitely not the same as 20 watts on a silver wire. resistivity/conductivity in the wire will decide the heat, space you have in the atomizer will decide the surface area. 'nuff said or what?

Round and round we go. 20 watts on 28 AWG on silica is not the same as 20 watts on 28 AWG on SS mesh. And neither will perform the same at different rates of airflow and in addition . . . There's plenty more to say.

If wattage means nothing on it's own, you've made my point. Resistance really means nothing on its own.

 

[Mad Scientist]

well no, that's just ignorant.

Look...

Mechanical/sub-ohm:
Adjust Ohms to allow limited Volts to produce more vapor & stay within a safe Amperage. This generates a Wattage of some kind.

VV:
Adjust Volatge to produce the desired Wattage based on the Ohms. Staying within the Amp limits of the device

VW:
Adjust the Wattage, the device will calculate Voltage based on measured Ohms automatically. Staying within the Amp limits of the device.

Notice the order of the items... it's not coincidence that you value Wattage over Ohms... and We don't.

You're still thinking small every time you say "within the limits of the device" or "safe." Limits of what device and safe for what? Implicit in what you're saying is the limits of what's now commonly used that wont be the same in a year, or less.

All of what you have said are simply the relationships in two simple equations with four variables ( E=IR and W=EI ). Basic algebra allows solving for all if any two are known. There is no order of items. You order the items based on your frame of reference that you explicitly state: mech vs vv vs vw, My frame of reference is device independent. When I have what I am after in terms of performance, I will make the portable power source that delivers it.

I don't value one variable over another but I do envision the mech with an IMR in it going the way of the buggy whip. Interesting historical footnote but something better is on the horizon.

Maybe make a place for them in the museum next to the blue foam (lol).

 

[dr g]

wattage does not mean anything on its own.

Running a high wattage through a device actually does suggest a certain type of coil and atomizer build, so it is more meaningful than you credit it with being. If you have a 32 gauge coil capable of handling 20 watts, it will perform closer to a 26 gauge coil than you think.

Earlier I suggested another descriptive option. Seems no one caught it.

 

[st0nedpenguin]

Earlier I suggested another descriptive option. Seems no one caught it.

I think it's more a case of nobody caring.

We use sub ohm to describe coils that are...sub ohm.

There's no need outside of dead horse beating to even attempt to change that.

 

[Aal_]

Round and round we go. 20 watts on 28 AWG on silica is not the same as 20 watts on 28 AWG on SS mesh. And neither will perform the same at different rates of airflow and in addition . . . There's plenty more to say.

If wattage means nothing on it's own, you've made my point. Resistance really means nothing on its own.

Well yeah forgot about the medium and airflow but these contribute to the heating variable. Regarding resistance on its own, it is also right, that is why i didn't mention it myself.

 

[ClippinWings]

This means wattage, so this is disingenuous.

Way to ignore the point.

But just for the sake of clarity... You are incorrect... Wattage is a numerical representation of power... Vapor production is a physical thing created by a combination of things; power, wicking, heat, etc.

Sent from my mobile, using Tapatalk... so ignore the typos.